Pentax announces that they're working on new film cameras!

[Sirius Glass]

If anyone wants a Mju type camera, but is scared off by the goofy prices, the Nikon AF600/Lite Touch 600 is an excellent alternative.
It has a fixed 28mm 3.5 lens which is wikked sharp.
I've owned both the Mju (original 3.5 version) and the AF600, and much prefer the AF600. I just get better pics out of it.
About $100 for a very nice one, just be patient and ignore the Japanese ebay sellers. The AF600 often appears on the US ebay site.

Too wide. Some of use prefer no wider than 35mm. Nikon made a few good ones.

My Pentax is a 38-120mm with world class optics ($10).

Never owned a 35, I jump between the 40 and the 28

Many people including myself find that the difference between 35mm and 50mm is too small. Hence more people prefer the 28mm lens over the 35mm lens. Of course since zoom lenses have become so inexpensive and have a high quality, the question is becoming moot.

 

[markjwyatt]

Many people including myself find that the difference between 35mm and 50mm is too small. Hence more people prefer the 28mm lens over the 35mm lens. Of course since zoom lenses have become so inexpensive and have a high quality, the question is becoming moot.

Sometimes I feel a 35mm is a better "normal lens" than a 50mm (for 35mm film). This is not based on theoretical definitions, but just based on usage, and my preferences. I just like a little wider view sometimes. My wide angle is 21mm (on a rangefinder).

 

[pentaxuser]

hope Pentax is working on a medium format film camera

Not sure when the P645Nii ceased to be produced( introduced 2001 from what I can find out) but I'd have thought that it was recent enough for some Pentax engineers who worked on it to still be there and surely the drawings etc would still exist

So the real question is not: Can Pentax do it but would the demand for it make production profitable. I'd have thought that it is the above question that is relevant to the production or revival of production for a lot of film cameras

It's a bit like the classic interview question said to be asked of potential graduate management trainees at Ford

From the exec to the interviewee: "Tell me what Ford does in a sentence "?

Some interviewees might say: "It makes vehicles" The astute ones say: "It makes vehicles for profit" and thereby warming the "cockles of the Ford execs' hearts" and getting the job

pentaxuser

 

[albireo]

I prefer optical printing and slide projection because of the superior quality.

Film has so much to offer. And I don't want to be limited by the used imaging chain.

Apologies everyone for the OT - my last post on this subject

If by 'superior quality' you mean a subjectively pleasurable visual impact given by a set of strong non linear transformations caused by the pair [enlarger, paper] then enjoy. After all, people do enjoy music on vinyl even if, or perhaps because of, the strong harmonic distortions added, which may give a subjectively pleasant quality to the music for some listeners. I like vinyl.

If on the other hand by 'superior quality' you mean objectively, measurably more faithful representation of the signal in the negative, I'm afraid you're completely wrong, and digital scanning 'limits' you only to the extent of your own technical limitations: you are limited by your incomplete understanding of the digitalisation process, and not by the digitalisation itself (which you in fact referred to earlier as 'magic').

However, as stated I won't derail this nice thread to discuss this any further. Do what makes you happy!

 

[Huss]

Looking at the fixed focal length P&S cameras (i.e. cameras with AF not zone/manual focus) that I currently use, all have 28mm lenses. Fuji Klasse W, Nikon AF600, Fuji Work Record (x2). These also tend to be the most recently made P&S cameras, with the Klasse being the last of the lux P&S.
Fuji made two versions of the last itineration of the Klasse - the W and the S. The W had the 28mm lens, the S had the 38mm. Fuji made way more W than S versions because even back then they saw the 28mm lens was more popular.
The Pentax Espio Mini had a 32mm lens, so it will be interesting to see what Pentax decides upon if/when they release a new version.

 

[Cholentpot]

Many people including myself find that the difference between 35mm and 50mm is too small. Hence more people prefer the 28mm lens over the 35mm lens. Of course since zoom lenses have become so inexpensive and have a high quality, the question is becoming moot.

I used to think this way until I started using a 35mm or point and shoots with fixed 35mm lenses.

35mm is best normal lens, possibly best walk around. 50mm is better for that shallow depth of field look, I'll use 50mm in low light but 35mm for everyday walk around.

 

[koraks]

Film has so much to offer. And I don't want to be limited by the used imaging chain.

One is ALWAYS limited to elements of the imaging chain. Truly unlimited way of expression exists within the human mind - and even that has its limitations.

But, let's not delve into this deeper, as it makes any technical discussion moot. I concur with @albireo:

Do what makes you happy!

Or, perhaps somewhat cynically: do what appeases you.

 

[MattKing]

Let's avoid moderator intervention - no digital vs. analogue please.
But yes, it is correct that one should use one's choice of workflow when one is analyzing the suitability of anything one intends to use in it.

 

[Film-Niko]

If by 'superior quality' you mean a subjectively pleasurable visual impact given by a set of strong non linear transformations caused by the pair [enlarger, paper] then enjoy.

No, I don't mean at all any subjective impression. I am talking about real properly done technical tests. With resolution charts and also fine-detailed images.
And direct 1:1 comparisons of the optical imaging chain vs. hybrid imaging chain.
Technical tests have been part of my jobs, so I am experienced in that stuff.

If on the other hand by 'superior quality' you mean objectively, measurably more faithful representation of the signal in the negative, I'm afraid you're completely wrong, and digital scanning 'limits' you only to the extent of your own technical limitations: you are limited by your incomplete understanding of the digitalisation process, and not by the digitalisation itself (which you in fact referred to earlier as 'magic').

So, you say that I am - quote - "limited by incomplete understanding"?
No, the complete opposite: Because of my technical knowledge I am able to go even to the real limits of the methods, and can exploite their full potential. Therefore I have got the best possible results from scans with the Coolscan.
The test results tell the whole story. With several ISO 50-100 BW films I've got 120-130 lp/mm in the optical imaging chain, and 60-65 lp/mm with the Coolscan.
How about your test results? Or have you never done sophisticated comparison tests of both imaging chains?

@koraks :
Yes, there are always losses in the imaging chain, but they are very small in the optical chain, and much bigger in the hybrid chain. That was my point.

I hope you moderaters are fair enough that this (above) final reply by me to the allegations against me is allowed. Thank you!

But back to topic:
Possible focal lenght(s) for future Pentax compact camera(s):
High-end compact market:
The former Ricoh GR1v had a 28mm lens, if I remember right. It was very successful. But i would not be surprised if the market is big enough to have a second version as well, with a 40 or 45mm lens.
And for the cheaper AF compact:
The 35mm focal length has been extremely successful on the market in the past, and also today, as the huge demand for Mju-II, T4 etc. indicates.
But the demand for compacts with zoom lenses is also strongly increasing. So in the future another compact with an 28-80/90mm zoom lens would also be possible. At least from the demand side.

 

[koraks]

I hope you moderaters are fair enough that this (above) final reply by me to the allegations against me is allowed. Thank you!

Well, if you must. But do understand the way posts are formulated plays a role in triggering these supposed 'allegations'. Consider meditating on that for a second one of these days. Thank you.

Having said that, that post really was the last analog vs hybrid/digital one. Any further attempts to continue that avenue of the discussion will result in posts being deleted.

 

[miha]

Any idea on how much a brand new Olympus XA -like camera would go for these days?

 

[4season]

Manual focus, manual film advance might be a good starting point. Who knows whether film-compatible autofocus components are currently available.

 

[George Mann]

Therefore it is very important as a film photographer to judge these lenses by using them with film, and making optical prints or projection.

I mostly shoot slide film, mainly with my Nikkor 50mm f2 Ai, and view it thru a loupe.

Yes, different modern lenses render distinctly from one another, but they tend toward a colder, more sterile rendition that I don't particularly care for.

My Nikkor provides me with the best combination of stellar world class performance, with just enough warmth to satisfy.

 

[KerrKid]

If Pentax is building a entry-level P&S, they better make sure it can take selfies.

 

[Agulliver]

If Pentax is building a entry-level P&S, they better make sure it can take selfies.

That also does not appear to be what "the kids" are doing with film cameras.

I think a lot of folk here are missing the point. This isn't aimed at us. THough a handful of us might end up buying one. This isn't aimed at people shooting fine quality artistic slides on Provia, or people who want f1.4 lenses on a tripod in the woods after midnight....it's aimed at the hoards buying Mju and similar P&S cameras. That's where the volume and money is.

 

[KerrKid]

That also does not appear to be what "the kids" are doing with film cameras.

I think a lot of folk here are missing the point. This isn't aimed at us. THough a handful of us might end up buying one. This isn't aimed at people shooting fine quality artistic slides on Provia, or people who want f1.4 lenses on a tripod in the woods after midnight....it's aimed at the hoards buying Mju and similar P&S cameras. That's where the volume and money is.

I’m clearly in their target demographic and own several of their P&S’s already.

So…I hope the new P&S will allow selfies. All it needs is a timer, a lens that will focus closely, and a camera body that is easy to hold one-handed. Or offer a selfie stick for it with an integrated shutter release.

 

[ant!]

All it needs is a timer, a lens that will focus closely, and a camera body that is easy to hold one-handed. Or offer a selfie stick for it with an integrated shutter release.

While I am not a selfie person: The Instax cameras (or at least the one SQ6 I own) have a "selfie mirror" next to the lens. Not super useful, but I guess to get a rough idea where to aim it could be used...

 

[Film-Niko]

I mostly shoot slide film, mainly with my Nikkor 50mm f2 Ai, and view it thru a loupe.

Thanks, very interesting, because I also use a lot of reversal film, using a loupe and projection.
And I have used over the time almost all 50mm Nikkor lenses.

Yes, different modern lenses render distinctly from one another, but they tend toward a colder, more sterile rendition that I don't particularly care for.

My Nikkor provides me with the best combination of stellar world class performance, with just enough warmth to satisfy.

I can understand your preference for a certain kind of "warmth". I feel similar.
Concerning the "warmth" you are talking about: I've found that especially the Zeiss Milvus lenses perform much better in that regard than the Nikkors.
The Zeiss lenses in general have a very pleasing, a bit warmer color rendition than the Nikkors. Because of the lens coating Zeiss is using, and this color rendition matches color reversal film extremely well.
The Zeiss Milvus 1.4/50 and 2.0/50 also have a nicer, more smooth bokeh than the 50mm Nikkors, and an excellent transition from focussed to out-of focus areas. That in combination with the excellent micro-contrast of the Zeiss lenses results in a kind of better three dimensional impression of the subject. And that is very obvious with slides under a loupe, and in projection.

But back to Pentax:
Pentax had in the last years introduced the FA* HD premium lenses for 35mm format, with KAF4 standard. I had the chance to use it (given by a friend and Pentax expert). Outstanding performance!
Problem currently for film users: KAF4 is not fully compatible with former Pentax film cameras, because of the electronic aperture control (its the same problem as with latest Nikkor E lenses for F mount). You cannot stop down, therefore used the 1.4/50 and 1.4/85 at 1.4 on film: Amazing results!
So a future new Pentax AF film SLR with KAF4 compatability would be a dream come true, delivering amazing picture quality.

 

[Film-Niko]

While I am not a selfie person: The Instax cameras (or at least the one SQ6 I own) have a "selfie mirror" next to the lens. Not super useful, but I guess to get a rough idea where to aim it could be used...

I've used the selfie-mirror on the front of the Instax SQ6, and it indeed worked very well!
Such mirror on the front next to the lens would be indeed a nice feature for the planned plastic AF compact camera.
And that is a feature which could be extremely easy implemented at negligible costs.

 

[Cholentpot]

I've used the selfie-mirror on the front of the Instax SQ6, and it indeed worked very well!
Such mirror on the front next to the lens would be indeed a nice feature for the planned plastic AF compact camera.
And that is a feature which could be extremely easy implemented at negligible costs.

They'd just have to make sure the camera has a close minimum focus. Not the standard 3.2 feet or whatever it is.

 

[Sirius Glass]

They'd just have to make sure the camera has a close minimum focus. Not the standard 3.2 feet or whatever it is.

That is an optics issue based on the design. Most people are not interested in taking photographs of flowers or what they are eating at the moment to show on Instagram. Smart phone take care of that market.

 

[Cholentpot]

That is an optics issue based on the design. Most people are not interested in taking photographs of flowers or what they are eating at the moment to show on Instagram. Smart phone take care of that market.

Selfie needs close focus though. And most people at some point are interested in a selfie.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Selfie needs close focus though. And most people at some point are interested in a selfie.

Frankly, I do not care about selfies. I for one know what I look like and so does my friends and family.

 

[Film-Niko]

They'd just have to make sure the camera has a close minimum focus. Not the standard 3.2 feet or whatever it is.

Yashica T4 / T5 have a close focussing distance of only 35cm for example.
But I can ensure you that the selfie-mirror on the SQ6 is really very helpful as you can position the camera precisely so that your face is exactly in the middle of the frame (or at any other position in the frame you want it to be ).
If you only hold the camera in front of you without any control option (like the mirror), it can happen quite easily that you tilt or shift the camera and your face won't be anymore in the position of the frame you want it to be.

 

[Huss]

That is an optics issue based on the design. Most people are not interested in taking photographs of flowers or what they are eating at the moment to show on Instagram. Smart phone take care of that market.

Pretty much every single one of my P&S cameras has a macro setting. They've had this for years now. So selfies are no issue.