Is there really a strong interest in film photography?

[Pieter12]

Well none of us asked her to join us, so the blame is all on us.

I guess no-one had her contact information. Or knew of her.

 

[faberryman]

Your father was generous. Most who sell things like that do not accept returns.

Like I said, the guy tried to return it. My dad told him to jump in the lake. This was in the days before eBay adopted its the buyer is always right policy. Now if the buyer is dissatisfied, eBay gives the seller 15 minutes to refund the money, and if he doesn't, eBay deducts the money from the seller's bank account anyway. It takes a cut and remits the balance to the buyer. At least I think that's the way it goes these days. I haven't bought or sold anything on eBay for at least five years.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I guess no-one had her contact information. Or knew of her.

More of the latter than the former. She never crossed my path.

 

[Don_ih]

I guess no-one had her contact information. Or knew of her.

She might have been a lurker. Perhaps she would have joined if @Sirius Glass had posted some photos.

 

[CMoore]

She might have been a lurker. Perhaps she would have joined if @Sirius Glass had posted some photos.

I have a feeling we will never experience her scenario again.
But who knows....................

 

[Pieter12]

Maybe she was here, and didn't want to share any of her work as some choose not to do. You know, the quality of the images when they end up on the web. Or paranoid someone would steal her work (which they ended up doing anyway).

 

[Subversive Mk II]

Pixel wars ended a while back. Now they've declared war on mirrors and the mirrors seem to have lost before the battle was even fought.

Ve con Dios Pentax.

I know. When I eventually get something mirrorless I'll still be well behind the curve, but I'm not bothered.
Latest and greatest has always been phooey to me - I've always regarded most current (as in, current at the time) cameras as nothing more than male jewellery.

 

[Cholentpot]

I know. When I eventually get something mirrorless I'll still be well behind the curve, but I'm not bothered.
Latest and greatest has always been phooey to me - I've always regarded most current (as in, current at the time) cameras as nothing more than male jewellery.

I'm waiting a few more generations. They'll get it right at some point. I'd love a camera that I can adapt my dozens of lenses to and have peaking in my viewfinder.

 

[logan2z]

A film photography revival is developing in the Northwest

 

[MattKing]

A film photography revival is developing in the Northwest

I haven't been down to Glazers in Seattle since before Covid 19. I wonder what the film and darkroom section is like now - at one time it was wonderful, then when they moved to their new premises it shrunk considerably.

 

[logan2z]

I haven't been down to Glazers in Seattle since before Covid 19. I wonder what the film and darkroom section is like now - at one time it was wonderful, then when they moved to their new premises it shrunk considerably.

If they haven't already done so, it sounds like it might be time to expand it again!

 

[foc]

@logan2z . Thank you for sharing the link. It was an interesting read and delightful to hear more positive news (no pun intended) about film photography and film processing labs.

Just two quotes from the article:

“iPhone photos typically feel very perfected, and they’re very high-quality images,” says Hannah McCloud"

“There's something about the luck with film that you can't necessarily get with digital, no matter how much you edit,” says Ajay Gallardo

These made me think about when I started photography many, many years ago. My goal at the time was the opposite of the above. I wanted little or no grain, the perfect image, and the assurance that every frame would be perfectly exposed. Without knowing it, I wanted the iPhone quality (back in the 1970s).

Now the inherent qualities and limitations of film are their appealing aspects.

 

[faberryman]

“There's something about the luck with film that you can't necessarily get with digital, no matter how much you edit,” says Ajay Gallardo[/I]

What is it about film that involves the element of luck that is not present with digital?

 

[albireo]

What is it about film that involves the element of luck that is not present with digital?

A few I can think of on top of my head -

-variance in colour performance as a function of age of the film (colours interpreted by a CCD or CMOS sensor don't vary as a function of sensor's age)
-variance in macro-contrast as a function of development time
-variance in micro-contrast as a function of development type
-variance in grain morphology as a function of development type
-variance of tone as a function of the non-linearity of the inversion curve chosen.
-variance in results based on the age of the chemistry (think small external lab using spent C41 vs pro lab with good turnaround)

You can decide to control all of the above, or you can decide to let some, or all, of the above loose ('luck'). Letting some of the above parameters loose is done sometimes out of ignorance, sometimes on purpose, even by extremely talented photographers, as a vehicle to channel creativity.

This is just a start of course.

 

[faberryman]

[/QUOTE]

A few I can think of on top of my head -

-variance in colour performance as a function of age of the film (colours interpreted by a CCD or CMOS sensor don't vary as a function of sensor's age)
-variance in macro-contrast as a function of development time
-variance in micro-contrast as a function of development type
-variance in grain morphology as a function of development type
-variance of tone as a function of the non-linearity of the inversion curve chosen.
-variance in results based on the age of the chemistry (think small external lab using spent C41 vs pro lab with good turnaround)

You can decide to control all of the above, or you can decide to let some, or all, of the above loose ('luck'). Letting some of the above parameters loose is done sometimes out of ignorance, sometimes on purpose, even by extremely talented photographers, as a vehicle to channel creativity.

This is just a start of course.

I never realized film development was such a crapshoot.

 

[foc]

What is it about film that involves the element of luck that is not present with digital?

With digital, the moment after you press the shutter button, you can view the image and see if it is correctly composed, exposed, and if it is to your liking.

With film, the luck part is some or all of the following:

• Was the camera loaded with film.
• Was the film loaded correctly and did it wind on.
• Were the correct aperture and shutter speed selected.
• Was the correct ASA/ISO set
• Was the camera back opened mid roll
• Was there any obstruction in the image path in the camera.
• Add your own here.

Then you have the home developing of the film:

• Was the film loaded correctly onto the developing spiral.
• Was the changing bag/darkroom light tight.
• Was the pre wash necessary
• Was the developer exhausted/expired.
• Was fix poured into the developing tank first.
• Was indicator stop too expensive.
• Was using a squeegee, the work of Satan.
• Add you own here.

Feel free to add to the list.

 

[faberryman]

With digital, the moment after you press the shutter button, you can view the image and see if it is correctly composed, exposed, and if it is to your liking.

With film, the luck part is some or all of the following:

• Was the camera loaded with film.
• Was the film loaded correctly and did it wind on.
• Were the correct aperture and shutter speed selected.
• Was the correct ASA/ISO set
• Was the camera back opened mid roll
• Was there any obstruction in the image path in the camera.
• Add your own here.

Then you have the home developing of the film:

• Was the film loaded correctly onto the developing spiral.
• Was the changing bag/darkroom light tight.
• Was the pre wash necessary
• Was the developer exhausted/expired.
• Was fix poured into the developing tank first.
• Was indicator stop too expensive.
• Was using a squeegee, the work of Satan.
• Add you own here.

Feel free to add to the list.

I think you are confusing luck with reading the instructions. It's a common mistake.

 

[albireo]

I never realized film development was such a crapshoot.

It is. Plenty of sources of variability. Do you shoot film?

 

[faberryman]

It is. Plenty of sources of variability. Do you shoot film?

For fifty years. You are confusing luck with variability. Like you said, you can control for variability.

 

[brbo]

With film, the luck…

You just convinced me. I’m, indeed, the luckiest person in the world.

Well, most of the time at least. I did shoot for half a day without realizing the film wasn’t winding this summer. In Venice (not the one in CA).

 

[albireo]

For fifty years. You are confusing luck with variability. Like you said, you can control for variability.

As stated, you might decide to surrender control for creative purposes.

Also I'm not confusing anything. I didn't say I agree with the above. You are shooting the messenger. I'm just trying to help you understand.

 

[faberryman]

As stated, you might decide to surrender control for creative purposes.

Also I'm not confusing anything. I didn't say I agree with the above. You are shooting the messenger. I'm just trying to help you understand.

Do you really think that when that guy said luck, he was talking about variance in grain morphology? He is "a recent film convert" who is having his film processed in the lab being featured in the article. I can hear the endorsement now: "Bring your film to Panda Lab. With any luck your film will turn out okay."

 

[perkeleellinen]

I didn't do any photography at all for two years, maybe 2005-2006 and then I had a digital camera for a year. When I got rid of that and started using my SLR again, that first roll was a bit of a 'have I done that right' moment. No way of checking and I get that a kid who grew up with camera phones and preview screens could feel that an old camera is a bit of a leap in the dark.

Seems like a good place to mention this:

My niece got married over the summer, they got a pro to shoot the formalities and I took along a Polaroid Impulse AF. Young crowd, mostly late 20s early 30s and they loved the Polaroid. I got so many good group shots, every wanted to pose and see the results. Sparked a few conversations as well amongst curious / keen 20-somethings looking for a new way of getting creative. It was nice. I'm not normally a brave photographer but I found the Polaroid plus some large glasses on wine really helped break the nerves.

 

[Pieter12]

With digital, the moment after you press the shutter button, you can view the image and see if it is correctly composed, exposed, and if it is to your liking.

With film, the luck part is some or all of the following:

• Was the camera loaded with film.
• Was the film loaded correctly and did it wind on.
• Were the correct aperture and shutter speed selected.
• Was the correct ASA/ISO set
• Was the camera back opened mid roll
• Was there any obstruction in the image path in the camera.
• Add your own here.

Then you have the home developing of the film:

• Was the film loaded correctly onto the developing spiral.
• Was the changing bag/darkroom light tight.
• Was the pre wash necessary
• Was the developer exhausted/expired.
• Was fix poured into the developing tank first.
• Was indicator stop too expensive.
• Was using a squeegee, the work of Satan.
• Add you own here.

Feel free to add to the list.

What you are describing is not luck, but operator mistakes. Why should that be appealing in any way?

 

[reddesert]

"Luck" with film shooting is taking the chance that you'll run into some incredibly negative person who picks apart any words that you use to describe your mental approach to photography.