Pentax 645n vs 645nii

[tomfrh]

im tossing up between these two. The major difference appears to be MLU.

Is having MLU worth it? Or is it in fact true that they dont suffer from mirror slap in the first place.

 

[choiliefan]

The 645NII seems a more refined camera to me. Only drawback I can think of with the NII is the rarity of accessory cable releases. The NII uses a proprietary release that it shares with the 35mm Pentax MZ-S and no other cameras I'm aware of.

 

[Ian Grant]

The mirror lock is very useful and helps improve sharpness significantly with MF slrs used on a tripod.

Ian

 

[Lars Holte]

The 645NII seems a more refined camera to me. Only drawback I can think of with the NII is the rarity of accessory cable releases. The NII uses a proprietary release that it shares with the 35mm Pentax MZ-S and no other cameras I'm aware of.

True, but you can still use a regular threaded shutter release in the shutter button (on both models).
Both models imprint exposure data and more on the film for each frame. These data are more extensive (but smaller and therefore harder to read) on the N II.
The 645N II has 'half speed steps in M and Tv': "The shutter speed dial between 1/1000 and 4 S can be set to half step by pressing the up/down button. The set shutter speed will be displayed in the LCD panel and in the viewfinder".
This could be of interest for those who shoot mostly color landscapes on slide film.

As to the original question - the mirror slap is so gentle that there is hardly any need for MLU, but discerning landscape shooters may think otherwise. YMMV

More info can be found here: http://www.pentaxforums.com/camerareviews/pentax-645-medium-format-c3.html

 

[baachitraka]

I don't know if it is your first medium format camera I may look for a nice 6x7 II.

 

[adelorenzo]

I owned both, the MLU was nice the odd time I was on tripod but I almost alway was shooting handheld. Otherwise I didn't find any real difference in features.

The remote is definitely a consideration. You can't even give away remotes for the 645N (anyone want mine?) whereas I never once saw the correct remote for sale for the NII.

The big thing with the 645NII I that they are newer. As these cameras get older and impossible to repair, it might be worth the extra bucks for a newer camera.

 

[Alan Gales]

I've owned both plus the original model. Pentax always claimed that the mirror was so well dampened that a lock-up was not necessary but finally caved to public demand. I couldn't see a difference with the lock-up but I didn't blow anything up larger than 11X14. Plenty of other people have said that the mirror lock-up on the Nll was not necessary.

Today, I have two problems with the Pentax 645N and Nll cameras. One is that the release of the Pentax 645D cameras have really driven up the price of the FA lenses. The other problem is the same that adelorenzo mentioned about the electronics getting old.

You might take a look at the Mamiya 645 cameras. I think they are still making one that takes film and digital backs.

 

[tomfrh]

I should have mentioned I have a 645n and lenses already.

I'm looking to replace the body because the electronics are malfunctioning a bit.

Timer no longer works, nor manual shutter speeds below 1/15.

In fairness to Pentax these electronic faults did show up after I dropped the camera some distance onto a concrete pavement...

 

[Poisson Du Jour]

I should have mentioned I have a 645n and lenses already.

I'm looking to replace the body because the electronics are malfunctioning a bit.

Timer no longer works, nor manual shutter speeds below 1/15.

In fairness to Pentax these electronic faults did show up after I dropped the camera some distance onto a concrete pavement...

You will find that the older the bigger MF Pentax cameras are, the more common age-related faults are (not restricted to any format); e.g. with the 6x7 cameras (the oldest in terms of model), lazy mirrors/solenoids, irregular frame spacing, skipping frame counter, stripped winding gear, poor shutter speed accuracy (this can be avoided by leaving the shutter speed dial on X or B and never on an actual shutter speed setting), meter coupling chain breakages, TTL meter retardation... the list is a long one. I have known of one 645 body where the shutter would not fire no matter what (a problem traced to electronics). Looking after the old cameras is probably the best insurance you can have, but age will eventually catch up with all of them.

 

[adelorenzo]

Re: the repair issue: I ended up with my 645NII because I fried my 645N. I accidentally tripped the shutter while changing a lens and it was cooked. I sent the 645N to Pentax Canada but they said they couldn't repair it. Likely it needed a new circuit board and I doubt that anyone in the world has spares anymore.

That's the main reason I got out of the system. I figured it was only a matter of time before something unfixable happened to my newer camera. I figure if I'm going to be in film photography for the long haul I should stick to manual cameras.

 

[GRHazelton]

I seem to recall an article in The Luminous Landscape comparing images shot with the 645n and the 645nii, using MLU on the 645nii. The article found no substantive difference. Apparently any perceived shake with the 645n occurs AFTER the exposure. And yes, both cameras will accept the proper cable release, mechanical as ordained by the photo gods!

 

[Lars Holte]

You will find that the older the bigger MF Pentax cameras are, the more common age-related faults are .... Looking after the old cameras is probably the best insurance you can have, but age will eventually catch up with all of them.

Well, "age-related faults" are hardly more common with Pentax than with other brands. Nothing lasts forever, and age catches up will all of us and our film cameras irrespective of brands or nationality. As a precaution I have secured myself two Pentax 645N cameras (one an N II), as they are fairly cheap, and three Pentax 6x7 plus on Pentax 67 II, but they all continue to function flawlessly, so it seems that I have been over-cautious.

 

[Oren Grad]

You might take a look at the Mamiya 645 cameras. I think they are still making one that takes film and digital backs.

The 645AFDIII is discontinued in the US, though you can still find new bodies in Japan. The most recent versions of the camera, the 645DF and 645DF+, do not accept film backs.

 

[Alan Gales]

The 645AFDIII is discontinued in the US, though you can still find new bodies in Japan. The most recent versions of the camera, the 645DF and 645DF+, do not accept film backs.

Thanks, Oren.

That's too bad about the new ones not accepting film backs. Not surprising though.

 

[andron]

I should have mentioned I have a 645n and lenses already.

I'm looking to replace the body because the electronics are malfunctioning a bit.

Timer no longer works, nor manual shutter speeds below 1/15.

In fairness to Pentax these electronic faults did show up after I dropped the camera some distance onto a concrete pavement...

Funny life is!!!
I bought a body of Pentax 645N a month ago listed as "Not Working".
It had various issues, but after managing to make it shoot its main problem was revealed: Timer not working and no manual speeds below 1/15!!!
It took me a week to investigate, trace and finally find the problem (a cracked soldering of a chip contact). It was straight then, just a bit of careful heating by iron solder and voila!!!
I do not know whether this is a common issue with this model but I tend to believe it is the same body you owned once since it would be a very rare coincidence to have exactly the very same damage (most probably a crack caused by shock by falling). The speed dial was also broken.
It seems to work fine now!

 

[pentaxuser]

Re: the repair issue: I ended up with my 645NII because I fried my 645N. I accidentally tripped the shutter while changing a lens and it was cooked. I sent the 645N to Pentax Canada but they said they couldn't repair it. Likely it needed a new circuit board and I doubt that anyone in the world has spares anymore..

So, how easy is it for anyone to do what you did ? It sounds disturbingly easy to accidentally press the shutter while changing a lens. Is it as simple as that and will one such mistake ruin the camera as it appears to have done in your case? I have a 645N and I am now worried. I can't recall reading any stern warning or indeed any warning in the handbook that under no circumstances should you have your finger anywhere near the shutter button when changing a lens

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[choiliefan]

Having used extension tubes and manual lenses on a 645NII I can't imagine any way firing the body without a lens attached would damage the shutter.

 

[Pioneer]

Having used extension tubes and manual lenses on a 645NII I can't imagine any way firing the body without a lens attached would damage the shutter.

I have to agree. I use extension tubes all the time. I even use an adaptor to use P6 mount lenses which have no electronics whatsoever. Maybe if you crossed the contacts with something metal at the exact moment you fired the shutter, but I would consider that a very rare possibility.

 

[pentaxuser]

Hopefully adelorenzo will expand on his problem - still early in the Yukon as yet . It is always a bit disconcerting when you see an almost casual reference to what sounds like a in-built fatal flaw in the P45N that is so easy to replicate when changing a lens

pentaxuser

 

[adelorenzo]

This is an old thread but I can't really add anything more to it. I was changing lenses outdoors and accidentally tripped the shutter button. I think it happened while the lens was still partly attached and maybe it shorted cross the contacts. I smelled electrical smoke and immediately pulled the batteries out of the camera. That was it, he's dead Jim. Pentax told me they couldn't fix it.

I have never heard of anyone else doing this so I was probably just super unlucky. I ended up selling the 645NII I bought to replace it because I was worried about keeping an electronic camera operational. Shame because I absolutely loved those cameras.

 

[Deleted member 88956]

I don't know if it is your first medium format camera I may look for a nice 6x7 II.

That's like looking for SUV and an 18-wheeler is suggested as an option.

 

[pentaxuser]

This is an old thread but I can't really add anything more to it. I was changing lenses outdoors and accidentally tripped the shutter button. I think it happened while the lens was still partly attached and maybe it shorted cross the contacts. I smelled electrical smoke and immediately pulled the batteries out of the camera. That was it, he's dead Jim. Pentax told me they couldn't fix it.

I have never heard of anyone else doing this so I was probably just super unlucky. I ended up selling the 645NII I bought to replace it because I was worried about keeping an electronic camera operational. Shame because I absolutely loved those cameras.

Thanks for the reply

pentaxuser

 

[baachitraka]

That's like looking for SUV and an 18-wheeler is suggested as an option.

Concerning the tonal gradation, ease of cropping the negative from 6x7 to 645, perhaps availability of good serviceable 6x7 cameras made me to suggest a 6x7.

I was stunned when I first print a 6x6 negative and compared it to the prints made with 135.

 

[Deleted member 88956]

Concerning the tonal gradation, ease of cropping the negative from 6x7 to 645, perhaps availability of good serviceable 6x7 cameras made me to suggest a 6x7.

I was stunned when I first print a 6x6 negative and compared it to the prints made with 135.

No questions abut 67 vs. 645 negative size and ultimately more refined outcome, just that 67 is a monster size overall compared to 645N.

 

[johnha]

QUOTE="Witold, post: 2276833, member: 88956"]No questions abut 67 vs. 645 negative size and ultimately more refined outcome, just that 67 is a monster size overall compared to 645N.[/QUOTE]

The 67 isn't much different volume wise (it's thinner front to back) and fits better in to modern camera bags designed for pro FF DSLRs plus grips. Heavy though with a prism and bulky with the stunning 55-100 zoom.