Is there a tank for 120 film that doesn't f*****g leak???????? leaking lids nightmare

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

Seriously.....I have many Paterson tanks and lids and I nearly messed up an important shoot a few days ago as the developer flew out of the tank via the lid - needed up doing like stand developing and shaking the tank up and down....and actually, the negs came out perfect!! I'm especially concerned of getting Blix drops around my bathroom too......no issues with 4 x5 film as I have the superb Stearman Press SP-645 tank that's FINALLY sorted out this problem! BUT 120 film.....wow.....it's always an anxious moment getting the inversions done......

logan2z · Jul 18, 2024

I use the Jobo 1500 series tanks with hand inversion and haven't experienced leaks. Have you tried them?

neilt3 · Jul 18, 2024

I've always used Patterson tanks and never had a problem, maybe a few tiny drops dripping out after inverting the tank .
As you put the lid on , you burp it , so it's got negative pressure in the tank .
And it sounds like your shaking the tank in your post ?
Really ??
For inversion you just gently rotate the tank from the vertical or have it on a roller .
How the heck can you possibly get chemicals flying everywhere?
At the most I stand my tanks on a tray to catch any drips .

Nitroplait · Jul 18, 2024

Maybe your Paterson tanks are overused or even abused?
I have used many tanks of steel and plastic including Paterson.
I may experience an occasional drip when inverting the tanks but I doubt that can be helped if the tank lid should also be easily opened.
I wouldn’t trust any tank to be 100% drip proof - a drip tray is your friend.

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

neilt3 said:
I've always used Patterson tanks and never had a problem, maybe a few tiny drops dripping out after inverting the tank .
As you put the lid on , you burp it , so it's got negative pressure in the tank .
And it sounds like your shaking the tank in your post ?
Really ??
For inversion you just gently rotate the tank from the vertical or have it on a roller .
How the heck can you possibly get chemicals flying everywhere?
At the most I stand my tanks on a tray to catch any drips .

Hey Neil, I do normal inversions with rotations for 120 film nothing drastic.....the other day when the developer flew out I shook the tank to avoid d losing more chemicals as was on critical level for volume...I lost about 100ml.....and as I noted, the negatives came out perfectly thankfully. I burp the tank and all things as normal but somehow get leaking lids. I dont know, is it the heat over here that has made/makes the plastic lids more supple/brittle....who knows. I've been developing film since 1985 so not new to this but the problem persists!

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

Nitroplait said:
Maybe your Paterson tanks are overused or even abused?
I have used many tanks of steel and plastic including Paterson.
I may experience an occasional drip when inverting the tanks but I doubt that can be helped if the tank lid should also be easily opened.
I wouldn’t trust any tank to be 100% drip proof - a drip tray is your friend.

maybe I have to befriend the drip after all!!!! the drip tray is a good idea....had not thought of that

koraks · Jul 18, 2024

I don't quite understand. Paterson tanks do leak a few drops in my experience, but if you're doing manual inversions with one hand on the lid, I don't see how you'd get developer flying out of it. Maybe if the lid isn't seated properly and you're not holding on to it properly?

What I can see happening, is if you go from developer to something acidic (stop, bleach, blix) is that the formation carbon dioxide creates pressure and the lid pops. You can prevent this by pouring in the stop (etc), do a few inversions for maybe 10 seconds, then burp the lid, then do some more inversions for 10 seconds, burp again and then proceed as regular. Burping once or twice will get rid of the bulk of the carbon dioxide and overpressure. I don't see how you'd get overpressure doing development.

neilt3 · Jul 18, 2024

sperera said:
Hey Neil, I do normal inversions with rotations for 120 film nothing drastic.....the other day when the developer flew out I shook the tank to avoid d losing more chemicals as was on critical level for volume...I lost about 100ml.....and as I noted, the negatives came out perfectly thankfully. I burp the tank and all things as normal but somehow get leaking lids. I dont know, is it the heat over here that has made/makes the plastic lids more supple/brittle....who knows. I've been developing film since 1985 so not new to this but the problem persists!

It did sound as if your confusing the developing tank for a cocktail shaker !

But yes , just the odd few drips while doing agitation only end up on the tray I work over and stand them on while pouring in the chemicals .
You'd have to very very careless to splash chemicals anywhere if your working sensibly.
I don't get how the developer can fly out if you put the lid on correctly, assuming it hasn't spit at some point .
When I'm rotating the the tanks I usually have a hand on the lid anyway which would prevent it coming off , not that it ever has , but just as a precaution.
I've always done it that way.

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

it was a multi-reel Paterson tank for 3 reels.....in this case I had 2 in there.....I noticed the lid expanding up and then bam the developer shot out.....all that being said....I was too careless...my fault.....middle of the day, hot, humid, tired...you know...it wont happen again thats for sure but was wondering if there were any better tanks out there! a screw on lid....come on...3D print it someone and sort out these problems!!!!!

koraks · Jul 18, 2024

sperera said:
a screw on lid

Doesn't sound very ideal for e.g. color work or anything else that requires more or less exact timings.
Maybe a bayonet-style lid though, come to think of it. That might actually work. It'll be more leaky than the present design, but won't fall off. Then again, I've never had my regular Paterson or Jobo lids fall off, either. The only accidents I have with the lids is if I don't burp them as described above.

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

the leaks are the issue...the lid coming off is the first time ever....and it was partially off only....

koraks · Jul 18, 2024

OK, well, in that case, I really think the current rubber lid design is probably the best compromise.

On my older System 4 Paterson tank it's especially the screw cap that leaks. The top cap you use to pour in/drain the chemistry is actually fairly snug. The clamp lid on the Jobo tanks is slightly better overall IMO. If the few drops are a concern, then try the Jobo tanks. And the drip tray is a good suggestion, too.

guangong · Jul 18, 2024

I have new and old model Paterson tanks, Jobo tanks ( that I no longer use because reels are terrible), Nikor tanks…never a problem with leaks. The tanks should be inverted…after all it’s about developing film, not shaking a cocktail.

Andrew O'Neill · Jul 18, 2024

This is why I don't invert with Paterson tanks. I do figure 8's. I teach high school photography. I can't have a classroom of teens spilling chemicals all over themselves

Ivo Stunga · Jul 18, 2024

My 5 cents: it's about how one uses equipment. When closing the Patterson lid, press down the center of it. This will:
- get the lid closed by like 70% - just let the air out (burp) and press down perimeter and voila;
- create negative pressure inside - atmospheric pressure itself will keep the lid closed;
- create some space for gasses to expand if for whatever reason gasses are released.

Do this and forget about leaking Patterson lid

warden · Jul 18, 2024

Ivo Stunga said:
My 5 cents: it's about how one uses equipment. When closing the Patterson lid, press down the center of it. This will:
- get the lid closed by like 70% - just let the air out (burp) and press down perimeter and voila;
- create negative pressure inside - atmospheric pressure itself will keep the lid closed;
- create some space for gasses to expand if for whatever reason gasses are released.

Do this and forget about leaking Patterson lid

I push down on the lid lightly just before inversions and agree the burping/pressure method is helpful. Still my tanks leak but not badly, and I've come to accept it.

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

Thanks for all the messages......
Ivo from Latvia, perhaps a video showing what you do when you can would be welcome.....

neilt3 · Jul 18, 2024

sperera said:
it was a multi-reel Paterson tank for 3 reels.....in this case I had 2 in there.....I noticed the lid expanding up and then bam the developer shot out.....all that being said....I was too careless...my fault.....middle of the day, hot, humid, tired...you know...it wont happen again thats for sure but was wondering if there were any better tanks out there! a screw on lid....come on...3D print it someone and sort out these problems!!!!!

The only mistake I've made developing my film was after coming back from a long pub lunch .
Turns out fix is crap at developing film !
The clear negatives showed that ....

Regards a screw on lid , I had a tank that used ascre on lid once.
It leaked really badly .
I could only develop in that using the twizel stick .

Andrew O'Neill said:
This is why I don't invert with Paterson tanks. I do figure 8's. I teach high school photography. I can't have a classroom of teens spilling chemicals all over themselves

Is that not just natural selection ?

Ivo Stunga said:
My 5 cents: it's about how one uses equipment. When closing the Patterson lid, press down the center of it. This will:
- get the lid closed by like 70% - just let the air out (burp) and press down perimeter and voila;
- create negative pressure inside - atmospheric pressure itself will keep the lid closed;
- create some space for gasses to expand if for whatever reason gasses are released.

Do this and forget about leaking Patterson lid

That's exactly how I've done it since getting the Patterson tanks in the late 80's or early 90's .
Just a few times by drips seep out , not an issue .

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

a leaky lid would be the first dose of anxiety a newbie would have that 'they are doing it wrong' and would be put off.....surely, despite our techniques etc, someone can make a tank that doesn't leak no matter what???

retina_restoration · Jul 18, 2024

Consider steel tanks with hard rubber lids. I hate Patterson tanks.

BrianShaw · Jul 18, 2024

Andrew O'Neill said:
This is why I don't invert with Paterson tanks. I do figure 8's. I teach high school photography. I can't have a classroom of teens spilling chemicals all over themselves

I was waiting for someone else to admit to this so they take the heat insted of me. Thanks Andrew!

The Paterson lids, I find, are not always that easy to get fully seated and burped for some reason so I figure 8 or swizzle stick agitate with no ill effects... to me, my environment, or the film. And as @sperera said, the minor leakage was, indeed, a source of anxiety when I started processing film with that system. Even with figure-8 or swizzle stick agitation, I do that in a sink. If only it was a completely foolproof lid...

MARTIE · Jul 18, 2024

No problems with paterson tanks here, either.

I always expel the air and invert the tank with one hand top and bottom.
I also rotary process with paterson tanks, and they are as good as gold.

I never store the tanks with their lids on.

sperera · Jul 18, 2024

BrianShaw said:
I was waiting for someone else to admit to this so they take the heat insted of me. Thanks Andrew!

The Paterson lids, I find, are not always that easy to get fully seated and burped for some reason so I figure 8 or swizzle stick agitate with no ill effects... to me, my environment, or the film. And as @sperera said, the minor leakage was, indeed, a source of anxiety when I started processing film with that system. Even with figure-8 or swizzle stick agitation, I do that in a sink. If only it was a completely foolproof lid...

exactly.....we can add 'leak sweats' to 'film sweats' for new people to the art......I still, after all this time, get the sweats (esp in my climate) when the damn 120 film doesnt spool properly (paterson spools again).....I expect its because I use expired film thats been rolled up tight for decades.....

GregY · Jul 18, 2024

I use Kindermann stainless tanks with rubber lids and Nikor tanks with stainless lids... they all work as they should. My tanks have been used for decades. I got rid of Patterson plastic tanks and reels long ago. Whether you have 35mm or 120 film in them should have no effect on whether your Patterson tank leaks.....

BrianShaw · Jul 18, 2024

sperera said:
exactly.....we can add 'leak sweats' to 'film sweats' for new people to the art......

... and 'changing bag sweats'. This has, for some odd reason, become a constant problem of mine.

Is there a tank for 120 film that doesn't f*****g leak???????? leaking lids nightmare

sperera

logan2z

neilt3

Nitroplait

sperera

sperera

koraks

Moderator

neilt3

sperera

koraks

Moderator

sperera

koraks

Moderator

guangong

Andrew O'Neill

Moderator

Ivo Stunga

warden

sperera

neilt3

sperera

retina_restoration

BrianShaw

MARTIE

sperera

GregY

BrianShaw

Is there a tank for 120 film that doesn't f*****g leak???????? leaking lids nightmare

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency