Reliability of new stock old school meters

[Paul Howell]

I have a box of old meters, selenium, CdS, Silicon Blue, wide angle, narrow angle, and spot. When I last tested all of the meters of the 4 Weston IIs 2 were bad, no function at all. I tested them maybe 2 years before that, the 2 remaining were fine with a 1/2 stop. I have Weston Master IV, it is spot on. My Weston Ranger 9s are battery operated, narrower field, 30%, needs 2 Winair batteries, hearing aid batteries do not fit well even with rubber O rings added. I have a Miranda narrow field, 9 degrees or so, it works with hearing aid batteries. My Gossen sbc has a analog read out that was modified by Zone 6 Studies, has a zone scale on it, I don't bother with the zone scale, very accurate, but has a LED match readout to find the correct exposure, hard to use with one hand. Also a Gossen Pilot, later model made in Japan, works really well in decent lighting. I have a Soligor Spot meter, on it is last legs, very jumpy, not sure why, had been rock solid for years. Also in play are a couple of GE meters finicky to use but accurate. The problem with using any of these meters is all are old, will go south, and only Gossen SBC is good at low light.

 

[hap]

A hard sided replacement for the soft sided case made a big difference for me - and the included pouch provides a space for the (relatively tiny and cheap) backup battery.

I meant batteries eaten up in my Digiflash (not the 2). The damn thing never goes to sleep. Keep it in it's pouch so no light but that doesn't seem to change anything.

 

[MattKing]

Mine is a Digiflash as well.
And the LCD display never turns off - by design - but that isn't where the drain happens.
Those LCD displays use almost no battery power.
The battery drain happens when the meter takes readings - when buttons are inadvertently pushed.
The hard sided case helps avoid that.

 

[Sirius Glass]

"Used"?

Correct, used

 

[Radost]

Correct, used

Not using anymore? Did it stop working?

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Not using anymore? Did it stop working?

Slava Ukraini!

 

[Sirius Glass]

Not using anymore? Did it stop working?

I sold the Gossen Luna Pro SBC because I need a better spot meter, replacing it with a Pentax Digital Spot Meter.

 

[DREW WILEY]

My last acquired Pentax Digital Spotmeter cost me $200, and it showed no signs of use at all. A lucky find. My first one of those has had a pretty hard life, and is held together with tape, but still reads perfectly. It was recalibrated only once in its 45 year usage span. And I have always kept a virtually new unit in reserve to check my others by; there is no battery in it unless I'm performing such a test. All of mine are remarkably consistent. I also had a Minolta Spotmeter F which read identically to the Pentax units; but I prefer the simplified reading of the Pentax model.

I do have a couple ancient meters laying around - one selenium, the other Cds - more as conversation pieces rather than for realistic use.

 

[Patrick Robert James]

My favorite small meter is the Gossen Digisix/Luno Pro Digital line of meters. Nice and flat. Smaller than a t-shirt pocket.

Overall my favorite meter is the Gossen Luna Pro SBC. It is rather large though so I don't use it much, but it is a pleasure to use.

I also have a Pentax Digital Spotmeter a good friend gave me which is nice. I prefer dials on things vs. electronic readouts. I owned a Minolta Spotmeter years ago and it was nice but the digital readout kind of made it a pain. I ended up giving it to a friend. I also used to have a Sekonic 508 but that was just too big, and again, digital readout. That one I lost to a leaky battery, which Duracell to their credit replaced.

I also have a Sekonic L-358 I use for a flash meter

Naturally I have a bunch of old meters like a Weston Master IV and a Zeiss Ikophot?. I think they are fun to use. Last I checked the Weston was still accurate. Zeiss, not so much. When I use those I kind of take their readings as a "suggestion."

 

[Besk]

Mine eat batteries.

Mine ate batteries. Sent it back for repair twice. All they did give me new batteries. It is in a box somewhere.
Only Gossen meter that let me down.

 

[Bill Burk]

I’ve been carrying an old gray Gossen Luna Pro converted with a voltage regulator. It sucks that we can’t have mercury batteries (even if we promise to be environmentally responsible with them) because they are a reference source of accuracy

 

[Bill Burk]

The last couple years has been an exercise in futility as I have tried to calibrate Weston Master II meters.

One problem: Color temperature of calibration source. The one I use, based on a Beseler enlarger bulb, changes with intensity (unless I stand up a Micky Mouse jig).

Some of my best example Weston Master II meters read nearly 32 footcandles when 32 footcandles is shone through a frosted screen directly in contact with the bubble lenses of the selenium cell part of the meter.

But I haven’t gotten a reliable 32 at 32 at 4700-degrees K. I really want a circuit to amplify the cell output enough to deflect the needle to 50 at 32 so that I could calibrate down.

A sleeper is the Weston Master 6. They often come in a little under 32 for 32 with a little calibration room (there’s a potentiometer) that almost makes it when turned up to max.

The past couple weeks the kids are helping me clear space so that I can have a desk separated from the darkroom where I can do the meter calibration work.

I haven’t been able to get in the darkroom for two years! Things just keep getting put on the sink.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

It sucks that we can’t have mercury batteries

Or you could simply use a meter without a battery, like the many descendents of the old Norwood Director meters. I still use the Sekonic L-28C. Great build. Intuitive to use. No battery. Fits easily in a pocket. I've gone through a number over the years but never once found one to be less than accurate.

Sekonic L-28 - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia

camera-wiki.org

 

[Bill Burk]

Or you could simply use a meter without a battery, like the many descendents of the old Norwood Director meters. I still use the Sekonic L-28C. Great build. Intuitive to use. No battery. Fits easily in a pocket. I've gone through a number over the years but never once found one to be less than accurate.

Sekonic L-28 - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia

camera-wiki.org

I've got one of those L-28's and it is good. I use the slide inserts to attenuate the light source in 1/3 stop increments as part of the Micky Mouse jig.

But selenium cells have a spectral response that's different from film to consider. Significant enough that you need different exposure indexes for tungsten and daylight because the red in tungsten gives exaggerated readings.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

you need different exposure indexes for tungsten and daylight

I wouldn't know. I shoot strictly with available daylight.

 

[Kodachromeguy]

Or you could simply use a meter without a battery, like the many descendents of the old Norwood Director meters. I still use the Sekonic L-28C. Great build. Intuitive to use. No battery. Fits easily in a pocket. I've gone through a number over the years but never once found one to be less than accurate.

Sekonic L-28 - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia

camera-wiki.org

These L_28 meters are getting up in age. The sensor is selenium, I assume. You have had good luck with them? Sekonic must have sealed the cell and the connections well.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

These L_28 meters are getting up in age. The sensor is selenium, I assume. You have had good luck with them? Sekonic must have sealed the cell and the connections well.

I've gone through over a dozen in the past 20+ years. (Mostly because my wife borrows and loses mine -- I stock up with extras whenever I find cheap ones on eBay.) I've never had a problem with dead or erratic cells. There are a number of other Sekonic models that copy the old Directors -- the L-28C2 and L-398, for example. All great meters.

 

[Bill Burk]

I wouldn't know. I shoot strictly with available daylight.

I do some indoors available light

Tungsten is harder to find these days too

 

[Bill Burk]

These L_28 meters are getting up in age. The sensor is selenium, I assume. You have had good luck with them? Sekonic must have sealed the cell and the connections well.

Yes it might be that they are aimed at the light, incident reading, so they do not need to be as sensitive

 

[Kodachromeguy]

Yes it might be that they are aimed at the light, incident reading, so they do not need to be as sensitive

You misunderstood me. I meant that the selenium cell was protected with lacquer or varnish to prevent corrosion or oxidation. And the soldered connections were well done, as well. As for sensitivity, no selenium meter is especially responsive at low light. But at least these L_28 and 398 meters had a decent diameter cell. The Contarex Bullseye was cursed with a cell much too small for its intended use. How did the designers miss this flaw?

My problem with the L_28 meter is the tiny font size on the dial. I need to put on my reading glasses. So I am using digital meters, like the Luna Pro Digital, with big numbers in the display.

 

[Bill Burk]

The Weston II and III are particularly well sealed and connected. They use a copper ring with tabs all around to brush the front surface of the cell which has quarter diameter solder pads just inside the edge there’s a fiber ring to prevent shorts to the edge.

I really don’t know why some selenium cells die and others live. Shellac sure doesn’t help. There’s a thin layer of about 1 atom of gold on the surface that I think breaks too easily. There could be internal corrosion.

Some batches and some manufacturers do a better job making a robust cell. I particularly like Weston cells that show the “W” logo.

The Weston Master V doesn’t seal the cell compartment at all. That could be why so many of them fail.

 

[eli griggs]

The Weston II and III are particularly well sealed and connected. They use a copper ring with tabs all around to brush the front surface of the cell which has quarter diameter solder pads just inside the edge there’s a fiber ring to prevent shorts to the edge.

I really don’t know why some selenium cells die and others live. Shellac sure doesn’t help. There’s a thin layer of about 1 atom of gold on the surface that I think breaks too easily. There could be internal corrosion.

Some batches and some manufacturers do a better job making a robust cell. I particularly like Weston cells that show the “W” logo.

The Weston Master V doesn’t seal the cell compartment at all. That could be why so many of them fail.

I have two well working Master V's, one from N.J. and the other from England, serviced by George at Quality Light & Metric a few years back and a third Master V and two or three Master IV's that need work.

My understanding is the Selenium cells need an dry environment or moisture will kill the cells.

They, like all Selenium cells, need to be put out in the Sunlight, cells uncovered, because the Sunlight will help keep off oxides that dim performance or actually help remove some of this obscuring buildup.

I've also, for some time now, read that the wires that connects the cells to the body are very easily corroded, and that a good wrap of conducting duel sided copper tape with one conducting adhesive tape will bridge the gap created by the wire corrosion and get the meter back into operation in many cases.

With my work room being too difficult to get to these days, it'll be a while before I am able to get in there to try this out.

To be continued.....

 

[eli griggs]

To continue, I also have a tin of other old meters, GE, Master, Seconic, Gossin Lunar pro, Pentax V spot, a user, Luna Pro F, another user, etc and the two working Master V's l, with intercone's that are always in my bags.

In the past I also had a Minolta M spotmeter, Minolta F spotmeter, Minolta Colour meter and a IV, studio ambient and flash meter.

A basic Vivitar meter that worked well and I trusted Canon F, FD series camera meters, etc.

I liked the Minolta Meters so well, I'd be happy to find good ones for use, as back ups to the Master's and Pentax Spotmeter, but I really don't have serious complaints about my current selection.

Cheers.

 

[Bill Burk]

Dry conditions are helpful. I have proven that opening to a moist (coastal) environment degrades the cells. My current approach is to leave them sealed. Many times the corrosion or broken connection is outside the sealed chamber. And often dust can be cleaned from the core or magnet

 

[eli griggs]

With some acceptance of the possibility of misadventure, perhaps you can try to use a small vacuum hand or mechanical pump, on a sealing vacuum jar, filled half way up with good sodium silicates to pull out as much moisture as possible from a Weston V meter, over several days, and prepare a large, dulled, not pointed needle syringe, with a good quality adhering, clear silicon gel and then, when you feel you've removed as much moisture out of the vacuum jar, pop the seal and run beads of silicon at all joints and cross connections, including the glass and selenium window, non-twisting button, etc and put it back under vacuum and until it's fully cleared of moisture, as best you are able to make it.