Issue with B&W film development

[Sirius Glass]

OK Was that the only film and only winter and was this in SoCal? I was hoping to at least narrow down a range of the actual conditions in terms of humidity and temp that may cause this issue

pentaxuser

Washington DD which normally has high humidity.

 

[albada]

I buy leather moccasins from a place in Canada. Brown Bear company, they sell slippers with copper rivets to ground wearers. Probably not real popular with electricians.

But would be perfect for us hobbyists who tinker with electronics. Brown Bear also sells an earthing headband, so the electricity will flow through my brain before it leaves. That'll help.
Really. Their web page (link) says this electric headband can "reduce stress, relieve muscle and arthritis pain, headache symptoms, alleviate menstrual symptoms...".

 

[oxcanary]

Can it cure the common cold - I’ll take two!

 

[Ivo Stunga]

Just to chime in - the possibility of discharge during bulk loading by shop Vs normal camera operation is far greater.
It's a defect caused either at (descending) factory > bulk loading > photographer.

 

[mshchem]

But would be perfect for us hobbyists who tinker with electronics. Brown Bear also sells an earthing headband, so the electricity will flow through my brain before it leaves. That'll help.
Really. Their web page (link) says this electric headband can "reduce stress, relieve muscle and arthritis pain, headache symptoms, alleviate menstrual symptoms...".

They're telling people to plug the 16 foot cable into a grounded outlet. That would be an effective ground, not sure I'm a customer

 

[jarek_waw]

A bit off topic but connect to teh post: How can I post-edit the message? I do not see any button, option for that.

 

[Sirius Glass]

A bit off topic but connect to teh post: How can I post-edit the message? I do not see any button, option for that.

There is a limited amount of time for one to edit a post, then it is not possible to edit it.

Welcome to APUG Photrio!!​

 

[MattKing]

Sirius is correct. The "edit" button disappears after a short time. As a result of that, people learn to read through a thread to see how it evolves.
A very long time ago, later edits were permitted - and it lead to some totally confusing and nonsensically absurd results.
And yes - welcome to Photrio. Your sharing your experience, and how this thread has evolved, is bound to help others.

 

[jarek_waw]

Hmmm.
Actually I wanted to change the pictures to show more discharge traces and less children (as not being important in that case). Is it still possible?

 

[snusmumriken]

Out of curiosity, how many frames out if the roll were affected by the static, and where were they in the roll (eg grouped near one end / at intervals throughout the film)? I’m just wondering to what extent the static penetrates the layers of film.

 

[jarek_waw]

Hi,
Frames: 3, 4, 5, 17, 22, 24, 26, 29, 36, 37,

 

[jarek_waw]

Out of curiosity, how many frames out if the roll were affected by the static, and where were they in the roll (eg grouped near one end / at intervals throughout the film)? I’m just wondering to what extent the static penetrates the layers of film.

Hi,
Frames: 3, 4, 5, 17, 22, 24, 26, 29, 36, 37,

 

[Sirius Glass]

Out of curiosity, how many frames out if the roll were affected by the static, and where were they in the roll (eg grouped near one end / at intervals throughout the film)? I’m just wondering to what extent the static penetrates the layers of film.

Hi,
Frames: 3, 4, 5, 17, 22, 24, 26, 29, 36, 37,

The frame locations have nothing to do with static electricity. Static electric discharge is related to very low humidity and rapid film advancement. Pull Scotch tape quickly off the roll and it will try to adhere to anything in the area, pull the tape slowly and the tape will not be attracted to nearby objects.

 

[snusmumriken]

The frame locations have nothing to do with static electricity. Static electric discharge is related to very low humidity and rapid film advancement. Pull Scotch tape quickly off the roll and it will try to adhere to anything in the area, pull the tape slowly and the tape will not be attracted to nearby objects.

Behind my question was a vague idea that we might be able to guess whether the discharge arose as a result of a single event, like pulling tape; or repeated events, like when running the film too quickly, eg through a light trap. Sadly, I’m none the wiser.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Behind my question was a vague idea that we might be able to guess whether the discharge arose as a result of a single event, like pulling tape; or repeated events, like when running the film too quickly, eg through a light trap. Sadly, I’m none the wiser.

Static discharge goes from one layer of film to another layer of film that is being separated from the first.

 

[snusmumriken]

Static discharge goes from one layer of film to another layer of film that is being separated from the first.

Do you happen to know how many layers it can penetrate?

 

[Sirius Glass]

Do you happen to know how many layers it can penetrate?

Typically layer to layer. Theoretically it could go through layers but I doubt that would happen.

 

[Ivo Stunga]

When I played around with piezo igniter on expired slide film, sometimes I got 2 if not all three primary colors present in the "lightning" strike, but most of the times it was one color/one layer. So this depends on chance and the power of discharge.

 

[Anon Ymous]

Yesterday I processed a Fomapan 100 135 film, factory load, not bulk loaded. There's the, presumably lot code 023215-07 and the expiration date is 9-2025. There are static discharge marks in at least 10 frames. The clearer example can be seen on a blank frame below (with greatly exaggerated contrast):

And yes, the thin line on the left (running lengthwise on the film) is there on the film and not a scanning artefact. It's a scratch that appears in many frames. I seriously doubt it's camera related. The rest is simply dust. It's an interesting and very affordable film, but sadly it's not worth much if it's plagued with defects like these...

 

[Kino]

This could be a confectioning defect; trying to run their lines too fast in a cool, dry atmosphere.

This is a typical "peel-off" discharge, where the static discharges as the top layer leaves the roll, usually at high speed.

I have witnessed full width discharges in a cold, dry darkroom that were easily visible and were whitish/blue in color when the film was unwound too fast.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

What are the results from developing a virgin unexposed roll? If the marks are still there then it is a confecting problem.

No marks doesn't prove the problem is in the camera, though. It could be that the test roll just, by random chance, has no discharge marks.

The other related thread shows almost identical marks, so unless the same static discharge was in both cameras, improbable at best, then again the manufacturer is responsible.

 

[koraks]

The other related thread shows almost identical marks, so unless the same static discharge was in both cameras, improbable at best, then again the manufacturer is responsible.

The same issue has popped up at least 3 times over the past few months AFAIK, in all cases with within-date Fomapan film. I think odds are it's really confectioning-related.

 

[Anon Ymous]

The same issue has popped up at least 3 times over the past few months AFAIK, in all cases with within-date Fomapan film. I think odds are it's really confectioning-related.

My thoughts exactly...

 

[Sirius Glass]

Yesterday I processed a Fomapan 100 135 film, factory load, not bulk loaded. There's the, presumably lot code 023215-07 and the expiration date is 9-2025. There are static discharge marks in at least 10 frames. The clearer example can be seen on a blank frame below (with greatly exaggerated contrast):

View attachment 350824

And yes, the thin line on the left (running lengthwise on the film) is there on the film and not a scanning artefact. It's a scratch that appears in many frames. I seriously doubt it's camera related. The rest is simply dust. It's an interesting and very affordable film, but sadly it's not worth much if it's plagued with defects like these...

That is what I experienced on very dry windy days with static discharge.

 

[Anon Ymous]

That is what I experienced on very dry windy days with static discharge.

It wasn't dry, nor windy. It was an average humidity day and my first time noticing something like this with my films. The vast majority, if not all of the static discharge cases that have been mentioned in the forum were Foma. It's not IMHO a coincidence, it's a sign of problems during confectioning. And it's a shame, because Fomapan 100 is an interesting film. Oh, and a bit worrying since I recently bought a 100 ft roll of R100.