Kodak films direct from Eastman Kodak (was: Kodacolor 100. New)

[loccdor]

Would all this be expected to have an impact on the prices?

 

[Nopo]

The old owners were actually a large UK government fund with the legislative mandate to make good on any pension shortfalls in certain defined private pension plans - and the projected/potential Kodak Limited pension fund shortfall was forecasted to be the largest claim ever on that fund.
Kodak Alaris was created in an attempt to make enough profit over the years to reduce or eliminate that shortfall, because the alternative was to seize and sell the Kodak Limited assets that the government had a priority claim over, and if that had happened, less would have been realized, and Eastman Kodak would have been forced to cease operations and be liquidated.
I'm concerned that if Kodak Alaris is out of the amateur film business, everybody outside of the USA will only be able to buy from USA retail sources. If that happens, I doubt the professional film lines - including Ektachrome and all the black and white films - will be no more.
Eastman Kodak has no international distribution infrastructure capable of supporting still film.

Alaris never had a presence in Argentina beyond the Kodak Moments website; the film was 100% gray market and was disappearing. The agreement with Cinestil changed everything, and in the short time since this publication, there are more Kodak films and Kodak products marketed by Cinestil than were seen in the Alaris era. Time will tell if I'm wrong, but I think we'll be better off here without Alaris on the market.

 

[MattKing]

Alaris never had a presence in Argentina beyond the Kodak Moments website; the film was 100% gray market and was disappearing. The agreement with Cinestil changed everything, and in the short time since this publication, there are more Kodak films and Kodak products marketed by Cinestil than were seen in the Alaris era. Time will tell if I'm wrong, but I think we'll be better off here without Alaris on the market.

Cinestill is probably set up to be a local distributor in Argentina and if they are selling the still films, they probably have been buying from KA. KA has only ever sold to local distributors - never to retailers or individuals.
Of course Cinestill is the worldwide distributor for the very new maker of the Kodak branded photo-chemicals, but that is a very new situation.

 

[polaromar]

I don't think we need to be too kind to Alaris here. Kodak had a responsibility to the UK government and Alaris was perhaps the lesser of two evils, but I think it is also hard to argue that Alaris was anything more than a vehicle for extracting value from Kodak's remains.

Keep in mind, this is Kodak, the photographic giant we are talking about. EK already has a massive distribution network due to their motion picture business and they've set up still distribution before, it's not like Filmotec who were basically the remnants of ORWO's R&D department. I don't think there's much to worry about here.

Thanks very much. I either forgot that or never saw it. That explains the longevity of Alaris' use of the brand name. Not sure if that implies exclusivity or has much to do with either exlusivity or perpetuality of their film distribution. Apparently not, though.

No problem! You're exactly on point - the wording is confusing and very general. Which may explain the break they've been able to achieve here.

Would all this be expected to have an impact on the prices?

I doubt it will lower the prices, but it might keep them more stable. For sure EK will get more profit selling direct which will keep them stable, and hopefully, open the doors for more film in the future. Additionally this might tariff-proof Kodak film since it is MiUSA and being shipped from Rochester, instead of being routed through the UK via Alaris HQ.

...which, come to think of it, might be the new owner's strategy. This would track with EK being allowed to sell direct in North America only.

 

[thinkbrown]

Additionally this might tariff-proof Kodak film since it is MiUSA and being shipped from Rochester, instead of being routed through the UK via Alaris HQ.

...which, come to think of it, might be the new owner's strategy. This would track with EK being allowed to sell direct in North America only.

Honestly, this is the most plausible explaination I've heard yet.

 

[MattKing]

Keep in mind, this is Kodak, the photographic giant we are talking about. EK already has a massive distribution network due to their motion picture business and they've set up still distribution before, it's not like Filmotec who were basically the remnants of ORWO's R&D department. I don't think there's much to worry about here.

The motion picture distribution infrastructure was essentially a skeleton of its former self by the time the bankruptcy happened, and even when it was at its zenith, it was dwarfed by the distribution network for C41 and RA4 chemicals and and RA4 paper, and the still film distribution infrastructure.
Essentially, it was the cost burden imposed by that infrastructure that made Kodak bankrupt.
Kodak Alaris took on some of the employee obligations for some of the people formerly working in the sales and marketing and distribution parts of EK, which definitely help EK emerge from bankruptcy, but the relatively very small number of people left to deal with the motion picture business were essentially a statistical blip.
Even back in its prime, in western Canada, the sales, marketing and distribution group - which my Dad was a part of - only had one or two people with responsibilities for the commercial motion picture business. A much greater number worked on the rest of the product lines.
I would guess that I encountered more people (through my Dad) in the microfilm and office technology parts of Kodak Canada then motion picture people.

 

[MattKing]

Additionally this might tariff-proof Kodak film since it is MiUSA and being shipped from Rochester, instead of being routed through the UK via Alaris HQ.

...which, come to think of it, might be the new owner's strategy. This would track with EK being allowed to sell direct in North America only.

The head business office for Kodak Alaris' Kodak film business has always been in Rochester New York up to now, and as far as I'm aware all Kodak still film that is shipped through Kodak Alaris originates through there - it certainly is manufactured there.
Kodak Alaris was until recently merely been owned by UK interests - day to day management of the film business as well as its earlier Kodak paper and photo-chemical businesses - was always US based.
Historically, for a while, some of the Kodak Alaris contracted for Kodak branded photo-chemicals were manufactured in Germany, but Tetenal's bankruptcy put an end to that.

 

[Hassasin]

I seriously doubt in this day and age, expanding distributor list is difficult, time consuming, or costly. Frankly all EK has to do is make a deal with Amazon and most of the world is covered. It likely will have more to do with actual plans EK has.

 

[Agulliver]

Maybe there's a fixed amount of film that EK has to provide Alaris, and now it is profitable for EK to both fulfill it's contractual obligations with Alaris while still selling direct? Or possibly there's a deal where EK will handle North America while Alaris will handle the rest of the world? One can speculate.

Currently we do not know. But at least one major UK film retailer has said that all the retailers here have been instructed to not say anything "until the official announcement".

One does wonder where it leaves Alaris. The new owners will want to make money (AKA recoup their investment). The sales of Kodak still films to ordinary people was probably their most consistent moneyspinner. EK may well prefer to arrange distribution themselves if it can be achieved more simply.

 

[flavio81]

Looks like it's heading that way for camera film. For Alaris as such I wonder how much significance this has; it's evidently a big product for them, but they do lots more and this may fit into a strategic repositioning of the firm.

They should reposition themselves in the "prepare for crash landing" position.

 

[flavio81]

Some years ago PE explained why it may not be possible to bring the Kodachrome ever again. I am you are not serious but in a way we all miss PE.

I seriously miss Photo Engineer, real name "Rowland Mowrey". One of the inventors of the modern K-14 Kodachrome films!

He was the soul of APUG.
His knowledge was light years away from ours and it was an authoritative source we all could rely on.

I don't care about the original K-14 Kodachrome. I want Kodak to just slap the name onto some Ektachrome or Portra and label it as KodachromeIII or something. They'll sell more then they can make. People won't care about

Actually, it would not be real Kodachrome.

 

[baachitraka]

I seriously miss Photo Engineer, real name "Rowland Mowrey". One of the inventors of the modern K-14 Kodachrome films!

He was the soul of APUG.
His knowledge was light years away from ours and it was an authoritative source we all could rely on.



Actually, it would not be real Kodachrome.

Yesterday, I was reading his messages on Phenidone, Dimezone and Dimezone-S...

 

[Cholentpot]

I seriously miss Photo Engineer, real name "Rowland Mowrey". One of the inventors of the modern K-14 Kodachrome films!

He was the soul of APUG.
His knowledge was light years away from ours and it was an authoritative source we all could rely on.



Actually, it would not be real Kodachrome.

Tell me something I don't know.

 

[koraks]

One of the inventors of the modern K-14 Kodachrome films!

Ron had many feats to write to his name, but I doubt this is one of them. I think his career significantly postdated virtually all of the work on K-14 that happened at Kodak.
One of the major things he often mentioned and that still has practical relevance today is his work on RA4 paper blixes.

They should reposition themselves in the "prepare for crash landing" position.

I wouldn't know. And I don't think you're in a position to know, either.

 

[MattKing]

Ron had many feats to write to his name, but I doubt this is one of them. I think his career significantly postdated virtually all of the work on K-14 that happened at Kodak.
One of the major things he often mentioned and that still has practical relevance today is his work on RA4 paper blixes.

Sorry to correct, bur Ron (Rowland Mowrey) is one of the two named patent holders on the K-14 patent.
As I understand it, US patents can only be issued with individual names attached to them - not corporate names.
And Ron did enough important work on the K-14 patent to be chosen as one of the two Kodak employees named.

 

[koraks]

I stand corrected on the K-14 remark; I was thinking of earlier Kodachrome versions.

 

[MattKing]

Ron, being Ron, was likely to refer to the K-14 work as being actually a team effort whenever the subject of the patent came up.

 

[flavio81]

Tell me something I don't know.

In 1518, dozens of people in Strasbourg, France, began to dance uncontrollably and did not stop, with many eventually dancing themselves to death.

 

[flavio81]

Ron had many feats to write to his name, but I doubt this is one of them. I think his career significantly postdated virtually all of the work on K-14 that happened at Kodak.

Doubt no more!

The patent describes the K14 steps

 

[flavio81]

Sorry to correct, bur Ron (Rowland Mowrey) is one of the two named patent holders on the K-14 patent.

Lol... i posted the same thing before reading your message!

 

[koraks]

In 1518, dozens of people in Strasbourg, France, began to dance uncontrollably and did not stop, with many eventually dancing themselves to death.

Saint Vitus dance; once thought to be caused by ergotism, but that hypothesis didn't really pan out. Try again.

 

[Cholentpot]

In 1518, dozens of people in Strasbourg, France, began to dance uncontrollably and did not stop, with many eventually dancing themselves to death.

Come on, everyone knows this one.

 

[Agulliver]

In 1518, dozens of people in Strasbourg, France, began to dance uncontrollably and did not stop, with many eventually dancing themselves to death.

Common knowledge. Peter Gabriel even wrote a song about it.

 

[koraks]

Common knowledge. Peter Gabriel even wrote a song about it.

Now that I did not know. You win the game (for me)!

 

[BrianShaw]

My older brother was diagnosed with St. Vitus dance (the disease, Sydenham's chorea, not the art form). Turned out that he just had a small and weak bladder. Later he was diagnosed with an abnormally high IQ. To me, neither could possibly have been true.