on 4x5 cameras and lenses.

[Stephanie Brim]

I may have found one. If I can't get this one, I'll look harder at your Crown. The focal plane shutter is more of a plus than a need.

 

[Alex Hawley]

Er ...not quite. Old-time pressmen swore by the reliability of the Speed Graphic shutter, which was of non-self-capping design,

Yep, the Graphic FPS was quite the deal in its day. Still is for that matter. Graphic didn't stop making Speeds because of the shutter. They went completely out of business. After 50 or 60 years, its quite possible that the FPS would need some maintenance attention. But the were a solid design that was very reliable. And let's please don't start a quibble about the definitions and measures of reliability.

As an example, I used one a few years ago that was a WWII era model. It had spent a good many years riding around in a Highway Patrol cruiser, no doubt in the trunk, subject to lots of dust and crap. I'm certain that the fellow who now had didn't do any maintenance on the shutter. Yet, the FPS seemed to work perfectly fine at all speeds. Made a believer out of me.

 

[Murray@uptowngallery]

You know what is probably a bigger source of trouble for current-generation Graphic acquirers?

Someone closing the front without the focus rack fully retracted, breaking the rear tracks.

Maybe replacing them was cheap and easy in the old days. The Crown I got had been broken like that by someone who should have known better (former corporate owner, not me). Somebody quoted me $75 for the part...insane...got a front one from somebody for $12 & cut it to fit.

So don't let that happen to you.

 

[Stephanie Brim]

You know what is probably a bigger source of trouble for current-generation Graphic acquirers?

Someone closing the front without the focus rack fully retracted, breaking the rear tracks.

Maybe replacing them was cheap and easy in the old days. The Crown I got had been broken like that by someone who should have known better (former corporate owner, not me). Somebody quoted me $75 for the part...insane...got a front one from somebody for $12 & cut it to fit.

So don't let that happen to you.

Check. I promise not to let that happen.

Lots of good advice here. I will lean toward the Speed due to my budget so that I can use barrel lenses. I think my main problem at first is going to be the amount of holders that I'll have...which isn't many. I should be getting a nice 250mm lens (in barrel, I think) from someone, so that focal length can be considered covered. Film is a slight problem as no one sells 4x5 locally and I don't have a credit card, but I'll figure something out. If anyone has some expired stuff they're willing to sell...

But anyway, I think in the long run it's going to be a fun experience for me. My first trip out with the camera will be going to Homer, Iowa, a pretty much abandoned town, and shooting the church there.

 

[removed account4]

You know what is probably a bigger source of trouble for current-generation Graphic acquirers?

Someone closing the front without the focus rack fully retracted, breaking the rear tracks.

Maybe replacing them was cheap and easy in the old days. The Crown I got had been broken like that by someone who should have known better (former corporate owner, not me). Somebody quoted me $75 for the part...insane...got a front one from somebody for $12 & cut it to fit.

So don't let that happen to you.

ez-fix for that is
to remove the tracks and reverse them.

and best of all, it's free!

 

[Nick Zentena]

I should be getting a nice 250mm lens (in barrel, I think) from someone, so that focal length can be considered covered.

I don't remember the bellows length on the Speed but unless you intend to use the lens only at infinity you might want to do the math to make sure you can focus close enough.

Any body know how long the speed bellows?

 

[Ole]

Any body know how long the speed bellows?

No, but a 240 focusses to about 1.5 meter.

 

[Murray@uptowngallery]

I think somewhere around 300 mm you should measure before buying the lens.

I guess the only 'problem' with a lens as long as 250 on a (4x5) Speed is you won't have much bellows extension left for anything approaching macro

 

[David H. Bebbington]

Any body know how long the speed bellows?

Just measured a 4x5" Crown Graphic - the answer is 12.5 inches, 31.8 cm.

To get around this problem, I bought a 270 mm Tele-Arton, which has a back focus of only 152 mm.

Regards,

David

 

[Stephanie Brim]

Is there a list of longer lenses that will work well on the Speed or any other press cameras?

 

[David H. Bebbington]

Is there a list of longer lenses that will work well on the Speed or any other press cameras?

The Schneider archive
http://www.schneiderkreuznach.com/archiv/archiv.htm
has lots of brochures covering all their tele lenses with tables including back focus data.

Regards,

David

 

[Stephanie Brim]

Cool, thanks.

 

[David H. Bebbington]

Is there a list of longer lenses that will work well on the Speed or any other press cameras?

Just out of interest, the longest lens I own which will fit on a 4x5" Graphic is an f9.5 500 mm Osaka. This lens measures 6" from front to back, with 5" projecting forward of the lens board, so its optical center must be well ahead of the board. It will focus to about 25 feet.

 

[Nick Zentena]

Just measured a 4x5" Crown Graphic - the answer is 12.5 inches, 31.8 cm.

I forget but doesn't the speed add a little extra depth because of the shutter?

 

[David H. Bebbington]

I forget but doesn't the speed add a little extra depth because of the shutter?

Correct! I just took out a 4x5" Pacemaker Speed Graphic and measured the max. bellows extension at 13.25".

Regards,

David

 

[Wayne R. Scott]

I took this photo with the 250mm barrel lens that I think Steph is looking at. This was on a Super Graphic. I don't know if this is close enough focussing for the gurus here, but it works for me.

Wayne

 

[removed account4]

Is there a list of longer lenses that will work well on the Speed or any other press cameras?

stephanie

have you been to http://www.graflex.org yet?
i am sure they have a very large list of long lenses
that work very well with speed/crown graphics and
other press cameras ... i like using my 10+15" tele optars.
they are both barrel lenses ( i have a speed ) and they work great.

good luck!
john

 

[David H. Bebbington]

stephanie

have you been to http://www.graflex.org yet?
i am sure they have a very large list of long lenses
that work very well with speed/crown graphics and
other press cameras ... i like using my 10+15" tele optars.
they are both barrel lenses ( i have a speed ) and they work great.

good luck!
john

It is worth noting that older teles (like the Tele-Optars mentioned above, and the Tele-Arton I mentioned) were specifically designed to work with press-type cameras and were therefore computed with a short back focus (in many cases, the same as a press camera's 5 to 6 inch standard lens). They don't have as much coverage as either a more modern tele lens or a non-tele lens of the same focal length but do score heavily on close focusing, as Wayne's excellent portrait shows.

 

[Charles Webb]

Stephanie,
Something no one has mentioned to any degree, is the fact that All of the lenses factory attached to a Speed or Crown were very good to excellent for their time. They still stand tall today!

Just a year or so ago practically everyone on this list poo-pooed Wollensak lenses. Today they are among the most sought after and "Pricy" on ebay. Take a look at what Jim Galli does with old projection lenses that were never designed or intended for quality picture making. The Velostigmats and Raptars that sold for less than a hundered dollars are now selling for 250 to a 1000 dollars or more.

My point in what I am trying to get accross is simply there is/was nothing at all wrong with the standard stock lenses that Graphlex placed on their various models of cameras.
Of those buying press type "boxes" most were professional picture makers. They were Graphlex's largest market. The pro camera man would not allow them to put inferior quality lenses on their products. I have never used any model of Graphlex's camera that had a factory installed
lens on it that did not make excellent negatives. Excellent
negatives equal excellent prints.

What I have said here is fact, not speculation as to how the lenses actually performed. As somebody once said, "Hell I was there!"

Charlie.........................................

 

[Alex Hawley]

Stephanie,
Just a year or so ago practically everyone on this list poo-pooed Wollensak lenses.

Think I was one of the few that defended the Wollies. Stephanie, Charlie is absolutely right on this point. I've taken some of my best shots with a 135 Wollensak Raptar. Its my lens of choice for magnifying a close-up to 1:1 with the 4x5. Its also the lens of choice for normal views. You can't go wrong with one, nor with any of the others.

Something that I think is quite fascinating is that the modern lenses are far more precise in their manufacture than what used to be obtainable. Yet, no one seems to be able to discern a difference in a print made with a modern Schneider versus a print made with a Commercial Ektar of 1940s vintage.

 

[removed account4]

Something that I think is quite fascinating is that the modern lenses are far more precise in their manufacture than what used to be obtainable. Yet, no one seems to be able to discern a difference in a print made with a modern Schneider versus a print made with a Commercial Ektar of 1940s vintage.

you said it!
i love my wolly's
(i have 6 of them)

john

 

[Stephanie Brim]

Believe it or not, most of my interest in photography lies in using equipment (and lenses, of course) that was made far before my time. I think photographic equipment should be used, regardless of age, and therefore most of my stuff is at least older than me, if not two and three times my age. Not enough people appreciate the stuff that got us there.

Maybe if more people realized what they could do with those old cameras collecting dust in their cabinets or attics digital photography wouldn't be quite as wide spread as it is now.

 

[Alex Hawley]

Absolutely no argument from me on that Stephanie. The "newest" camera I have is a 1977 Canon AE-1. The 4x5 and 8x10 are 1940's vintage, and the 7x17 is pre-1910.

 

[Wayne R. Scott]

"Hell I was there!"

Charlie.........................................

That was Elmer Keith.

Wayne

 

[jmdavis]

That was Elmer Keith.

Wayne

Indeed it was.