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Kodak announces reorganization

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RattyMouse said:
Come on PE!!!! This is Kodak!! They have to survive!!!! What would a world be like without Kodak films?
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The Titanic disaster happened 100 years ago and we are still very much aware of it (as opposed to many other things that many have been around in 1912). Perhaps the same will be true of Kodak in 2112?
 
RattyMouse said:
Come on PE!!!! This is Kodak!! They have to survive!!!! What would a world be like without Kodak films?
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I don't mean this as a slant against Kodak at all, but if Kodak disappeared, we'd have Velvia and Reala and Superia and Provia and Neopan and Acros and all the wonderful Ilford films, not to mention the niche players like Efke and Foma. The film world would be hurt (I'd sorely miss Ektar 100, for example, just like I already miss Plus-X) but the world would soldier on.

I don't fear Kodak's demise, particularly; I do fear the day when we might lose our last C41 or E6 film. I think black and white film will be available for a considerable time yet, but I'm not so sure about E6.
 
Normally I would say that this news represents a good short selling opportunity of their stock, but at a price of $0.28/share maybe not so much.
 
I just read in the WSJ today or yesterday that Perez wants a $2million bonus if he gets Kodak out of reorganization. When is the board going to dump that chump?
 
PhotoJim said:
I don't mean this as a slant against Kodak at all, but if Kodak disappeared, we'd have Velvia and Reala and Superia and Provia and Neopan and Acros and all the wonderful Ilford films, not to mention the niche players like Efke and Foma. The film world would be hurt (I'd sorely miss Ektar 100, for example, just like I already miss Plus-X) but the world would soldier on.

I don't fear Kodak's demise, particularly; I do fear the day when we might lose our last C41 or E6 film. I think black and white film will be available for a considerable time yet, but I'm not so sure about E6.
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I can live without them just fine in black and white. The only Kodak product in black and white that I use that I can't replace easily with something exactly the same (D76, Rapid Fix - I already buy the Legacy Pro brand of that because I can buy 5 gallons, not the too small 1 gallon or too large 25) or slightly different but totally fine or sometimes better is Tri-X. I'd miss it, but I'd live fine with HP5+. I use T-Max RS but could use DD-X. I just bought some HC110 to play with for the first time but I'm not hooked yet and even if I am, there's Ilfotec HC.

I can live without them fine in E6...oh, that's right, I already am. :sad: I don't shoot much E6 but I preferred Astia, which is gone, which I replaced with E100G, which is gone...left with Provia, which is nice but just too contrasty much of the time. I always got along better with E100VC than with Velvia but that's me. Anyway, it's already gone so not much to worry about.

It's C41 I'd really, really miss from Kodak. Fuji makes C41 film but they are way behind the Portras and Ektar and, what's even worse for some of us, don't seem to make theirs in sheet film sizes, or don't import them here at any rate. Granted that could change if Kodak stopped making C41 film.

Black and white - no worries.
Color positive - already gone. Lamented but not so important to me now, and Fuji is still in the game for now.
Color neg - Kodak, please don't die.
 
Roger Cole said:
Black and white - no worries.
Color positive - already gone. Lamented but not so important to me now, and Fuji is still in the game for now.
Color neg - Kodak, please don't die.
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Black and white - Ilford user - plenty of excellent products (and Kodak b/w film hasn't been very available where I live for some time anyway. Did like their papers.)
Colour positive - Previously used Elite Chrome, but now forced back to Fuji.
Colour neg - only use it for 'happy snappy' shots and quite content to use Fuji's.

Consequently (realistically and unemotionally) no vested interest in Kodak's fate unless there was a chance of bringing back colour positive.

However, (emotionally) it was sad to see last week that Plymouth's Kodak shop has closed.

Steve
 
I shoot mainly color neg when I shoot color, aside from some 35mm slides for projection and, as I said about Fuji color neg 1) I don't personally like it nearly as well, and 2) it isn't available in sheets. Film doesn't stop at 120.

I agree about black and white. I use a few other things but the only thing I'd miss is Tri-X. Well, ok, I'd also miss TMZ now that I think about it but Delta 3200 is close enough and I might even benefit from standardizing my ultra fast film across 35mm and 120.
 
If Kodak were to go out of business then there is just the little matter of the adverse affects of decreasing competition on the consumer.

pentaxuser
 
Amen to that one. I shudder to think what the repercussions would be.

Kodak makes a lot of film. People like us buy a lot of Kodak film. If they go out of business and stop making film, who picks up the slack? And at what cost? Lots of demand and very little supply. Oh...what a headache. $10.99 a roll film might look like a real bargain in a couple a years.
 
Pioneer said:
Amen to that one. I shudder to think what the repercussions would be.

Kodak makes a lot of film. People like us buy a lot of Kodak film. If they go out of business and stop making film, who picks up the slack? And at what cost? Lots of demand and very little supply. Oh...what a headache. $10.99 a roll film might look like a real bargain in a couple a years.
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Fujifilm would pick up the supply, at least for color print film and a bit of b & w. They would probably do very well with the added volume.
 
It will be interesting to see if Kodak can find a buyer for film manufacturing who wants both the equipment and the name. My biggest fear is they will want only the name.
 
For a variety of reasons, Fuji may not be able to pick up the slack if Kodak ceases film production.

PE
 
Photo Engineer said:
For a variety of reasons, Fuji may not be able to pick up the slack if Kodak ceases film production.

PE
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I agree. Increasing your volume out the door for this type of product is not like Saudia Arabia opening up the spigot. Even if Fuji or Ilford have some idle coating machines standing by just waiting to fire up, which I very seriously doubt, the raw materials to supply them just will not be there. Almost all manufacturing companies today work on a very tight supply line where materials arrive at almost the same time they are ready to use them. And then the suppliers themselves probably can't ramp up that fast. Remember, Japan is one of the main practitioners of "just in time" supply chains. Companies are starting to rethink this practice based on some recent natural disasters but nobody has changed the practice yet.

And then there is the QC issue. Just turning up the machines isn't all that has to be done. Then comes the issue of shipping the product to the point where it can be sold. I could go on but I am willing to bet it would take at least 12 months to see any increase in supply from any of the other manufacturers, and that estimate is almost certainly wildly optomistic. Realistically it will likely be 3 years and the price increase will be dramatic.

Kodak may be in trouble, and production is nowhere near what it used to be, but they still pump out a bunch of film. All I have to say is I hope you have lots of film in your freezer if Kodak stops making film, cause it is gonna be a bit of a dry spell. :confused:
 
I surely hope Kodak stays in business but at the very least keep the film and chemistry operations running. My guess is those divisions make money so they should hopefully survive even if it's separated out. I will add, economics being as they are if there's profit to be made in film and chemistry there will be someone making it. Remember what happened with Polaroid....the engineers banded together and formed the impossible project. I also think the lomorgraphy movement....if it's not just a "fad" will help. I should add one final thing there are people who don't even know people still shoot film. Funny story, I was talking about film shooting with someone and someone else came over and when I told him what we were discussing he didn't even know film still existed (and this is a bright educated person.)
 
Stock Up on Little Yellow Boxes

I am not an expert on Kodak or the film business. I do believe that Kodak will stay in business. At least I hope so. But I do know a fair amount about business and what it takes to run and manage a business. I have been following Kodak's little drama with great interest for quite awhile because I personally believe that the outcome will have a huge impact on whether film is able to maintain the small surge it has recently seen, or whether that surge is strangled before it has a chance to qualify as a true come back. I do not believe that film will ever totally go away, it still has a place in our world. But whether you want to believe it or not, that world of film will shrink dramatically, and quickly, if Kodak's film business goes under. Every now and then I read a little post from someone exhorting us to go buy some Kodak film. I think that the movie industry will have a much larger impact on the film business, and I am not sure that a few APUG members, or DPUG members, can really have that big an impact. But it certainly can't hurt. Don't ignore the other film companies, we certainly need them too. But, if you can afford it, try to buy a few extra rolls in the little yellow box. If nothing else, stock up your freezer a bit. You may be glad you did.

Now, before you think that I am just a doomsayer, I can assure you I am not. I am betting more than my film money on Kodak making a comeback. I am not so sure that their current management can pull it off, but I am still buying up their stock. I certainly do not recommend that you do the same as it is probably a fool's play. I know that it is a bit of a speculative play right now but I think that Kodak, and especially film, has a very bright future ahead, and at the current stock prices I cannot resist. :whistling:
 
I just checked their financials on the WSJ site and indeed they're in the hole big time. However if they can get money to pay off their debts and separate the profitable parts of their business they might make it....in which case Pioneer at 25 cents/share you might win on this one..but it's definitely one for your "Mad money" not money you're not willing to see disappear.
 
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