MACO Director speaks: here's where the film comes from

[AgX]

To my understanding Ferrania left Imation in 1999.
The Dynacolor plant was closed in 1986, and did 3M/Imation ever coat pictorial films in Weatherford? Anyway, this plant was sold to Kodak in 2001.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

To my understanding Ferrania left Imation in 1999.
The Dynacolor plant was closed in 1986, and did 3M/Imation ever coat pictorial films in Weatherford? Anyway, this plant was sold to Kodak in 2001.

I'm not really sure where you get this information, but Ferrania still lists its Weatherford plant as a manufacturing facility on its web pages.

http://www.ferraniait.com/Worldwide/USA.htm

 

[AgX]

I admit I did not see that page before. But on the same site they state they parted from Imation. Imation on their behalve state that they went out of film coating.

So this means Ferrania still (or again) has premises in Weatherford. But are they coating there? I can assure you from visits at photo plants, as long as the crucial doors are closed, you won't know what they are doing

 

[jun]

Hello,

The DNP film may be Ferrania one if "Made in USA" means "packaged in USA", and film coated in Italy.
(http://www.ferraniait.com/Corporate/techprofile.htm says that they coat film in Italy not in the US)

But if so, what bothers me is that the DNP film is "exactly" the same with the famous genuine Gold x00 film for plastic canister, emulsion color when opened, leader film length sticking out from the metal cassette, leader film cutting dimensions, light shielding fiber tip, and the metal cassette itself.
Are the Ferrania films same for the above?

I have used 3M film before but I remember it was quite different in appearance and the quality difference was quite apparent.

Note that today in some of the discount stores in Japan, the most famous USA film makers genuine color film are lot much low priced than any of the made in Japan films any where in Japan (e.g. Gold 200 films 24 exp 0.90 USD).

Since I do not prefer some of the current made in Japan commercial color negative since it has too much contrast (note: some the commercial emulsion sold in Japan are different than the one sold internationally such as 400 ISO commercial color negative, but they seem to change that soon) , so having a quality made in USA film in a reasonable price is a good news to me.

Regards,

 

[WRSchmalfuss]

Rollei ATP "V1"

Here in Paris, I went to the Salon de Photo today to see what was new. This is an event primarily aimed at pro photographers, but us "advanced amateurs" with the Euro 10 entrance fee are very welcome. (I also went to the Salon des Deux Roues, which is a biennial motorcycle show. Left there thinking the best-looking bike was a 1935 Moto Guzzi on display. Most other bikes looked like they were designed by a ten-year-old with a Transformers fixation. Where's a Velocette when you need one? OK, end of rant.)

At the photo show, there was very little for the analog photographer in terms of film, paper or chemicals. Tetenal was there but had nothing but digital-related products -- one of the salemen apologized and said he regretted that fact. Ilford had some film off to one side in a locked cabinet, as did Fuji. But then there was the active stand where I ran into Hartmuth Schroeder, the Director of MACO Photo Products in Hamburg, Germany. We started talking (in English, to his relief) about products, and he showed me a new film that he's on the verge of releasing -- Rollie ATP "V1", with the ATP standing for (I believe) Advanced Tech Pan. Hartmuth said that it's the same formulation as Kodak's discontinued Tech Pan, exposes at ASA 20 if you develop with Technidol or his own recommend developer Rollei TLC "document type dev" -- low contrast. If you developed it in a developer made by the German firm that makes SPUR developer, you can get up to ASA 40. He said that he’d produced – or packaged, I should say -- thousands of rolls of it in 35mm, but none in 120. Should be loaded in darkness to prevent fogging the first few frames. I also bought some Rollei Ortho 25 which he said was not the same as old Maco Ort.

I kept asking him who was coating which film, explaining that there’s lots of interest on the web on this issue. (I mentioned APUG, but he said he wasn’t familiar with it.) So Hartmuth grabbed a piece of paper and laid things out for me.

First, he said, there are only eight companies in the world that can still coat: Kodak, Fuji, Lucky, Kentmere (but only paper for now), Konica, Ilford, Foma and Agfa Gavaert. Note that he was very particular that I not just call it “Agfa” but insisted on Agfa Gavaert. Then he ran down his films:

Pan 25 – produced by Agfa Gavaert in Mortsel, Belgium

Ortho 25 – produced by ORWO/Filmotech in Wolfen, in former East Germany

Infrared – AG

R3 film – ORWO/Filmotech

Tech Pan – it’s his secret, wouldn’t tell me

Retro 100, which is new version APX100 – Agfa Germania, in Leverkeusen outside Cologne in Germany, made in 2005

Retro 400, which is new version APX400 – Agfa Germania, in Leverkeusen outside Cologne in Germany, made in 2005

Note that he also had some APX100 and APX400 for sale in bricks, the film boxes looking a bit different than the deep silver Agfa boxes I last saw. My understanding is that the latest versions of APX100/400 are the same as Retro 100/400, all made in 2005.

He is working on producing Superpan 200, which is a direct replacement for Scala except that it is sensitive to 750 nanometers vice Scala’s 660 nanometers – i.e., increased red sensitivity. This film will be produced by Agfa Gavaert.

He also makes a new C-41 B/W film called Digibase 200, produced by Agfa Gavaert. No orange mask, coated on PET/Estar base. I saw some negs from this film, and the film base was absolutely flat and absolutely clear.

As to where to get this film, he said that he had worked/was working with Freestyle and Digitaltruth. From subsequent comments, it was clear to me that he preferred dealing with Digitaltruth. He suggested DR5 if anyone needed developing services.

I told Hartmuth I’d like to post this out to my APUG friends, and he agreed. I said that it would be helpful for people to be able to contact him if they had questions, and he gave me the following e-mail address: photo@mahn.net He also said that Digitaltruth would have information available.

So there you go, as heard from Mr. Schroeder. Of course I don’t know if someone will say he wasn’t telling me the whole story in this or that regard, but to me he seemed quite sincere and certainly enthusiastic about his products.

Perhaps others will have some perspective to add. Me, I’m going to go shoot this “new Tech Pan” – maybe some of that Kodak Technidol that I’ve had sitting in those little foil pouches for 15 years is still good. Does anyone know?

Hello folks,
important information from the interview led with Hartmuth Schroeder is that under the label ROLLEI-film excluding quality products of German, Japanese or Belgian production of recognized manufacturing plants are offered. That is the core statement! With the ROLLEI ATP "V1", however, no manufacturer was indicated. I asked today Hartmuth Schroeder whether it concerns, as in this forum assumes a aerial film. The answer reads: NO! The ROLLEI ATP "V1" is not based on a aerial film, but on the KODAK TP-typical technology. It is a genuine successor of the KODAK TP2415. Several developers are suitable. More over it is well-known e.g. with dr5. Meanwhile also dr5 in Germany positively expressed itself over the results with the test films. I hope, that dr5 is postings this information also here in the APUG forum.

Regards
Wolf

 

[Fotohuis]

Some interesting comments by dr 5 and our Fotohuis in the ATP-V1 community:
Dead Link Removed

 

[Fotohuis]

Well I just managed to post some results in this threat directly:

Ravenstein, the Netherlands
Rollei ATP-V1 Technical Pan
SPUR Imagespeed 1+14 5:30 min
Stop S-10 1+19 0:30 min
Fix X55 (Acid) 1+7 4:00 min
Wetting agent Rollei 1+3000 1:00 min

A very small part of the 35mm negative:

Rollei ATP-V1 Technical Pan in Rollei Low Contrast (R.L.C.) 1+5 6:00 min. Small part of the 35mm negative.

Results made by Epson 3170 (3200 dpi) scanner only.
ATP-V1 - SPUR Imagespeed: E.I. 32 (+)
ATP-V1 - R.L.C. : E.I. 25

What would be the result of this Rollei TP film in Technidol ??????

:munch:

best regards,

Robert

 

[JanaM]

..... Then he ran down his films:

Pan 25 – produced by Agfa Gavaert in Mortsel, Belgium ....

Did he really say this? Very Astonishing, because here in Germany he told us several times, and published it as well in some photo magazines, that the Rollei Pan 25 is an improved version of the old Orwo NP 15, and is made by Filmotec in Wolfen. Compared to the old orwo NP 15 the new Rollei Pan 25 has finer grain, and is adapted to other raw materials and the more modern production technology of Filmotec. That is the official information we got here from Maco.

.....
Tech Pan – it’s his secret, wouldn’t tell me

That is not a real secret anymore....this film is made by Agfa-Gevaert as well.

Regards,

Jana

 

[Fotohuis]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trask
..... Then he ran down his films:

Pan 25 – produced by Agfa Gavaert in Mortsel, Belgium ....

Did he really say this? Very Astonishing, because here in Germany he told us several times, and published it as well in some photo magazines, that the Rollei Pan 25 is an improved version of the old Orwo NP 15, and is made by Filmotec in Wolfen. Compared to the old orwo NP 15 the new Rollei Pan 25 has finer grain, and is adapted to other raw materials and the more modern production technology of Filmotec. That is the official information we got here from Maco.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Trask
.....
Tech Pan – it’s his secret, wouldn’t tell me


That is not a real secret anymore....this film is made by Agfa-Gevaert as well.

Regards,

Jana

JanaM (from Germany?) seems to be pretty well informed in the details. I can only ackknowledge them. :rolleyes:

 

[JanaM]

He left out Efke, Svema, and Slavich.

That is right concerning Efke and Slavich. Svema is indeed out of business, but Tasla in Russia is still in business and coating film. They have even introduced a new 100 ASA emulsion some years ago (I think it was 2001, but I'm not sure).

There was a very interesting article in the german "Schmalfilm" magazine about Svema and Tasla. They visited both factories:
Svema: Ruins, no production anymore.
Tasla: Nice factory, very engaged staff, very interesting interview with one of the Tasla managers.

I don't understand why H. Schroeder did not mention Filmotec in his list of coating plants. They are producing for him....

Regards,
Jana

 

[WRSchmalfuss]

ROLLEI ATP "Version 1"

Many of the films marketed by Maco are actually films intended for Aerial Survey and Aerial Photography markets, which he cuts and repackages for the consumer photographer.

From the interview led with Hartmuth Schroeder is a important information that under the label ROLLEI-FILM excluding quality products of German, Japanese or Belgian production of recognized manufacturing plants are offered.

That is the core statement! With the ROLLEI ATP "Version 1", however, no manufacturer was indicated.

I asked today Hartmuth Schroeder whether it concerns, as in ths forum assumes a aerial film.

The answer reads: NO! The ROLLEI ATP "Version 1" is not an aerial film, it is based on the tp-typical technology.

It seems that this film may be a genuine successor of the former TechPan technology. Several developers are suitable. For example Technidol LC, and ROLLEI RLC (Docufine low contrast) with 20 ISO!

Regards
Wolf

 

[PHOTOTONE]

I had a hunch that Agfa Gevaert would become more active in film production, now that Agfa Leverkusen is gone. It makes sense. Agfa Gevaert was/is a larger facility and the parent company.

 

[AgX]

Jana,

It's Tasma and not Tasla.

And concering the ATP-V1 or GTP you seem to know more than the rest of us. Any references?

 

[mabman]

Tasma

That is right concerning Efke and Slavich. Svema is indeed out of business, but Tasla in Russia is still in business and coating film. They have even introduced a new 100 ASA emulsion some years ago (I think it was 2001, but I'm not sure).

There was a very interesting article in the german "Schmalfilm" magazine about Svema and Tasla. They visited both factories:
Svema: Ruins, no production anymore.
Tasla: Nice factory, very engaged staff, very interesting interview with one of the Tasla managers.

I don't understand why H. Schroeder did not mention Filmotec in his list of coating plants. They are producing for him....

Regards,
Jana

Just curious, is there actually a source for Tasma films outside of the FSU? I've searched eBay and a couple of Russian sites before and came up with nothing. Just now, someone on eBay is selling very slow Tasma film from 1992 - if they're still operating there should be something a little more current

I have a couple of FSU rangefinders, just for historical value/curiousity at least once I'd love to feed them with Russian film And, if it's available and cheap enough (and half-decent, who knows)...

 

[JanaM]

Jana,

It's Tasma and not Tasla.

Yes, of course, you are absolutely right! It was a typing error by me, sorry!!

And concering the ATP-V1 or GTP you seem to know more than the rest of us. Any references?

1. Agfa-Gevaert is one of the few manufacturers who has the technology for such a film.
2. If you look at the official statements of Detlef Ludwig from Gigabitfilm and Sebastian Junghans of Maco and the introduction/discussion of the new film on aphog.de it seems very likely that their cooperation with this film is based on something like a licensing agreement (Gigabitfilm GTP 32 is also sold under the Rollei Label as Rollei ATP V1).
3. In the past Gigabitfilm exclusively cooperated with Agfa/Agfa-Gevaert.
4. Maco said that all of their current films are made by either Agfa-Gevaert or Filmotec (one exception: Rollei Retro 100 and 400 are old Agfa APX stock from AgfaPhoto Leverkusen). And Agfa-Gevaert's special strength is the production of high resolution films with monodisperse emulsions. Like the new film.

So, if you puzzle all this together, you come to the conclusion that it is very very likely that Agfa-Gevaert is producing this new film.
A well informed friend from the photo industry confirmed my conclusions.

Best regards,
Jana

 

[AgX]

Jana,

I was a bit surprised as up to now all films coming from Mortsel and brought into a non-aerial, non-documenting market were off the shelf films or at least seem to be.
(I must admit though hat I did not succeed in obtaining all Copex datasheets).

In case you are right that could/would mean that a new film was created there.

 

[JanaM]

Jana,

I was a bit surprised as up to now all films coming from Mortsel and brought into a non-aerial, non-documenting market were off the shelf films or at least seem to be.
(I must admit though hat I did not succeed in obtaining all Copex datasheets).

Concerning aerial films: AFAIK the differences between aerial and "normal" films are not very big. (Most) aerial films have an extended red sensivity and a rather high resolution. Generally it's no problem using an aerial film in "normal" photography.

In case you are right that could/would mean that a new film was created there.

It's possible. Agfa-Gevaert has an active R&D department AFAIK.

Best regards,
Jana

 

[srs5694]

Just curious, is there actually a source for Tasma films outside of the FSU? I've searched eBay and a couple of Russian sites before and came up with nothing. Just now, someone on eBay is selling very slow Tasma film from 1992 - if they're still operating there should be something a little more current

If you're referring to this auction, I bought some out of curiosity a year or so ago. It turns out to have been very poorly stored, or maybe that emulsion just doesn't age very well; it produces very foggy negatives, with odd splotches (I suspect from emulsion damage). I've still got some in the freezer, just in case I ever need a really "bad" film look. Note that the particular film in question comes rolled up without any sort of film cartridge; you've got to spool it into your own bulk-film cartridge to use it.

I'm pretty sure that Dead Link Removed in the UK used to sell Tasma film, but I don't see it on their Web site any more. I never bought any from them, though.

 

[aldevo]

I'm surprised the name "ERA" hasn't come up.

ERA is (was?) a Chinese manufacturer that - at one time, at least - was producing more B&W film and paper than Lucky.

There have been various discussion on the internet about whether they are currently manufacturing new stock.

Does anybody know?

 

[mmcclellan]

So does this mean that Maco 25 film is the old Agfapan 25? I always thought that was the best slow speed film in the world, especially with Rodinal. Is it the same? Thanks.

 

[Aurelien]

Nope, at all! MAco Up25 film was efke 25 film, but coated on a PET base.
Rollei 25 is a derivative of Filmotec (ex-Orwo) NP15. Coated by Agfa gevaert.
Doesn't look like agfa APX 25.

 

[Fotohuis]

http://www.digitaltruth.com/store/rollei_pan25.html

see: samples and comparison

 

[AgX]

It's funny that the Flemish plant is always referred to as Agfa-Gevaert as the German plants were named for decades (with a short lived last act as Agfaphoto) Agfa-Gevaert too.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

It's funny that the Flemish plant is always referred to as Agfa-Gevaert as the German plants were named for decades (with a short lived last act as Agfaphoto) Agfa-Gevaert too.

Well, they are/were the same company. The German plant was just closed, leaving the Flemish plant, which was the parent company.

 

[mmcclellan]

Has anyone been using the Rollei Pan 25? How does it compare in your own experience with Agfa and Efke, both of which I was always VERY happy with. The Digital Truth website that Fotohuis noted has nice comparisons, but personal testimonies always mean more. Any thoughts? Thanks.