Is it possible to print Portra 160 on llford Multigrade ?

Paul Howell

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No, color film has a orange mask layer. At one time Kodak made a special black and white paper for printing color negatives.
 

DREW WILEY

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No and Yes. The bigger problem is the very low contrast of Portra originals compared to typical black and white negative originals. I've successfully handled problems like this by generating a black and white film interpositive, and then, from that, a significantly higher contrast b&w printing internegative.

The orange mask should be nulled out in the earlier interpositive step, by using an equal orange density filter in the exposure light path (like a blank but developed piece of the same kind of Portra film).
 

AZD

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A long time ago when I had essentially unlimited experimental abilities in a school darkroom I naturally tried printing C41 negatives on variable contrast black and white paper. It “works”, but not particularly well. I recall having to use the #4 or 5 contrast filter plus very long exposure times due to that and the orange mask. Any grain is accentuated, just like with b&w negatives. The tonality can be odd due to the way R-G-B is converted to C-M-Y dye in the negative, and of course variable contrast filters are M-Y, so it’s all messed up to start with even before the orange mask.

That said… try it. You may not hate it. Occasionally a print looks reasonably acceptable. Not something I would recommend as standard practice though.

Kodak once had a panchromatic b&w paper called Panalure especially for printing C41 as monochrome. I never got to try it. It was killed off with the other Kodak papers 20 years ago.
 

koraks

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Exactly what @AZD says. Long exposure times, high contrast grade; results are hit & miss. If the print must be a darkroom print, then it can work this way. But for a technically better print, scan the color negative and then output in whatever way desired.
 

DREW WILEY

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Just do the double-negative route like I do, if you want to keep it all darkroom workflow.
Not all that difficult if you have a little practice and the right films.
 

MattKing

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ezphotolessons said:
the print may have a strange-other-worldly-tint.
Click to expand...

Not likely - the paper is still purely monochrome, unless you tone it.
The spectral response will be wonky though - items in the subject will be either lighter or darker in the print than in real life, depending on their colour.
 

DREW WILEY

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All of that is controllable when making the film interpositive, by using color contrast filtration just like over a camera lens when taking black and white shots (except that everything is opposite, filter-wise, because you're going negative to negative). I've gotten some stunning prints; but it's too much of a chore for routine use. Easier to just go out and shoot black and white film in the first place. But sometimes you only get one chance for an image which might work well in both color and b&w. Frankly, it's easier to make printing internegs from chrome film than fuss around with color negs. But all of this can be fun and challenging as long as you've got other options too, for when it does get frustrating.
 

DREW WILEY

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Again, why wonky? It's all correctible. One nice thing about the double negative technique is that the inter-positive will show you the same positive tonality as the final print, just lower contrast. And that still leaves you all kind of control options, both in the subsequent internegative step, and during final printing.
 

MattKing

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DREW WILEY said:
Again, why wonky? It's all correctible.
Click to expand...

Or more appropriately, it can be dealt with if you apply additional materials and additional techniques.
As @Mustafa Umut Sarac is apparently taking a darkroom printing course - perhaps even an introductory course - those additions may not be practical.
 

Don_ih

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DREW WILEY said:
The orange mask should be nulled out in the earlier interpositive step, by using an equal orange density filter in the exposure light path
Click to expand...

The orange mask would not be nulled out if you filtered the exposure through another orange mask. That's just more orange mask. Maybe a blue filter?
 

Samu

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It depends how you define the word "possible". Yes, you can print color film on B & W paper, but on multigrade, the grading system is based on color, and this will distort the result. Probably, dialing a lot of cyan from the color head would work against the orange mask, but the masking is not uniform, and the images are still colored.

It would be easier to use fixed grade paper for printing black and white from color negatives. Even this way, the results will not be perfect.
 

Don_ih

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And if you get it in your head to search out some Panalure, don't bother. None of it will be any good.

Koraks' advice is likely the best and easiest way to go.
 
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