How do you use a steel reel?

[Rick A]

 

[Ko.Fe.]

There is no challenge in that.

After I realized how steel one cant take longer than standard 36 frames cut.

 

[NB23]

Steel Rules

I learned on patterson reels in high school, and have always used them since then. Now that I'm loading these steel reels consistently (going on 4 hours of loading and unloading now) I think I actually prefer the steel to the plastic.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Steel Rules

When I can load on a flat surface (darkroom counter), for 35mm, I agree. Get the film in the clip, squeeze the arch into it, and push the reel forward with the film; it'll roll in like a tape measure going from stiff to rolled. If you're loading in a dark bag, a Paterson is much easier, because there's less space and often no flat surface to roll the spiral on.

 

[MattKing]

It is really hard to describe what I do with steel reels, but easy to show.
My less agile right hand is limited to bracing the reel.
All of the rest of the work is done with the left hand.

 

[nzhang]

Try kindermann reel and Kindermann plastic loading jig, you can load 35mm within 1 minute.

 

[ChristopherCoy]

It is really hard to describe what I do with steel reels, but easy to show.
My less agile right hand is limited to bracing the reel.
All of the rest of the work is done with the left hand.

I'd imagine you probably go backwards? So it's loaded in much the same way as the plastic reels?

 

[MattKing]

I'd imagine you probably go backwards? So it's loaded in much the same way as the plastic reels?

Nope - one hand to steady, two fingers to rotate the reel, thumb and another finger to guide the film, pull film in, steady the reel, move hand 1/4 turn around the reel, wiggle film to confirm proper loading, repeat.
Way easier to do this then to describe it.

 

[Sirius Glass]

It is really hard to describe what I do with steel reels, but easy to show.
My less agile right hand is limited to bracing the reel.
All of the rest of the work is done with the left hand.

Basically that is what I do, however the fingers of the right hand are on the top and bottom of the reels. That allows the fingers to feel the film pushing out too much and that is an indicator that the film is not loading correctly.

 

[grainyvision]

First of all, invest in Hewes reels. They never wear out and are basically indestructable. I have one that is slightly bent from a fall but doesn't affect ability to use it at all. For 35mm, I can't imagine trying to use the clip thing that's necessary for 120. Hewes is the only reel on the market with the sprocket catching design that makes things so simple. For 120 though what I've found helps a lot is to actually pull all the film out of the backing paper first. Then pull out a bit of the film from the "roll" in your hands and curve it a bit into a U shape and push it into the open clip. Definitely takes a bit of practice, but not too bad. Once you have the film in the clip feel the edges to make sure one side isn't sticking out more than the other. If so, you can slide it a bit even with the clip closed to make it even on both sides. Then fill the backside of the clip to make sure the film feels about even in the clip. Pull/push the side that is uneven to balance it out. Then finally time to roll. Keep the film in a slight U shape as you twist the reel. Don't really "pull" at all, just let the rolling take the film out of your hand. If it seems to stop rolling right and there is a noticeable bulge on an edge of the film in the reel, then you need to start over because the film wasn't in the clip properly. Basically the same process applies to 35mm, except for I don't need to take the film completely off the 35mm reel, and the sprocket design is a lot simpler to get perfect the first time. Sometimes the sprockets will be misaligned though and you'll have to start over. The important thing is that you're not trying to maintain the film "tightly" at all. Always feel over the reel after rolling to make sure there's no odd bubbles or anything

 

[abruzzi]

As a counter to the comments that it just takes a little practice, to some people it just doesn't happen. After a half dozen partially developed rolls and lost shots, I started pulling 2ft of film from my bulk roller (the cheapest film i could find) practicing with it for a few hours until the edges of the film were too damaged to practice with. Then I'd pull another two feet and practice again. After doing that a dozen times, 2/3 of the time with my eyes closed or in the dark. I went back to trying to do it with a shot roll of film. Still, most of the rolls came out with undeveloped grey sections because of misloading.

I get that lots of people love the, I really want to like them. They're more economical on chemistry, they're more compact, they're easier to clean. But my finger just can't do it. They can play Beethoven on the piano, but they can't load steel reels in the dark. So, if it doesn't come to you, don't fret it--not everyone get there. Just buy a patterson kit, a jobo kit, an arista kit, or, if you're an immense klutz like me, look on ebay for some Kodak lasagne strips. Those are by far the easiest to load, but are limited if you want to process more than two spools of 35mm or one spool of 120. I use both the Kodak and the Patterson (with the Arista premium reels. the Patterson reals are nearly impossible to load 120 for me.)

 

[ChristopherCoy]

After two days of practice, I finally got it. I was able to load two rolls yesterday and they developed perfectly. I loaded and unloaded the practice roll so many times that it ended up being extremely short because I kept having to cut the end off because the sprocket holes would tear.

 

[Rick A]

After two days of practice, I finally got it. I was able to load two rolls yesterday and they developed perfectly. I loaded and unloaded the practice roll so many times that it ended up being extremely short because I kept having to cut the end off because the sprocket holes would tear.

While you were practicing, did you make a mental note of the sound the film makes when it's spooled correctly? It's important to hear that sound in the darkness, more so than the feel of it.

 

[ChristopherCoy]

While you were practicing, did you make a mental note of the sound the film makes when it's spooled correctly? It's important to hear that sound in the darkness, more so than the feel of it.

Yes. There is a "shhhhhhhck" sliding noise. Any crackle thats different than that means an issue. I also made a mental note and developed a "feel" for if the film gets out of alignment. Any pulling to one side or another means that it got off track.

 

[tomkatf]

After two days of practice, I finally got it. I was able to load two rolls yesterday and they developed perfectly. I loaded and unloaded the practice roll so many times that it ended up being extremely short because I kept having to cut the end off because the sprocket holes would tear.

Good job, it's easy and foolproof once you get the hang of it. I don't use the clip in the center of the reel(if yours has it), too easy to get the film askew. If you worried about a bent reel, roll it across a flat surface... if it doesn't track true it might be bent.

 

[ChristopherCoy]

Good job, it's easy and foolproof once you get the hang of it. I don't use the clip in the center of the reel(if yours has it), too easy to get the film askew. If you worried about a bent reel, roll it across a flat surface... if it doesn't track true it might be bent.

I taught myself how to load the reel without the clip, or the sprocket holder sticky uppy thingys. What I do is find the sprocket holders and stick the film through the reel. With my free hand I hold the film against the frame of the reel (center piece) and start rolling. It's a little slow getting the first round or two loaded, but after that it's smooth sailing.

 

[Rick A]

I taught myself how to load the reel without the clip, or the sprocket holder sticky uppy thingys. What I do is find the sprocket holders and stick the film through the reel. With my free hand I hold the film against the frame of the reel (center piece) and start rolling. It's a little slow getting the first round or two loaded, but after that it's smooth sailing.

That's fine and dandy, but be advised, the film can work its way off the reel during agitation. Wanna know how I know?

 

[Michel Hardy-Vallée]

This is the first set of steel reels I've ever used, and I'm finding it extremely difficult, even with my eyes open. I have a hard time keeping the film perpendicular with the reel while loading, and things get off track. I use the "U" shape in my right hand, and load the reel with my left. I've been sitting here for an hour trying to practice and I still can't get it.

What's the trick?

View attachment 246260 View attachment 246261

Cursing. It will help.

Seriously, for 35mm, I hate steel reels. They are super tough to wind correctly and if the reel is just a little bit crooked, you're done with. Film is wound super tight, and the merest kink will result in film touching itself. For 35mm I stick to Paterson, they're the smartest thing. As long as you cut a little the corners they're a breeze.

On the other hand, with 120, I find steel reels a blessing. The size and rigidity are great, and they take seconds to load. 120 in a Paterson is OK, but a bit finicky because you have to align a much wider piece of film.

 

[tomkatf]

That's fine and dandy, but be advised, the film can work its way off the reel during agitation. Wanna know how I know?

I've never seen that happen if the tail of the film is properly inserted into the center of the reel and started gently without allowing it to slip out. I'd estimate I've hand processed over 1000 rolls with no problem if started properly.

 

[tomkatf]

Cursing. It will help.

Seriously, for 35mm, I hate steel reels. They are super tough to wind correctly and if the reel is just a little bit crooked, you're done with. Film is wound super tight, and the merest kink will result in film touching itself. For 35mm I stick to Paterson, they're the smartest thing. As long as you cut a little the corners they're a breeze.

On the other hand, with 120, I find steel reels a blessing. The size and rigidity are great, and they take seconds to load. 120 in a Paterson is OK, but a bit finicky because you have to align a much wider piece of film.

Steel reels couldn't be easier if you've taken the time to learn the technique (20min?) and don't ham fist it. They virtually load themselves. When loaded run your thumb and finger across the outside of the reel... if you can feel film edges, it's not loaded properly... unroll till you get to that area and start again, gently. Don't over-bow the film.

 

[MattKing]

That's fine and dandy, but be advised, the film can work its way off the reel during agitation. Wanna know how I know?

I've never seen that happen if the tail of the film is properly inserted into the center of the reel and started gently without allowing it to slip out. I'd estimate I've hand processed over 1000 rolls with no problem if started properly.

It definitely happens with 120 and continuous rotary agitation (during the development stage).

 

[Rick A]

I've never seen that happen if the tail of the film is properly inserted into the center of the reel and started gently without allowing it to slip out. I'd estimate I've hand processed over 1000 rolls with no problem if started properly.

My post was in reference to this from Christopher: "I taught myself how to load the reel without the clip, or the sprocket holder sticky uppy thingys"
You are correct, when you anchor the tail of the film in the reel it shouldn't happen. However, when you don't anchor the film it can, and usually does, creep out of the reel during agitation.

 

[tomkatf]

It definitely happens with 120 and continuous rotary agitation (during the development stage).

It definitely happens with 120 and continuous rotary agitation (during the development stage).

Aha... I've never used a rotary tank set-up. There's your problem...lol My problem with 120 when I started was sometimes crimping the film slightly because it was so wide and thin, causing half-moon marks... Had to take it easier when loading...

My post was in reference to this from Christopher: "I taught myself how to load the reel without the clip, or the sprocket holder sticky uppy thingys"
You are correct, when you anchor the tail of the film in the reel it shouldn't happen. However, when you don't anchor the film it can, and usually does, creep out of the reel during agitation.

No accounting for poor technique...lol

 

[Rick A]

Aha... I've never used a rotary tank set-up. There's your problem...lol My problem with 120 when I started was sometimes crimping the film slightly because it was so wide and thin, causing half-moon marks... Had to take it easier when loading...

No accounting for poor technique...lol

It usually happens when you use a twisting motion with inversions. Also, like Matt said, is worse with 120 film, and especially with rotary gear.

 

[tomkatf]

I usually happens when you use a twisting motion with inversions. It, like Matt said, is worse with 120 film, and especially with rotary gear.

Hmmm... Interesting, I'm not sure I ever used a twisting motion while inverting the tank, just a nice snappy inversion and back and a bump when setting the tank back down. In larger tanks when you invert, you can feel the bubble rising inside the tank and I would let it rise all the way before turning the tank upright again. I thought that was helping agitation, I guess...