Local photo shop Ilford minimum order question for Simon Galley/Harman

[Steve Roberts]

Hi,

Yesterday I visited the last photographic shop in Plymouth that sells traditional materials and chemistry. I wanted to buy a litre of Ilford PQ Universal developer, and though I could have bought it on line, I'd much rather support the local supplier if possible. I wasn't surprised to find that the shop doesn't stock PQ but said I was prepared to wait a week or two if they could obtain it for me. Their reply was that with Harman's minimum order of £500 and the rate at which traditional materials sell, they might not reach that value for some time to come so couldn't realistically offer to get it for me. Consequently, I'll have to head for the Internet, the carriage (which will be almost as much as the product) and the hassle of having something delivered by courier that won't fit through the letterbox.

Surely there must be some way that Harman could cater for smaller requirements than £500 worth in order for the photo shop to keep its customers happy and keep itself in business? Even if I had to pay a couple of quid on top of the retail price and wait a week or ten days, that would be better than being forced to go down the route of eBay and the like.

I'm not sure why I stopped short of naming the shop, but it's three words; first word is England's capital city, second word what we use to take photos with and third word a posher way of saying 'swap'! The staff in there are always very helpful. I bought my Praktica Super TL from them in about 1974, Pentax KX in 1986 (which I still have and use), several lenses and have directed several friends their way who have spent money there.

Best wishes,

Steve

 

[Xmas]

Micro scale from Maplins,
Raw chemicals from photo supplier like e.g. Silver print.
Unfortunately they are not open Saturdays.
Make up from published formula
http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/formulae/formulae.htm
Or Rodinal 1 litre goes some way at 1+100

 

[benjiboy]

Harman like most companies are geared up to sell to other businesses, usually wholesalers not directly to to the general public, I worked in photographic retailing for more than twenty years and in my experience manufacturers and suppliers in general not just in photography impose minimum order charges.

 

[vdonovan]

Just FYI, here in the US retailers get their Ilford products through a distributor. That distributor has minimum order quantities on a few Ilford products, but they are reasonable.

 

[summicron1]

buy locally what you can and support the shop that way -- he makes most of his money on small stuff, film and small gear, so buy that. Single-item special orders probably don't make them a lot. That's why I have a rule to never leave a bike shop without buying something -- patch kit, spare tube, whatever. That's where the profit is, not selling bicycles.

Same with camera shops. You need another box of paper anyway, right?

 

[Sennexd]

Summicron1, As one of those guys in the small local shop, I thank you for your words of wisdom.

 

[Tom Kershaw]

Harman Express, while not exactly competitive on all lines can work out economically on smaller orders.

Tom

 

[Richard S. (rich815)]

Did they have other Ilford developers in stock? Any other developers in stock?

 

[Steve Roberts]

Xmas - the point of my post was that I wanted a litre of PQ, not to make something myself or to use Rodinal
Benjiboy - I know that Harman aren't geared up to sell to the public, hence my comment that I'd be prepared to buy from a local retailer with a small premium. Of course there will be a minimum order charge, but does it have to be so high and all in one hit? Where I work we used to commit a sum of cash to a supplier and call off goods from that amount as we required them.
Summicron1 - yes, I do buy other materials from the shop - film, paper, Multigrade dev and fixer.
Tom Kershaw - I'm trying to avoid buying by mail order as it arrives at home, I'm out, it goes to the sorting office, etc. etc. I used to get things delivered where I work but they're getting a bit tetchy about that, especially liquid chemicals....!
Richard Sintchak - yes, they have Multigrade and Ilfosol 3, neither of which is what I need.

The solution may lie with Tom's suggestion of Harman Express. I've had a quick look at the site and they offer next day delivery for £3.99 for up to £50 worth of goods. Why can't Harman tie up with my local photo shop and others, sell the product to them at wholesale cost plus my £3.99 to LCE (oops - gave it away!), LCE charges me retail price, making them their profit and I just deal with them, avoiding the hassles of faffing around with courier deliveries? For those outside the UK, London Camera Exchange is a chain of 28 shops across the country.

Hmmmm.....

best wishes,

Steve

 

[analoguey]

I have the same problem - I would prefer if Ilford has a dealer in Bangalore/Bombay or Delhi. But it looks like they dont and I have to order online -which pretty much rules out (liquid) chemistry orders.

Sent from Tap-a-talk

 

[fotch]

How about asking the shop to buy it retail, mark it up say 50%, plus you pay shipping? Then you don't have to deal with postal to your home, the shop makes some profit, and also accommodates a customer, & everyone is happy? Just a thought.

 

[mgb74]

If a chain with 28 stores can't manage a £500 order with Harmon, I don't think they're trying very hard. I'd say they don't want to be bothered and don't deserve your loyalty. Better to support a mail order firm that wants your business.

 

[pdeeh]

Film isn't LCE's core business, and hasn't been for years.
They sell new digital gear, general accessories, and have a nice sideline in 2nd-hand gear, again mostly digital.

If a shop bought £500 of stuff from Harman (note spelling), they'd probably have about £450-worth end up sitting on the shelves of the stockroom for years. No business can afford to do that.

I'm frankly amazed that the OP's local shop actually had any chemicals, paper or film available!

 

[mgb74]

Film isn't LCE's core business, and hasn't been for years.
They sell new digital gear, general accessories, and have a nice sideline in 2nd-hand gear, again mostly digital.

If a shop bought £500 of stuff from Harman (note spelling), they'd probably have about £450-worth end up sitting on the shelves of the stockroom for years. No business can afford to do that.

I'm frankly amazed that the OP's local shop actually had any chemicals, paper or film available!

£500 among 28 stores is less than £18 per store - on average. Though I'm sure some stores have some demand and other have none.

I'm not saying that their business decision not to actively stock Ilford film products is evil, or wrong, or even an unkind decision. I don't criticize them for not stocking darkroom supplies - they've apparently decided that's not their market. My point is that with declining film and darkroom sales, we (as consumers) have to support those who support us.

 

[Ricardo Miranda]

Isn't the £500 per shop rather than per the whole company?
I used to shop with them when film was more their core business.

 

[Tom Kershaw]

Last time I went into LCE in Norwich they had 2nd hand analogue equipment but no materials for sale which I thought rather odd.

Tom

 

[pentaxuser]

Unless each LCE store acts a separate company and deals directly with Harman it is difficult to understand why a £500 minimum order would be applied by Harman to each store. You'd imagine that orders would be consolidated before ordering from Harman so that the £500 would be reached. Harman then sends each store's order to that store.

If there is a minimum £500 order per shop and said shop relies on man-in-the-street business only then we can expect few high street shops to ever stock analogue materials.

pentaxuser

 

[pdeeh]

Many of the shops do have a good selection of film equipment, and I've had a couple of very nice pieces from them in the past couple of years.
But equally I've never seen anything apart from a few rolls of film in them either

 

[Steve Roberts]

How about asking the shop to buy it retail, mark it up say 50%, plus you pay shipping? Then you don't have to deal with postal to your home, the shop makes some profit, and also accommodates a customer, & everyone is happy? Just a thought.

That's pretty much what I was suggesting in my second posting on the subject, though I'd substitute "wholesale" for "retail" in your first sentence. As has been said before on APUG, the cost of chemicals isn't that great compared to the cost of materials and I'd be prepared to pay a premium for the convenience, plus I have to pay delivery anyway on anything I buy online.

Steve

 

[Tom Kershaw]

That's pretty much what I was suggesting in my second posting on the subject, though I'd substitute "wholesale" for "retail" in your first sentence. As has been said before on APUG, the cost of chemicals isn't that great compared to the cost of materials and I'd be prepared to pay a premium for the convenience, plus I have to pay delivery anyway on anything I buy online.

Steve

That is partly why I suggested Harman Express as the "free" delivery threshold is £50, rather than £100-150.

Tom

 

[Xmas]

Isn't the £500 per shop rather than per the whole company?
I used to shop with them when film was more their core business.

Ilford and Forma operate via wholesalers...
so the 500£ 'claim' is a smoke screen for there is no [less than sufficient] volume to have a bottle in the shop storehouse which also means they wont reorder from wholesalers.

Retail only stocks volume.

 

[Regular Rod]

Hi,

Yesterday I visited the last photographic shop in Plymouth that sells traditional materials and chemistry. I wanted to buy a litre of Ilford PQ Universal developer, and though I could have bought it on line, I'd much rather support the local supplier if possible. I wasn't surprised to find that the shop doesn't stock PQ but said I was prepared to wait a week or two if they could obtain it for me. Their reply was that with Harman's minimum order of £500 and the rate at which traditional materials sell, they might not reach that value for some time to come so couldn't realistically offer to get it for me. Consequently, I'll have to head for the Internet, the carriage (which will be almost as much as the product) and the hassle of having something delivered by courier that won't fit through the letterbox.

Surely there must be some way that Harman could cater for smaller requirements than £500 worth in order for the photo shop to keep its customers happy and keep itself in business? Even if I had to pay a couple of quid on top of the retail price and wait a week or ten days, that would be better than being forced to go down the route of eBay and the like.

I'm not sure why I stopped short of naming the shop, but it's three words; first word is England's capital city, second word what we use to take photos with and third word a posher way of saying 'swap'! The staff in there are always very helpful. I bought my Praktica Super TL from them in about 1974, Pentax KX in 1986 (which I still have and use), several lenses and have directed several friends their way who have spent money there.

Best wishes,

Steve

Buy direct http://www.harmanexpress.com/prod/10/ILFORD-PQ-UNIVERSAL-DEVELOPER.htm shipping is free for orders over £50, £3.99 if not.

Time is too precious to waste visiting shops that don't have stuff in stock.

RR

 

[R.Gould]

I would like to be able to get anything for my photography where I live, we have no phot dealers of any sort since Jessops first drove the other photo shop here out of busines, and then went bust themselves, I have to buy everything from film to paper to chemicals, cameras,nothing is available in my Island, so I say thank god for Silverprint,Firstcall Et all, if nthey didn't exist I would not be able to yake a photo
Richard

 

[Simon R Galley]

Dear All,

Firstly we value all our reseller partners and wish our items to be stored where customers can easily obtain them.

Its true we have a minimum order for retailers, but that order level is for FREE shipment, any of our UK account holders can order what they want ( subject to our MOQ's per item eg we only sell film in 10's ) but if the minimum is not met they pay a delivery charge.

It's the same for many retailers supplied by our distributors worldwide.

Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :