Kodacolor 100. New

[Alan Edward Klein]

Just like Fuji in the USA, and probably other parts of the world as well.
Same for Harman/Ilford in the USA and Canada, and probably lots of other places in the world.
Any manufacturer that has exclusive distributors anywhere in the world has made the decision - for really good reasons - to do things that way.

But Alaris-Eastman relationship was a shotgun marriage created by a bankruptcy judge. It didn't happen in a free market, where other distributors could have been selected by Eastman who are not as greedy as Alaris. And vice versa.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

This is strange. These two "new" films have appeared on the Kodak website. At the same time, they are not listed on the Alaris website, but Color Plus 200 and ProImage 100 are also gone. My theory is that these two films have been rebranded as Kodacolor and will be distributed by Kodak.

It seems Alaris and Eastman made a deal as I alluded to earlier. Exactly what the full scope is unknown at this time. To me, it seems they're attacking the low-cost film market. Running the distribution through Alaris is pushing costs too high. I suspect Alaris gets a royalty from Kodak sales of these films, although I don;lt know why Alaris would agree to this. It could also be that Eastman can more easily distribute in America without Alaris accounting for why it's only being sold in America, for now. Something's afoot. I suspect major changes. It's going to be interesting.

 

[polaromar]

Wasn't there something about Alaris losing certain contractual rights next year, as part of the bankruptcy agreement, or is my mind making things up?

 

[Cholentpot]

But Alaris-Eastman relationship was a shotgun marriage created by a bankruptcy judge. It didn't happen in a free market, where other distributors could have been selected by Eastman who are not as greedy as Alaris. And vice versa.

Next up, Kodak should be able to manufacture white label films for third parties. Out with the old, we're still limiting Kodak based on laws from two generations ago.

 

[MattKing]

Next up, Kodak should be able to manufacture white label films for third parties. Out with the old, we're still limiting Kodak based on laws from two generations ago.

They already can - they have never been restrained from doing so.

 

[MattKing]

But Alaris-Eastman relationship was a shotgun marriage created by a bankruptcy judge. It didn't happen in a free market, where other distributors could have been selected by Eastman who are not as greedy as Alaris. And vice versa.

I don't know about what sort of shotgun marriages you are familiar with, but the fact that the owners of KA paid hundreds of millions of dollars and relieved Eastman Kodak of many, many, many millions of dollars of employee related obligations is the largest dowry I've ever heard of.
No one else was willing to do this - the market had its opportunities and if anyone else bid - doubtful - it would have been even less beneficial to Eastman Kodaks creditors.
They were the ones in the driver's seat, and they were the ones who lost less than they otherwise would have, but were never made whole.
If that deal hadn't been made, this would be a moot point, because there would be no Eastman Kodak or other Kodak film - certainly nothing manufactured in the USA.

 

[loccdor]

It's a little funny the way Cinestill is portraying it. I received this email in my inbox from them.

Notice they're careful not to say a familiar "film" is back. A familiar name is back.

 

[MattKing]

Where might that be from?
Is it a clue that Cinestill might be doing the distribution/marketing?

 

[loccdor]

@MattKing Cinestill mailing list email. I received it 2 days ago.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I don't know about what sort of shotgun marriages you are familiar with, but the fact that the owners of KA paid hundreds of millions of dollars and relieved Eastman Kodak of many, many, many millions of dollars of employee related obligations is the largest dowry I've ever heard of.
No one else was willing to do this - the market had its opportunities and if anyone else bid - doubtful - it would have been even less beneficial to Eastman Kodaks creditors.
They were the ones in the driver's seat, and they were the ones who lost less than they otherwise would have, but were never made whole.
If that deal hadn't been made, this would be a moot point, because there would be no Eastman Kodak or other Kodak film - certainly nothing manufactured in the USA.

Regardless of the cost of the dowry, they've been stuck with each other since. Divorce is hard.

 

[MattKing]

Regardless of the cost of the dowry, they've been stuck with each other since. Divorce is hard.

As one who used to help people with divorces, I can assure you that divorces come in all sorts of flavours.

 

[koraks]

As one who used to help people with divorces

Alright, that's it; I'm going to tell my wife to stay the heck away from you. LOL

 

[loccdor]

I can assure you that divorces come in all sorts of flavours.

My favorite is pistachio.

 

[Samu]

The package shown here does not say "Kodak". It might just be possible to sell this film through other channels than Alaris. It is called Kofacolor, and it has the logotype of Eastmn Kodak in it, but not the word "Kodak" anywhere in the film carton shown. Maybe this is a loophole in their agreement with Alaris. If the agreement is about Kodak film, it could be argued this is not a Kodak film - at least not more than an Eastman Kodak stock sold as CineStill or Fuji.

 

[MattKing]

The package shown here does not say "Kodak". It might just be possible to sell this film through other channels than Alaris. It is called Kofacolor, and it has the logotype of Eastmn Kodak in it, but not the word "Kodak" anywhere in the film carton shown. Maybe this is a loophole in their agreement with Alaris. If the agreement is about Kodak film, it could be argued this is not a Kodak film - at least not more than an Eastman Kodak stock sold as CineStill or Fuji.

See post #66 in this thread, and the internet review linked therein.
The edge printing on the film itself says Kodak - not Kodacolor.
I still would like to know whether it is on acetate or Estar substrate.

 

[ChrisLA]

The package shown here does not say "Kodak". It might just be possible to sell this film through other channels than Alaris. It is called Kofacolor, and it has the logotype of Eastmn Kodak in it, but not the word "Kodak" anywhere in the film carton shown. Maybe this is a loophole in their agreement with Alaris. If the agreement is about Kodak film, it could be argued this is not a Kodak film - at least not more than an Eastman Kodak stock sold as CineStill or Fuji.

It says "Kodak" in the logo.

 

[Cholentpot]

They already can - they have never been restrained from doing so.

Have they done this in the past? I never got my Walgrocer 400 back and it was Kodak. It was fuji, ferannia, 3m, or any other company. Kodak stuck with Kodak.

 

[xtol121]

@MattKing I’ll let you know tomorrow what the base is. We have a few rolls at the lab. I’m going to do some 1:1 tests comparing pro image and color plus to the new kodacolor variants.

 

[MattKing]

Have they done this in the past? I never got my Walgrocer 400 back and it was Kodak. It was fuji, ferannia, 3m, or any other company. Kodak stuck with Kodak.

You miss the core of what I posted.
If you have/had the money, there has always been an opportunity to get Eastman Kodak to coat film for you.
Not Kodak film, but film to your specifications.
They would refuse to re-label their own product, or to produce product for you that essentially duplicated their product, but they have always been available to help you achieve your dream of being the supplier of, say, Cholenpot 200 film.
The costs are/were very high, because the minimum order quantities and setup charges are/were very high.
Much of the early Polaroid film products were at least partially made by Kodak under just such an arrangement.

 

[MattKing]

@MattKing I’ll let you know tomorrow what the base is. We have a few rolls at the lab. I’m going to do some 1:1 tests comparing pro image and color plus to the new kodacolor variants.

Thanks!

 

[mshchem]

As one who used to help people with divorces, I can assure you that divorces come in all sorts of flavours.

I thought it is divources in Canada.

 

[koraks]

I thought it is divources in Canada.

Or maybe...devourses.

 

[brbo]

My theory...

Alaris wanted to get rid of Pro Image 100 and ColorPlus 200 and that opened the door for EK.

Alaris never was too keen on those two films. ColorPlus was the film that probably had the longest supply issues back when EK was generally struggling to meet demand for film. Pro Image 100 was never made available in single boxes (5-packs only). I think that Alaris established that there is not enough market/price differentiation between ColorPlus 200 and Gold 200 and decided to streamline their film range with Gold and Ultramax as their only consumer films (with probably slightly higher price since they wouldn't be cannibalised by Pro Image and ColorPlus anymore).

I can't shake the feeling that the introduction of Kodacolor 100/200 is a result of tension between KA and EK. The former chasing the highest margins and the latter also needs to look at growing the volume (especially after upgrades to their film production lines).

Lets hope EK can capitalise on this and that someday they can also market their pro line directly again. Sadly, I won't contribute much since I really don't like ColorPlus 200 and Pro Image 100 and Kodakcolor 100 will probably be something very similar if not the same.

 

[brbo]

This is strange. These two "new" films have appeared on the Kodak website. At the same time, they are not listed on the Alaris website, but Color Plus 200 and ProImage 100 are also gone. My theory is that these two films have been rebranded as Kodacolor and will be distributed by Kodak.

Gone?! Were they ever listed? On which page?

I don't remember ColorPlus 200 or Pro Image 100 having a place on Kodak Alaris web pages, ever. Do you have a link to such page (on https://web.archive.org)?

 

[Agulliver]

Color Plus had the biggest backlog because it was one of the most popular films. I think Gold and Color Plus are 1st and 2nd best sellers, I seem to recall reading. I don't think that Alaris would have chosen Color Plus as one to drop, especially if EK were going to distribute a similar or identical film themselves at a similar price. Joe Public in Wal-Mart or wherever won't even be aware of Kodak-Alaris and will just see the familiar Kodak logo on a cheap 200ISO colour film and think "cool, that's what I want."