Pyrocat HD

[edtbjon]

Leon, as you are using the softest possible filter (#00), which is way below #3 there will be highlight compensation. Now, if the picture as such needs a lot of #5, this will blow away some of the highlight compensation, but as this higher contrast is most often needed in the shadows, you can dodge e.g. the sky while using the #5 filter.
There's the "magic" of highlight compensation with pyro/catechol and then there's the "magic" of split grade printing. Gaining the very best from them both takes some getting used to, but the "magic" is really only a matter of practicing, comparing and keeping notes along the way. Also, both pyro and split-grade can be used for most pictures/prints, but e.g. split-grade is at its best when you have a difficult negative, not for that print which already "prints itself" lovely on grade 2 from the very beginning.

//Björn

 

[Leon]

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[sanking]

Does not sound like a silly question to me -- just one that I don't know how to answer. Although I have read a lot about split grade printing I have never actually used it in my own work, or in testing films and papers. Les McClean, whose opinion I respect a lot, teaches it in his workshops, and Les has also printed a lot with pyro stained negatives so he would be a good person to ask this question.

Sandy King

hope this doesn't sound like too much of a silly question ... but how does split grade printing fit in with this? Would it be possible to get the benefit of the catechol highlight-effect by printing at a lower grade specifically for highlight gradation/ local contrast (as opposed to the usual grade 0 or 00 for the lightest highlight only with traditional split grade) whilst ignoring the shadows, then using a grade 5 to set the global contrast to where it is wanted?

 

[Leon]

the more I think about it ... the more it still points towards needing the extra development to increase the negative contrast and hence using a softer notional grade in printing. If I split grade a lower contrast neg, I will need more hard exposure to get it "right" - and that hard exposure would affect the lighter tones in the print ... whereas a longer tonal range will need less hard grade exposure and not alter the highlight tones so much .... I suppose I was asking if the use of the soft grade in split grade printing would "hold" the beneficial characteristics of the catechol stain, but hadnt given much thought to the effect the hard grade then has on the subtle contrasts within the highlights. When I print my pryocat negs, I tend to start with a soft grade - typically around grade 1 and I dont just look at the lightest highlight, as I would do in classic split grade (using 00 and 5), I look at the soft gradations within the highlights - I then use the grade 5 to sort out the shadows, but only use enough so as not to interrupt the softer tones. I was wondering if this might be a way around increasing contrast in a catechol stained neg, but not losing the beneficial compensation in the highlights .... but in a circular argument with myself, I've decided it works for me because my negs are quite contrasty, so would probably straight print at around grade 1 1/2 - 2 any way.

 

[nworth]

The compensation Sandy mentions with VC papers is accompanied by a reduction in contrast in the more highly stained area. In practice, I have found the affect to be mild and not a problem. You might have to work on the clouds a bit, burning them in and/or printing them at higher contrast, but probably not. You can use a mildly acid fixer, like F-34, with Pyrocat-HD; I have no experience using it with more acid fixers. If you are going to buy or mix new fixer for the project, go with the alkaline stuff, like TF-4. Pyrocat-HD will not give you the emulsion speed that D-76 does, and rating the film at 2/3 stop below the ISO speed is probably a good idea. The stain from Pyrocat-HD is not extraordinary to the eye, but it is quite effective.

 

[Ian Grant]

Leon, I've found my Pyrocat HD negs print very well on VC Fibre papers, and on the odd occasion when I've used split-grade printing there's been no real difference to a similar negative processed in Xtol or Rodinal.

A fixer like Hypam is fine with Pyrocat, the pH is 5-5.5 which isn't particularly acidic, there's no loss of stain.

Ian

 

[Leon]

The compensation Sandy mentions with VC papers is accompanied by a reduction in contrast in the more highly stained area.

I've always found that, to my eye, catechol stained negs retain much more contrast in the highlights and are therefore easier to obtain subtle gradation compared to non stained negs.

Leon, I've found my Pyrocat HD negs print very well on VC Fibre papers, and on the odd occasion when I've used split-grade printing there's been no real difference to a similar negative processed in Xtol or Rodinal.

Ian - I'm glad you've had success with it. I tend to find printing catechol stained negs much "easier" than non stained versions (split or straight grade). They seem to just have "something" that is missing in the other. Now there's a statement to irritate the empirically minded

 

[Ian Grant]

I tend to find printing catechol stained negs much "easier" than non stained versions (split or straight grade). They seem to just have "something" that is missing in the other. Now there's a statement to irritate the empirically minded

I think a lot of people would agree with you, but most pyro devs are like that. There's a tonality that makes the negatives a real pleasure to print.

Ian

 

[kaiyen]

back to fixers...which fixers are "slightly acidic?" I have been using Ilford Rapid but am now worried it's too acidic. Other than I think Acros I haven't gotten much stain so far, but have also been told (I think on apug) that the stain isn't nec. dramatic on many emulsions.

 

[Ian Grant]

Ilford Rapid fixer is very similar to Hypam, again it's pH is 5-5,5 so it's fine with Pyrocat. Technically Fixers with a pH of 5-8 are sometimes called neutral fixers.

Stain does vary significantly between films Forte 200 seemed to give the most noticeable.

Ian

 

[kaiyen]

Thanks Ian. Just checking. If I'm going to use Pyrocat, might as well make sure I'm getting the most out of it.