Horizon Perfekt - user experiences, please

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

Thank you AgX. I think Soviets produced the most of the Tessars on Earth. I have a FED 50mm Tessar and you would not want to see its dim light performance , color like a .... .

 

[David Brown]

An xpan is a fine camera. But (as has been stated) it is not unlike a cropped medium format negative. Think of it this way: an xpan with a 45mm will look essentially the same as a 45mm (or 50) lens on a hasselblad or a tlr if you simply crop the 120 negative off the top and bottom so that it's only 1 inch high (by 2.25 inches wide). That 1 x 2.25 is pretty close to the negative size of both the xpan and the Horizon. The xpan with a 45mm lens gives a field of view around 70-75 degrees (estimate). I can get pretty close to the same "image" by using my 55mm lens on my RB67 and cropping.

HOWEVER, the Horizon works entirely differently. For one thing, it gives a field of view of 120 degrees! This is achieved by a 28mm lens and a film gate in the back of the camera that is NOT flat, it is curved. This is so, as the lens rotates, the distance from the lens to the slice of film being exposed at that moment stays the same. This causes objects at the ends of each frame to be both optically and literally farther from the camera then things in the middle of the frame. Example, if you wanted to take a picture of a group of people all standing next to each other, you would have to arrange them in a semi-circle in front of the camera where each person would be the same distance from the camera. Otherwise, the people in the center would be the tallest, with diminishing height progressing to each end. So, yes, a brick wall (or almost anything else, including a not perfectly centered horizon) will appear curved in the image.

Landscapes can be achieved if you get the horizon (of the Earth, not the camera) level and centered in the camera. This is, to some, a limitation; but when used properly, can make spectacular images.

Think of it as the Horizon camera being a true panoramic, while the xpan is simply just wide angle.

Clear as mud?

See:

http://cameras.alfredklomp.com/horizon202/index.htm

http://www.fotoralf.de/horizon.htm

http://www.panoramic-shot.com/galerie_irland.htm

 

[AgX]

Now the question arises what panoramic means...

Is it just the aspect ratio? Or need it be wide angle too? (Both features are independent of each other.)

 

[tkamiya]

I'm going to have FUN with this thing!

Tripod is pretty much a requirement, right??

 

[AgX]

Depends what you expect. See post #23.

 

[David Brown]

Tripod is pretty much a requirement, right??

Requirement, no. Advisable, probably.

I have had some success with the higher shutter speeds (ones you would use normally with other cameras handheld) using a monopod.

PS: I've attached an example of what a wall will look like.

 

[David Brown]

Now the question arises what panoramic means...

Is it just the aspect ratio? Or need it be wide angle too? (Both features are independent of each other.)

OK. How about a camera that pans, as opposed to a camera with a fixed wide angle lens?

 

[tkamiya]

What if I fixed the camera and let the earth rotate??? A really slow exposure!

 

[AgX]

OK. How about a camera that pans, as opposed to a camera with a fixed wide angle lens?

Set a tele-lens on a rotational camera that accepts lenses of different focal lenghts (latest models from Seitz) and you'll gain a great aspect ratio and still may only have a very small angle of view.
So as indicated above aspect ratio and angle of view are basically independant, even for panning cameras.

 

[fastw]

even good for action shots

 

[David Brown]

So as indicated above aspect ratio and angle of view are basically independant, even for panning cameras.

You're absolutely right. No one is arguing this. I was simply trying to contrast the two types of cameras for the original poster. No need to go off on a tangent over semantics.

 

[tkamiya]

Yay. My camera shipped and is scheduled to arrive here on Wednesday! I'm hoping my confusion will clear itself out when I play with the actual camera.

Appreciate everybody for advise!

 

[gorbas]

Tkamiya, as for your questions regarding exposure time 1/125s is 1/125 as with any other camera. If you select slow speed selector then lens is rotating way slower and you have longer exposure as marked.
Goran

 

[jamie young]

Some of this has been discussed already but the xpan can't shoot an image thats 140 degrees wide, and if it could the corners would be pretty distorted. The swing lense Horizont doesn't have to use a very wide angle lens to shoot that wide since it is moving on a curved film plane. Also it uses the best part of a lens through a vertical slit, not the edges, so it doesn't need a quality optic as much to get good sharp pics. I did a diagram of this relating to a rotating pan camera, but it would still be the same for a swing lens camera.
http://www.jamieyoungphoto.com/roundshot 1.html
I borrowed a widelux at one time and loved it. Maybe i'll get a perfekt one of these days. Thanks all for the reviews

 

[tkamiya]

Perfekt is on sale for !00 less until this Sunday if you want tone. Looks like it ships from New York.

 

[AgX]

Also it uses the best part of a lens through a vertical slit, not the edges, so it doesn't need a quality optic as much to get good sharp pics. I did a diagram of this relating to a rotating pan camera, but it would still be the same for a swing lens camera.

This would be true if such camera would use a standard lens intended for 24x36mm. But the Horizon uses that standard lens in shorter focal length as it only has to cover 24mm instead of 44mm.
So still the lens must be of high quality over the full angle of coverage

 

[tkamiya]

It just arrived.

Holy cow... this is a substantial camera. Despite the fact it looks like a cheap plastic camera, it is a weighty piece of equipment. I'm going to have to try this out soon!

 

[fastw]

It just arrived.

Holy cow... this is a substantial camera. Despite the fact it looks like a cheap plastic camera, it is a weighty piece of equipment. I'm going to have to try this out soon!

The most important thing to remember is to keep it level. It's a great toy, have fun.