Ilford Price Increase June 1st 2011

[perkeleellinen]

Everything is increasing, price inflation is huge: fuel, food, energy, clothes. About 6 months' ago it became cheaper to take the train rather than pay for petrol in the car, now train prices have increased. Thank God I've got a bicycle for short journeys. I'm sure most people are only keeping afloat because mortgage repayments are currently very cheap because of low interest rates. Two beers per week is a luxury, I've given up meat. Luckily I print small (5x7) from 35mm negs so price increases tend to be easier to absorb compared to others who print very large.

 

[Curt]

An interesting point is size. EW averaged 7x9 plus a fraction. Paul Strand made an overwhelming number of small prints. Many others similarly made smaller sized prints. Technology at various times in history made for small and large image sizes. We may see smaller silver gelatin prints again if paper prices increase to an unacceptable level.

Film is another question. In the future only the most dedicated will be working in the medium. See what happened to the Dye Transfer medium. All the hoping, wishing, and money won't bring it back. Enjoy what's left and strive to make the best prints you are capable of.

 

[Marco B]

Like most people here, film isn't really the issue for me either. It's definitely the price of paper that is killing my relationship with Ilford. I still use MGWT for my portraits, while everything else has been switched to Fomabrom Variant, which is about 1/2 the price over here in the US.

Count your blessings! With Ilford prices here in the Netherlands already being twice that in the US, I sincerely hope this next price increase will not include the Netherlands, and Ilford finally finds a more affordable distribution channel to the Netherlands...

Just imagine one 10 sheet pack of 20x24 inch paper of standard (non warmtone) Ilford MGIV at a price tag of maybe 150,- Euro ($215,-) up from Dead Link Removed

Well, maybe the real price increase will not be as dramatic as that, but with the current base price here in the Netherlands, even a 10% increase is a significant hit...

One screwed up print than sets you back enough to buy a meal at a cheap restaurant... or a bad night in a cheap hotel :confused:

 

[railwayman3]

Everything is increasing, price inflation is huge: fuel, food, energy, clothes. About 6 months' ago it became cheaper to take the train rather than pay for petrol in the car, now train prices have increased. Thank God I've got a bicycle for short journeys. I'm sure most people are only keeping afloat because mortgage repayments are currently very cheap because of low interest rates. Two beers per week is a luxury, I've given up meat. Luckily I print small (5x7) from 35mm negs so price increases tend to be easier to absorb compared to others who print very large.

This is all very true for many in the UK....our friends in the US do not realise the HUGE difference in fuel prices alone, just as one example.

I know many pensioners in the UK, who are "asset-rich" in terms of a large house, which they no longer need but cannot sell at a reasonable price, yet "cash-poor" in money for everyday costs, to the extent that they are cutting down on hobbies and social activities....yet these are often some of the older people who are keeping
analog alive and have the interest, time to and knowledge to encourage youngsters to try it.

And, at the other end of the age scale, younger people have family commitments, student loans to repay and houses to buy (average age of first-time buyers in their mid-30's)....where can high-cost hobbies come into this?

 

[Smudger]

It Just Gets Worse..

Here,in Kiwiland,at least..
We have long paid well over the odds for Ilford product,and I posted about this some time ago,but now it appears the two local distributors are prepared to ignore the fact they actually have any product - a search of both websites reveals not a single reference to any Harmon paper product,unless it is designed for Inkjet use.
Even reliable resellers no longer list Ilford papers ,suggesting that you email for current prices and availability.
Some sample prices though :based on high NZ$ versus US$ :
FP4/120 :US$9.84....HP5/120 :US$10.25....Delta100/120 :US$11.48

 

[A Sabai]

Perhaps I should order more film?

 

[rst]

Just imagine one 10 sheet pack of 20x24 inch paper of standard (non warmtone) Ilford MGIV at a price tag of maybe 150,- Euro ($215,-) up from Dead Link Removed

I think it is the same distributor for Germany and these prices are just insane. And that is the reason why I order my paper in the UK. There you can order 10 sheets of MG IV FB for around 70 Euros, add 20 Euros for shipping and you still save money with just one pack of 10 sheets. Now add some more paper to you order.

Cheers
Ruediger

 

[Rob Skeoch]

I'm a retailer in Canada for Ilford products. I haven't heard of any price changes from the official distributor. If I'll do I'll make a posting right away.
-Rob Skeoch

 

[Sim2]

For those not in the U.K. Monday (today) is a public Bank Holiday although I do not dpeak on behalf of Ilford it may be unlikely to expect a reply from Ilford (Simon Galley) until normal working hours are resumed tomorrow.

Hoping that there won't be an increase, again, but fearful nonetheless.

 

[mwdake]

"Will work for film" sign

That's a great idea, that is now my plan B.

 

[pentaxuser]

Marco, try AGPhotographic in the U.K. for your paper. It is about the best source I have found.

Sim2 I hope you are right but I cannot see how no increase is reconcilable with the announcement in the Harman Express News unless the price rise only affects ordering from Harman Express.

From my examination of Harman Express and even without any increase in price, ordering direct from Harman Express results in paying higher prices thancharged by most of the worthwhile retailers such as Silverprint and AgPhotograhic.

So as long as there is no increase in prices charged by Ilford to their retailers then crisis over except for Harman Express itself as the increase will make it even more uncompetitive.

pentaxuser

 

[R gould]

Marco, try these people for your paper and other supplies Dead Link Removed
Richard

 

[R gould]

Pextaxuser,
Can't remember the exact wording but there is something on the Harman express website that leads me to hope that it might only be the Harman express that is increasing prices,
Richard

 

[Roger Cole]

I'm glad that I'm in the US and can finally afford photography. If these prices, even adjusted for inflation, had been the case in my high school and college days when I was really getting into photography, or in the late 90s when I became interested again and got into large format, I couldn't have afforded it, or at least could have done a lot less of it. (At least, with Ilford paper - the east European stuff and even re-branded Arista Harman doesn't seem too bad to me now when I run it backwards through an inflation calculator - about what I was paying back then actually.) Now I have more money and far less time, with the result that I can afford to do all the photography I have time for, which isn't enough.

I am of somewhat mixed mind about this. On the one hand I understand, partly from past personal experience even though the materials were much cheaper then, how this sort of pricing can and will impact students and young adults who will be the ones that really need to become enthusiastic users if we're to keep traditional photography alive. On the other hand, "expensive hobby" is a pretty relative term. After learning to fly (see avatar...) photography and pretty much all my other hobbies still seem downright cheap. But then on the third hand, there's the time limitations that go with having a career, girlfriend, being a homeowner now etc. I literally don't have time to use enough materials for price to be a problem. Someone above saying if they used Ilford they'd be spending more on materials than on all their other bills was a bit shocking (unless that poster is a professional, maybe.) There's no way I could do that. In fact I don't think I could use that many materials if I just had my paycheck handed to me without having to put in my 40+ per week to earn it, what with all my other interests and obligations. I have other hobbies, for one thing.

Prices elsewhere, well - UK prices are a bit insane by US standards and other places are beyond that. At the prices quoted for the Netherlands I might just go rent airplanes (or buy a share of one) and fly more instead!

Another point - someone compared the price of darkroom paper and chemicals to ink and inkjet paper, but that's not fair if doing a direct comparison. Once a digital process is calibrated you needn't make a print until the image is the way you want it on the monitor. Even if you decide to tweak a bit more, two sheets would be about the most you'd use (or at least that I have when I've dabbled with such.) In the darkroom I will always go through several, sometimes as many as 10 or more, sheets of paper before I have a final print. There are some things you can do to save here. I usually make smaller work prints than the final print (use either the Kodak calculator wheel in the Darkroom Dataguide or a simple formula for such to convert to equivalent exposures when changing print size) for one, but it still takes more sheets per final print in my experience. I rather enjoy this process and seeing the image come along at different stages, but it does add to the cost.

 

[Роберт]

At the prices quoted for the Netherlands I might just go rent airplanes (or buy a share of one)

Just some Dutch internet prices:

ILFORD Delta 3200 Pro 135-36 1-stuks €8,50

ILFORD Pan F Plus 135-36 1-stuks €6,38

Source: Fotoworld.nl

I saw that Foma and Efke also rised their prices but it was around 10%.
For one Pan F I can almost buy three Efke 25 films in Holland. And for one D3200 almost four RPX 400 films.
Calculating back that a month salary in Ukraine is about US$ 200,00 this is going to be a mission impossible

 

[Marco B]

Prices elsewhere, well - UK prices are a bit insane by US standards and other places are beyond that. At the prices quoted for the Netherlands I might just go rent airplanes (or buy a share of one) and fly more instead!

Maybe we should strike a deal: I pay you to fly my orders to the Netherlands, and you buy the stuff at US prices for me...

With current prices in the Netherlands, I guess I'd still save money

Guess I need to start digging in my backyard to make room for a landing strip...

 

[Roger Cole]

Besides the fact the planes I fly don't have anywhere near trans Atlantic range the price differences, large as they are, are not THAT large.

I know from aviation forums what private flying costs in Europe and I couldn't afford it there either. About 2.5-3 times or more what it costs here but in that case the difference is mostly fuel and government fees.

Everything costs more there it seems.

 

[Simon R Galley]

Dear All,

Yes we have a price increase on June 1st, Worldwide.

This is obviously deeply regrettable and we do not take increasing our prices lightly. Obviously it ultimately affect volume. You have all seen the rise in the price of silver, we put up prices on February 1st 2011 calculatedv and based on silver prices on December 24th 2010 ( $ 28.00 per troy ounce ) since then we have bought silver at anywhere between $ 28.00 and $ 48.00 so everything we have manufactured and put into stock since December 24th has been at a much higher raw material price, we cannot absorb that level of increase and we must increase prices. We have done everything in our power to mitigate the increase, including even more stringent cost control, as part of these measures we also had to take the decision to reduce our workforce by 58 which is about 20.00% otherwise our price increase would have had to be much higher, this is a real human cost for the speculation in silver.

The almost unprecedented ( it has happened once before Bunker / Hunt ) speculation in silver damages all people who need to buy it and use to make things, and of course those who buy products containing silver.

We can only hope silver reduces significantly from its current level ( $ 38.00 ).

Our philosophy remains the same, we continue to make all products, none will be deleted and we will remain totally committed to producing the widest range of monochrome film, paper ( including the new ART 300 ) and chemistry, from any manufacturer, anywhere.

We thank all our customers who use and value ILFORD Photo products.

Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

 

[hpulley]

Will we see prices drop if silver somehow returns to $10/ounce?

 

[Simon R Galley]

Yes you would.

Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited

 

[coigach]

Dear All,

Yes we have a price increase on June 1st, Worldwide.

This is obviously deeply regrettable and we do not take increasing our prices lightly. Obviously it ultimately affect volume. You have all seen the rise in the price of silver, we put up prices on February 1st 2011 calculatedv and based on silver prices on December 24th 2010 ( $ 28.00 per troy ounce ) since then we have bought silver at anywhere between $ 28.00 and $ 48.00 so everything we have manufactured and put into stock since December 24th has been at a much higher raw material price, we cannot absorb that level of increase and we must increase prices. We have done everything in our power to mitigate the increase, including even more stringent cost control, as part of these measures we also had to take the decision to reduce our workforce by 58 which is about 20.00% otherwise our price increase would have had to be much higher, this is a real human cost for the speculation in silver.

The almost unprecedented ( it has happened once before Bunker / Hunt ) speculation in silver damages all people who need to buy it and use to make things, and of course those who buy products containing silver.

We can only hope silver reduces significantly from its current level ( $ 38.00 ).

Our philosophy remains the same, we continue to make all products, none will be deleted and we will remain totally committed to producing the widest range of monochrome film, paper ( including the new ART 300 ) and chemistry, from any manufacturer, anywhere.

We thank all our customers who use and value ILFORD Photo products.

Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Thanks Simon for taking the time to explain to customers - another example of Ilford's committment to the long-term future of traditional photography.

I love Ilford products and intend to continue supporting a company which has been loyal to traditional photography through good and bad times.

 

[J Rollinger]

How i wish for 02 prices!

 

[warden]

Dear All,

. . . . as part of these measures we also had to take the decision to reduce our workforce by 58 which is about 20.00% otherwise our price increase would have had to be much higher. . . . :

I'm sorry to hear about the loss of jobs, which is not good news for anyone. With any luck the price of silver will come down over time and stabilize. Fingers crossed.

 

[Simon R Galley]

Thanks Jawarden. Appreciated.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology LImited :

 

[Simon R Galley]

Dear J Rollinger......its quite some graph is it not?

When HARMAN technology was formed 6 years ago I can distinctly remember we were paying $ 7.25 per ounce for silver.

We are now paying over 5 times that amount, as are all photo manufacturers of course.

Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :