Nikon F2 - Damaged Ratchet Gear on Winding Shaft

[2ndGenNikonian]

My main camera body was regularly locking up after advancing the film, and the shop is saying it's an issue with the gear on the winder slipping a tooth or two. They're saying it's unrepairable, and are offering a discounted price on a new camera body. They recently (August 2024) performed a full CLA on the camera, and said that there were no issues with it, but this problem showed up less than a year later after only light use. Is this problem really as unrepairable as they say, and is it something the initial CLA should have noticed before it became a problem? I'm stubborn, so the camera's headed to Sover Wong if I can snag a booking when he reopens them.

 

[F4U]

Are you saying that Wong is the one who did it in August? Of course it's not unrepairable, although a parts body may have to forfeit it's life for yours. I'm not so quick to buy the story that a gear is slipping a tooth or 2. I work on F's and the winding gears are not that complicated, and they are nearly "bullet-proof."

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

Are you saying that Wong is the one who did it in August? Of course it's not unrepairable, although a parts body may have to forfeit it's life for yours. I'm not so quick to buy the story that a gear is slipping a tooth or 2. I work on F's and the winding gears are not that complicated, and they are nearly "bullet-proof."

No. The CLA was done by a local camera shop. I dropped it off a week or so ago, and I'm just forwarding what the technician said.

"Changed out the winding mech plate with ratchet paws, no change. Suspect the ratchet
gear on top of the winding shaft is damaged. Don't have new part to replace it.
We have several F2 bodies without meters that could be CLA'd and sold for about $200 as
a replacement."

 

[ic-racer]

If this part is bad, one would need to find a camera body to harvest the part.

 

[F4U]

If this part is bad, one would need to find a camera body to harvest the part.



View attachment 402594

And there you go. Agreed.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

Damn. I'll ask to see it when I next head down there. Is it the sort of thing that would have been noticeable before it failed? I really don't want to have to buy a new camera right now.

 

[F4U]

I have worked on a number of cameras but never an F2 I always considered them the most indestructible 35mm ever made. But as I look at the photo of the gear above encircled in yellow, it looks terrible. Is this a picture of a bad one? It looks like it was a rather fragile under-engineered gear. Inconceivable to me that puny weak looking gear like that would not have been torn up by an MD-2 motor drive in short order. I have a very nice F2 in mint condition. But if it has a pitiful looking gear like that in it, I believe I'll stick with my F as my daily camera. Is the gear in that picture torn up, or did it originally look like that? That looks awful.

 

[250swb]

. But if it has a pitiful looking gear like that in it, I believe I'll stick with my F as my daily camera. Is the gear in that picture torn up, or did it originally look like that? That looks awful.

What are you seeing that looks awful? It's dirty but the gear/take up ratchet in the photo looks fine to me, and given it's thickness makes me wonder how the OP's could loose a tooth. It does actually look a bit more substantial than that of an F.

 

[koraks]

Is it the sort of thing that would have been noticeable before it failed? I really don't want to have to buy a new camera right now.

Whether it was noticeable before doesn't change anything about the situation as it is now. You can't redo the past. So you're facing two separate issues:
1: The question whether the technician doing earlier work on the camera should have noticed anything and can be held liable in any way
2: How to fix this camera or get a replacement.
If I am to recommend anything, it's to drop #1 and don't waste any time or energy on it as the only thing you'll accomplish is to have the relationship with your local camera shop turn sour. There's no indication of any wrongdoing on their part as far as I can tell. Furthermore, #2 doesn't directly relate to #1 in any way; regardless of what you do w.r.t. #1, it doesn't change the options you have for dealing with #2.

It looks like it was a rather fragile under-engineered gear.

It looks like a perfectly fine and functional part for a solidly-made camera that has seen decades of probably fairly intensive use. I don't understand what problem you have with that part as shown. And either way, it doesn't have any relation to OP's question to begin with.

 

[Tel]

To 2ndgenNikonian: what precisely is happening when the camer locks up? It seems you can wind it; is it refusing to fire when wound on? If that’s the case, you may rightly doubt the diagnosis of a bad ratchet gear—there are any number of things in the shutter release mechanism that could be maladjusted or damaged that would cause a misfire. As to the solution: do you plan on attempting the repair yourself, or finding another repair shop? If the problem is NOT the ratchet, then your problem is the repair person and not the camera and you need to send it elsewhere to get it fixed. Sover Wong will no doubt get it back to as-new working condition—that’s his brand—but his repair will likely cost as much or more than a “new” camera. Maybe someone here can recommend another repair shop that specializes in Nikons; failing that, grit your teeth, open your wallet and send it to Wong.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

To 2ndgenNikonian: what precisely is happening when the camer locks up? It seems you can wind it; is it refusing to fire when wound on? If that’s the case, you may rightly doubt the diagnosis of a bad ratchet gear—there are any number of things in the shutter release mechanism that could be maladjusted or damaged that would cause a misfire. As to the solution: do you plan on attempting the repair yourself, or finding another repair shop? If the problem is NOT the ratchet, then your problem is the repair person and not the camera and you need to send it elsewhere to get it fixed. Sover Wong will no doubt get it back to as-new working condition—that’s his brand—but his repair will likely cost as much or more than a “new” camera. Maybe someone here can recommend another repair shop that specializes in Nikons; failing that, grit your teeth, open your wallet and send it to Wong.

Every few frames, the camera would wind, but the shutter release would not engage. I could press it all the way down, there would be no resistance, and the shutter would not fire. To get the shutter to fire, I had to rewind the film to salvage it, open the back, and fiddle with the collar around the release. The shutter would then go off.

 

[GregY]

Every few frames, the camera would wind, but the shutter release would not engage. I could press it all the way down, there would be no resistance, and the shutter would not fire. To get the shutter to fire, I had to rewind the film to salvage it, open the back, and fiddle with the collar around the release. The shutter would then go off.

In my experience, Nikon F & F2 are real workhorse cameras (love 'em). I'd certainly send/bring my camera to another repair facility. I see you're in Texas....I've had great service (not repair) from Precision Camera in Austin....I'd at least call and have a conversation with them and describe the situation. You might be waiting a while for Sover W...

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

In my experience, Nikon F & F2 are real workhorse cameras (love 'em). I'd certainly send/bring my camera to another repair facility. I see you're in Texas....I've had great service (not repair) from Precision Camera in Austin....I'd at least call and have a conversation with them and describe the situation. You might be waiting a while for Sover W...

Precision are my go-to for photography stuff. They're the ones who looked at it, and they're saying they don't have the part to repair it. I'm also looking at Eurotech or sending it to Vermont Camera Repair.

 

[GregY]

Precision are my go-to for photography stuff. They're the ones who looked at it, and they're saying they don't have the part to repair it. I'm also looking at Eurotech or sending it to Vermont Camera Repair.

Thanks for your quick reply. With the # of F2 in circulation, I'm sure you can get it up and running again.
Also, in answer to your question ....."would it be noticeable before it failed?" I can't imagine how one could predict what part of a 50 yr old mechanical camera would fail.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

Thanks for your quick reply. With the # of F2 in circulation, I'm sure you can get it up and running again.
Also, in answer to your question ....."would it be noticeable before it failed?" I can't imagine how one could predict what part of a 50 yr old mechanical camera would fail.

Yup. I'll pick up the camera the next time I swing by, and I'll be asking either Eurotech or VCR to take a look at it. Don't want my otherwise perfect condition camera to be relegated to parts donor, so I'll try to track down that gear.

 

[Tel]

Yup. I'll pick up the camera the next time I swing by, and I'll be asking either Eurotech or VCR to take a look at it. Don't want my otherwise perfect condition camera to be relegated to parts donor, so I'll try to track down that gear.

From your description of the malfunction, I going to say that I think the camera repair shop has misdiagnosed the problem. If you can fiddle with the release mechanism and the camera fires, there is nothing wrong with the ratchet in the winding mechanism. The purpose of the winding lever and its associated parts is to advance the film and charge the shutter. If you can fire the camera by fiddling with the release mechanism without re-charging the shutter, then the winding mechanism did its job correctly and there is nothing wrong with it. I’d bet your problem is in the release mechanism, not the winding gears.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

From your description of the malfunction, I going to say that I think the camera repair shop has misdiagnosed the problem. If you can fiddle with the release mechanism and the camera fires, there is nothing wrong with the ratchet in the winding mechanism. The purpose of the winding lever and its associated parts is to advance the film and charge the shutter. If you can fire the camera by fiddling with the release mechanism without re-charging the shutter, then the winding mechanism did its job correctly and there is nothing wrong with it. I’d bet your problem is in the release mechanism, not the winding gears.

That's a great point. I'll discuss it with the technician when I pick it up. You're right that it makes no sense for the shutter to fire if the issue's with the winder.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

They say the reason they suspect it's something with the winder because the problem doesn't occur unless film is loaded. If the camera's empty, then it works flawlessly. If there's a roll in it, then it jams after a random number of shots.

 

[GregY]

They say the reason they suspect it's something with the winder because the problem doesn't occur unless film is loaded. If the camera's empty, then it works flawlessly. If there's a roll in it, then it jams after a random number of shots.

That's likely an important observation. I was sure impressed with Precision and their people. (I was there in person)

 

[F4U]

Be sure to post when it's resolved.

 

[Tel]

Be sure to post when it's resolved.

Ditto that. OP: If you need a mostly complete parts body let me know.

 

[retina_restoration]

They say the reason they suspect it's something with the winder because the problem doesn't occur unless film is loaded. If the camera's empty, then it works flawlessly. If there's a roll in it, then it jams after a random number of shots.

Get a different technician’s opinion.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

Get a different technician’s opinion.

I'll be taking it to Eurotech for Sorin's opinion. I'm actually curious as to what it is now.

Ditto that. OP: If you need a mostly complete parts body let me know.

If I can figure out what it is, I'll keep in touch. Thank you.

 

[2ndGenNikonian]

Get a different technician’s opinion.

All right. The final diagnosis is that the winding shaft itself is broken, while the gear is perfectly fine. They say that it's all but impossible to remove from a donor camera while keeping it intact, so unless I can find one that was never installed in a camera, then it's beyond repair.

 

[GregY]

All right. The final diagnosis is that the winding shaft itself is broken, while the gear is perfectly fine. They say that it's all but impossible to remove from a donor camera while keeping it intact, so unless I can find one that was never installed in a camera, then it's beyond repair.