New To Me Century Graphic Special. Help.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
Sir, you are badly mistaken. Graflok back only. Permanently attached.

You don't understand that backs have parts. In addition, you share the common misapprehension that film holders are backs.

I'll say it again. Go educate yourself.

120 film holder that exposes film to a 6x9 format that clips onto back of camera. Therefore a piece that goes onto the back of camera.

Ground glass that has springs that clips onto the back of camera via another method namely not the sliding clips. Therefore another piece of the camera that goes on the back.

The locking mechanism that holds film holders that is on the back of the camera. Therefore the back-of-the-camera also the camera back. Meaning to say the locking method used by the camera is the back of the camera therefore the camera back and anything that connects to the back of the camera is not a camera back it is a film holder unless it doesn't hold film then it is called something else.

In modern parlance anything that attaches to the back of the camera is called a 'Camera Back'. If there was a digital 2x3 it would be called a 'camera back' Film holders for 120 systems are called 'camera backs' regardless of how they connect to cameras.

I am not 'badly mistaken' I'm confused by antiquated terms mixing with obsolete terms that then muddle with modern terms. Whatever way it is I managed to get good exposures out of the machine.

'It's not a clip, it's a magazine.'

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

BrianShaw said:
Freestyle

100 and 400 from what I see. I could manage to find some xray film and chop it down to size I suppose...

shutterfinger · Sep 7, 2020

Every one from the day used word play for their products.
Graflex - takes Graflex holders only. Graflex holders are wider and have a grove for a light trap.
Graphic- industry standard spring back. The focus panel is attached to the camera back with screws. Only double sided film holders will fit.
Graflok- the focus panel attaches via spring loaded arms. The focus panel is removable. Takes a virety of film holders including roll film holders. Also known as international back.
Most terms for backs, film holders, roll film holders are industry standard in use for decades not just antiquated terms.
A back is a part of the camera, a film holder attaches to the back, younguns call them backs cause they go on the back of the camera. I'm susprized they don't call lens and shutters fronts as they go on the front of the camera.

MattKing · Sep 7, 2020

shutterfinger said:
A back is a part of the camera, a film holder attaches to the back, younguns call them backs cause they go on the back of the camera. I'm susprized they don't call lens and shutters fronts as they go on the front of the camera.

At least the British don't call them boots.
I and every one I know uses the term "film back" for what Mamiya correctly refers to as a "roll film holder".
I just like the fact that shutterfinger describes 64 year old me as a "youngun".

shutterfinger · Sep 7, 2020

MattKing said:
I just like the fact that shutterfinger describes 64 year old me as a "youngun".

'cause I've got 5 years on you.

Dan Fromm · Sep 7, 2020

shutterfinger said:
'cause I've got 5 years on you.

You kids ...

peter k. · Sep 7, 2020

Ha 74 and know less about this then we did back then ... .. but still having fun.
Gooooooo backless ...

btaylor · Sep 7, 2020

I was looking for 2x3 film awhile ago for my Baby Speed and it was looking pretty grim- and there it is at Freestyle! I am so glad we can still use this old gear.
Backs, holders, focus panels- it does get very confusing in the Graflex world I agree. The only way I am able to keep track is because I have had some of each- once you see it, you get it.

Dan Fromm · Sep 7, 2020

peter k. said:
Ha 74 and know less about this then we did back then ... .. but still having fun.
Gooooooo backless ...

Drop seat coveralls? Haven't seen them for quite a while.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

shutterfinger said:
Every one from the day used word play for their products.
Graflex - takes Graflex holders only. Graflex holders are wider and have a grove for a light trap.
Graphic- industry standard spring back. The focus panel is attached to the camera back with screws. Only double sided film holders will fit.
Graflok- the focus panel attaches via spring loaded arms. The focus panel is removable. Takes a virety of film holders including roll film holders. Also known as international back.
Most terms for backs, film holders, roll film holders are industry standard in use for decades not just antiquated terms.
A back is a part of the camera, a film holder attaches to the back, younguns call them backs cause they go on the back of the camera. I'm susprized they don't call lens and shutters fronts as they go on the front of the camera.

I still have trouble telling my right foot from left. Lens and shutter are 'front elements'.

MattKing said:
At least the British don't call them boots.
I and every one I know uses the term "film back" for what Mamiya correctly refers to as a "roll film holder".
I just like the fact that shutterfinger describes 64 year old me as a "youngun".

shutterfinger said:
'cause I've got 5 years on you.

Dan Fromm said:
You kids ...

peter k. said:
Ha 74 and know less about this then we did back then ... .. but still having fun.
Gooooooo backless ...

I'm just barely half the age of you folks.

btaylor said:
I was looking for 2x3 film awhile ago for my Baby Speed and it was looking pretty grim- and there it is at Freestyle! I am so glad we can still use this old gear.
Backs, holders, focus panels- it does get very confusing in the Graflex world I agree. The only way I am able to keep track is because I have had some of each- once you see it, you get it.

This is my first camera of this kind. No, I'm going to get the terms wrong for a long time. This doesn't prevent me from learning though, I'll get the terms at some point but I have enough to keep track of trying to remember all 30 steps to take a photo. Never mind that my subjects are half my age or younger. Standing still is not a contemporary skill.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

Do we have a consensus on those film holders? A worthy buy?

shutterfinger · Sep 7, 2020

Yes they are.

shutterfinger · Sep 7, 2020

Younguns - anyone new to the system.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

shutterfinger said:
Younguns - anyone new to the system.

That's a'me!

And I have far more information available at my fingertips than any of you greybeards had back in the day. Oh, I remember the days before the internet. Prying info out of the elder of the crypt was near impossible. Guarding the secrets of the craft and dribbling out tiny tidbits of info, half of it wrong just to confuse seekers of the truth.

But lo! We now have the internet where people just vomit out all the knowledge for the dirty masses.

shutterfinger said:
Yes they are.

Thanks, that's what I was looking for.

MattKing · Sep 7, 2020

Cholentpot said:
That's a'me!

And I have far more information available at my fingertips than any of you greybeards had back in the day. Oh, I remember the days before the internet. Prying info out of the elder of the crypt was near impossible. Guarding the secrets of the craft and dribbling out tiny tidbits of info, half of it wrong just to confuse seekers of the truth.

But lo! We now have the internet where people just vomit out all the knowledge for the dirty masses.

Thanks, that's what I was looking for.

Hah
There is more bafflegab on the internet than anywhere else at any time in recorded history!
But I'm still enjoying the youngun moniker.
My Dad would have been 99 this year. He enjoyed helping others with photography (and jazz, and environmental issues, and social justice issues) way into his 80s, but wouldn't touch the internet.

Dan Fromm · Sep 7, 2020

Hmm. Another person poorly acquainted with books, in particular Graphc Graflex Photography. And possibly another person who believes that misinformation is better than none.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
Hmm. Another person poorly acquainted with books, in particular Graphc Graflex Photography. And possibly another person who believes that misinformation is better than none.

Massive Development Chart would have been very useful back in the day. As for misinformation, you sift through enough and you gain a second nature to pick up on what is real and what is bogus.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

MattKing said:
Hah
There is more bafflegab on the internet than anywhere else at any time in recorded history!
But I'm still enjoying the youngun moniker.
My Dad would have been 99 this year. He enjoyed helping others with photography (and jazz, and environmental issues, and social justice issues) way into his 80s, but wouldn't touch the internet.

There's a reason why I'm here rather than somewhere else. The info on this sight is generally spot on, if delivered rudely occasionally. Some people just need a nice hot Ovaltine.

Dennis-B · Sep 7, 2020

jtk said:
I've done all the above (except I didn't pay anybody). You can't screw up.

For future reference - You may be able to find undrilled lens boards for the 3x4.

MattKing said:
At least the British don't call them boots.
I and every one I know uses the term "film back" for what Mamiya correctly refers to as a "roll film holder".
I just like the fact that shutterfinger describes 64 year old me as a "youngun".

Mamiya refers the the devices which contain roll film inserts as "magazines". On the Mamiya Universal, the roll film holder was just that; there were no removable inserts. Hasselblad uses the same terminology. Bronica uses the term "film back" for the magazine, and "film holder" for the internal film advance mechanism. Koni Omega used the term "magazine" on their "200" model, and the term film back which attached to the removable magazine.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

Dennis-B said:
For future reference - You may be able to find undrilled lens boards for the 3x4.

Mamiya refers the the devices which contain roll film inserts as "magazines". On the Mamiya Universal, the roll film holder was just that; there were no removable inserts. Hasselblad uses the same terminology. Bronica uses the term "film back" for the magazine, and "film holder" for the internal film advance mechanism. Koni Omega used the term "magazine" on their "200" model, and the term film back which attached to the removable magazine.

I use a Bronica S2. It has a film back.

btaylor · Sep 7, 2020

Dan Fromm points out an excellent resource, the Graphic Graflex Photography book. Graflex put it out in various editions over the years and it is comprehensive. I got a copy when I bought my Super Speed Graphic- about $20-30 shipped on Amazon.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

btaylor said:
Dan Fromm points out an excellent resource, the Graphic Graflex Photography book. Graflex put it out in various editions over the years and it is comprehensive. I got a copy when I bought my Super Speed Graphic- about $20-30 shipped on Amazon.

I'm not adverse to reading. I'll see if I can dig up a copy from the local library system.

Dan Fromm · Sep 7, 2020

btaylor said:
Dan Fromm points out an excellent resource, the Graphic Graflex Photography book. Graflex put it out in various editions over the years and it is comprehensive. I got a copy when I bought my Super Speed Graphic- about $20-30 shipped on Amazon.

Morgan & Lester, actually.

BrianShaw · Sep 7, 2020

It pays to get one that is the edition about the same era as your camera.

it also pays to read and understand the camera’s manual.

Cholentpot · Sep 7, 2020

BrianShaw said:
It pays to get one that is the edition about the same era as your camera.

it also pays to read and understand the camera’s manual.

That's the first thing I do when I get a new camera. Believe it or not, not everything is inside the manual.

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