How Do You Know Which Krappy Toy Camera To Buy?

[gone]

Today's post on the forums concerning an upcoming show for toy cameras seems to have to hit a nerve. I've done sharp photos, beautiful bokeh, tight compositions, spot on exposure, etc.... now it's time to loosen up. Since I've already sold all of the really expensive cameras and lenses, that's a start, but I'm finding out that if there's even one of the "good but inexpensive" items around the house, the urge hits to do all of the above all over again. The solution it would seem is to buy something that CAN'T take a sharp shot w/ beautiful bokeh, etc. My move to alternative printing processes has gone well, so this looks like fun too.

So where do I start? Is there a sort of reverse G.A.S. deal here where your camera/lens/developing protocols aren't quite lousy enough? I can do bad developing, trust me (printing is relatively foolproof for some reason, and I want good prints of my hopefully bad photos anyway), but what's a good (bad) camera to start with? I'd like to shoot 6x6. Cheap is good too, although that seems to go w/ the territory. Thanks.

 

[snapguy]

size matters

If size matters I would suggest you look at cameras that take 127-size film. The film is hard to get, sort of, but pretty cool. Nice big negative and there are all kinds of cameras out there for that film. My first camera was a Brownie Reflex with one f-stop and one shutter speed (plus B) but you can get some really good or bad photos with it. Remember, it's not the box, it's the loose nut behind it. You can get bad photos if you try.

 

[gone]

Oh, I can get bad photos w/ my eyes closed, which may be the problem (and thank you for the vote of confidence), but I was wondering more about things like Holgas or Dianas (if that's spelled right), or something similar that shoots 120 film. I'm looking for the whole light leak, vignetting thing, but don't want a camera that's so poorly made that it breaks right away. I may even buy a new one!, something I've never done.

Years ago I bought an Agfa Isola, one of those bottom of the line tube cameras for amateurs that shoot 6x6 w/ a single element lens and just two shutter speeds, but the &*!% thing took perfectly exposed, razor sharp photos w/ no light leaks or nuthin. It also got a lot of stares from onlookers, as anyone who has shot a tube camera can attest to.

 

[trythis]

Just smear some dirt and oil on a wide angle adapter lens and save yourself the trouble.

 

[MrBrowning]

I like Holga's myself (I have a 120N and a HolgaPan). Another Option is a Diana. I have a Diana F+ w, 120 back and 35mm back that I didn't really care for compared to the Holgas. These are two of my favorites that I shot with the Holga 120N and Rollei Superpan 200 stand dev in Rodinal. The second one is a crop from a 6x6 negative.

 

[MDR]

You can do small alt prints from krappy cam negs, one of the best salt prints I have seen on the net was made with a Holga. So get a Holga they are not that expensive another good and cheap choice is an Agfa Click II.
4x4cm is another great format (Original Diana and Agfa Isoly)

Square formattToycameras I use in order of preference:
- Original Diana (unfortunately seems to get expensive, lens is not as sharp as from a Holga different a lot of coma)
- Holga 120N (great camera and much less expensive than an original diana)
- Agfa Isoly (more shutter speeds than either Holga or Dianas also the lens is sharper)
- Diana F (a bastard between the Diana and the Holga look)

 

[Regular Rod]

Surely the whole point of using a "Toy" camera is to make excellent photographs in despite of all the so-called faults? Bad photographs are simply that, a waste of time, materials and opportunity!

There are some wonderful, dust free, perfectly exposed and beautifully processed photographs being made with the most humble of cameras. The simplicity of the camera frees the photographer to concentrate on the creativity and the craft. Isn't that the point?

RR

 

[MrBrowning]

Surely the whole point of using a "Toy" camera is to make excellent photographs in despite of all the so-called faults? Bad photographs are simply that, a waste of time, materials and opportunity!

+1

 

[AgX]

Years ago I bought an Agfa Isola, one of those bottom of the line tube cameras for amateurs that shoot 6x6 w/ a single element lens and just two shutter speeds, but the &*!% thing took perfectly exposed, razor sharp photos w/ no light leaks or nuthin. It also got a lot of stares from onlookers, as anyone who has shot a tube camera can attest to.

The Isola is a good camera. There even are two versions with different lenses and shutters. The better one has a triplet lens.

 

[MattKing]

Buy an old folder with one of those tiny, squinty hard to see through waste-level finders.

If your eyes are like mine, you can work without glasses and you will get the results you seek.

 

[gone]

I agree, the Isola is a good camera. Therein lies the problem. My Isola had the single (meniscus?) lens. It was too good for my proposes, and the cameras look too odd anyway. I do love triplets though.

As to the point of using a toy camera, I think we all have our individual ideas on this one. I have no idea what the point of anything is, and if I ever say I do, please give me a good whack.

Those photos of MrBrowning's are wonderful. The first one is sorta what I might want to do, but really, that tree in that location would have been a great photo even w/ a Leica :]. That's definitely what I like though.

Having a good camera and trying to make a Holga of it won't work, as evidenced by these accidentally bad shots from an Ikonta. It's just not the same thing at all. They still look like they came from a real camera, which they did. I need a plastic, toy krappy camera. I know about the Holga or Diana, but aren't there some other options out there?

 

[Vaughn]

"How Do You Know Which Krappy Toy Camera To Buy?"

It should be for under a dollar at a thrift store to be truly a proper purchase. (Taking one from a dead hipster is also acceptable.)

From a $1.00 Diana Camera from St Vincent De Paul Thift Store (marked down to 75 cents at the counter!):

(scanned carbon prints, film - outdated Tech Pan)

 

[nsurit]

Krappy Kamera

Cheap? I'd go with a Brownie Hawkeye and flip the lens. Cheap and good results.

 

[Dr Croubie]

I'd suggest an (there was a url link here which no longer exists). Half-frame, fixed lens, parallax-inducing viewfinder in the corner, absolute bitch to load. No aperture or speed settings, just sunny-16 based pictures of the sun, clouds, etc. The only focus is by turning the lens from infinity to 1m marks, it spins freely enough that it'll set it self many times for you.
Put it in your bag without the lenscap (which seem to cost more than the cameras), and it'll scratch your lens for that low contrast look, and take pictures of the inside of your bag for you!

 

[removed account4]

Cheap? I'd go with a Brownie Hawkeye and flip the lens. Cheap and good results.

+!!1

 

[Valerie]

I suggest start with a Holga. Cheap enough that if you don't like the results you have no great financial investment. I have about 5 now and each takes a slightly different kind of image (one vignettes nicely, one has greater light leaks, etc)...
I also have some Brownie Hawkeyes... the flipped lens can be fun with the right image

 

[mooseontheloose]

If you like the soft, plastic look of Holga or Diana, why not get a Holga or Diana? There is a reason that they are popular. I have many Holgas, plus a Diana and a Fujipet (much, much more expensive though, for what it is), but my favourite is not not only the Holga, but the first Holga I ever bought (each one is a slightly different model, whether it's flash, or colour, or size, etc so I can tell). Why? Each Holga is different -- the vignetting is different, the way it does light leaks is different (if at all), etc. A toy camera is not an expensive purchase -- just pick one and try it, if you like it, great (you may even buy others), if not, try another.

If you do get a plastic camera, I highly recommend Michelle Bates' Plastic Cameras: Toying with Creativity. Lots of great examples of what can be done with cameras, in addition to techniques to achieve certain effects.

 

[gone]

Those are just great nsurit. Excellent examples here. I sprung for a Holga 120 CFN ($15 shipped w/ an inoperative flash, which I don't use anyway), but the Hawkeye looks good too. I'm selling everything else that I own. W/ one camera only, photography looks a lot simpler, and a lot more fun too. No more lusting after hoods or filters either, I'll just hold my hand up on the sunny side, and a little gauze should make a fine soft focus filter.

 

[Pioneer]

I have a Holga FN 120, or something like that, and it is fun, but I personally am having a whole lot more fun building pinhole cameras and using old print paper. I bought a set of pinholes from some outfit online, Pinhole Resource I believe, and I am using those. I just go out to the garage, cut up some plywood or whatever is handy, and nail it together, except the back. I spray paint the inside flat black. Then I take the Frankencamera into my darkroom and tape a piece of photo paper cut close to the size onto the backboard. I then tape the backboard to the camera with some duct tape. A quick aperture calculation and I can determine a shutter speed based on the estimated speed of the paper. (What I have been using lately seems to be about 2 ISO.)

I use a piece of electrical tape as a shutter (tough to repair but easy to replace) and go outdoors with a stopwatch and take a picture. It can be hard to tell what you will end up with though I am getting better at it.

Obviously there is a little more to it but it isn't really rocket science. Of course, if you aren't in to the building process you can buy one. That is what I did to start, picked up an Ilford Obscura. It came pre-built with directions and a box of Delta 100 sheet film, a box of Ilford MGIV print paper (I think), and a box of Ilford Direct Positive paper. All for about $75. I think the camera was actually free. I still use it but once I got started I wanted to go bigger, lots bigger.

Anyway, you can have tons of fun and not have to buy any plastic cameras at all. Or lenses, or much of anything traditional. I can use old, expired, boxes of paper, scan the results if I don't exceed my flat bed size, and work with the result in Photoshop. Or I can take the results, let my granddaughter paint on them a bit, and take them to Art in the Park in the summer and sell them to buy more expired paper.

Just think, I am now a successful artist with sales to match using nothing but expired photo paper, a big, homemade, wooden box, some duct tape, a couple or three pieces of electrical tape, and $49 dollars worth of pinholes from Pinhole Resource. Oh yeah, a granddaughter with water paints (she gets paid before I do. She prefers Tootsie Rolls.) Before I was a struggling photographer with a Deardorff V8 unsuccessfully trying to sell anything to help pay for film and paper, not too mention the camera, tripod and all the other goodies I thought I needed! Now I don't even need a tripod. I just use duct tape to strap my box to a wooden stool my daughter used to use to step to the sink and wash dishes. (I get my duct tape by the case from Harbor Freight.)

EDIT - My next camera is a refrigerator box stiffened with (guess what) and painted inside flat black using a worn out paint roller. I have another, much thinner box, that slides inside for the paper/film. I'll even be able to vary the focal length, kind of like a zoom lens! I will probably need some really big photo paper for this one. And probably another stool.

 

[snay1345]

My favorite is the standard old Holga with HP5 stand developed. No matter the conditions the photos always come out great.

 

[Fixcinater]

I liked my Diana 151 (the original) over the Holga I had, the 4x4 vs. 6x6 probably helped the IQ though...maybe not what you want.

 

[bvy]

If 120 is your thing, it's going to be hard to beat the Holga (or possibly the Diana, though I never used one). They're inexpensive, and while I wouldn't call them rugged, they're durable enough to handle regular use and reasonable abuse. I've never had one break on me. They're also very light, which is more than I can say for any other medium format camera I own (plastic's funny that way). Two pieces of black tape suppress the light leaks in case that's not your thing. My own Holga is the TLR version -- TLR only insofar as you frame the picture through the waist-level finder.

For 35mm, I love the Vivitar Ultra Wide & Slim. They can be had for $20 to $30 on eBay, though you get the feeling that materials and craftsmanship together can be counted in pennies not dollars. Point it at the sun and get some amazing pictures. My first Krappy Kamera show piece was made using this camera (in my gallery).

The Krappy show didn't preclude homemade cameras (I asked). I made a 35mm camera out of a tin box, plastic magnifier, and for the shutter, a refrigerator magnet. I might have to take it out and play with it again...

 

[M Carter]

Also fun: the Nikon mount Holga lens (and you can stick the wide adapter on it). On an APS-C DSLR it's not that special, since the smaller crop gets the cleaner center of the glass (er, plastic!)

On a full frame film body it's another story though... I'd find an old Nikon FG body (full manual controls but a great internal meter, uses modern batteries) and have some fun. FGs can be found for $30 or less. Usually the best deal is get one with a 50mm - even the series-E 50 is a decent lens.

I made a sort of "tilt mount" using an old spring and shot some video with the holga lens disconnected from a Nikon DSLR. Tilting the lens allowed light to come in around the lens mount, creating a film-burn look. Very cool with color.

 

[Valerie]

Cheap? I'd go with a Brownie Hawkeye and flip the lens. Cheap and good results.

Hey!! I DO know that guitar-playing guy! Would love to know the story behind this photo, Bill!

 

[bsdunek]

I have two Holga 120S models I bought off eBay for about $15 each. Use one for color the other for B&W. I have modified the shutters to prevent the 'second' exposure when the shutter resets and plugged the top of chamber holes and painted the interior flat black. Love my results. Oh, the 120S didn't have a bulb shutter setting, so if you want that, get a 120N.