Hope to find a Developer (Amidol) for film

Hydrangeas from the garden

A
Hydrangeas from the garden

  • 2
  • 1
  • 28
Field #6

D
Field #6

  • 4
  • 1
  • 54
Hosta

A
Hosta

  • 12
  • 8
  • 109
Water Orchids

A
Water Orchids

  • 5
  • 1
  • 63
Life Ring

A
Life Ring

  • 4
  • 2
  • 57

Recent Classifieds

Forum statistics

Threads
197,909
Messages
2,766,730
Members
99,500
Latest member
Neilmark
Recent bookmarks
0
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
Mohmad, I think that the formula Raghu supplied from Patrick Gainer will be quite easy to use. If you have propylene glycol, you can mix up the concentrate A. Separately you could supply small bags of B with the carbonate/bicarbonate.
May God have mercy on you (Patrick Gainer).

I do not know ,,

Yes ,, this is really possible, but it will be a very complicated issue and it will require a great effort to fill very small bags and record the weight on them - and there will be bags of a solution to prepare half a liter and another in order to prepare a full liter ..

A complex issue, but not an impossible one.

It is an idea proposed, we can leave it aside temporarily until we study other ideas. If we do not succeed in identifying other ideas, we will have to adopt them.
Maybe we can get another idea that's easier to implement. why not .?
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
Karl, if I understood correctly, his concern is that Gainer's amidol-ascorbic developer is largely untested and development time data is not available. Unfortunately, he doesn't have b&w film with him for doing his own tests. And it's quite expensive too. His goal is to prepare concentrated developers and supply them to hobbyists in his country. So he wants some formula that is either well-tested or someone in this forum is willing to test on a few films and give accurate data to him. Unfortunately, his customers are not ready to do the tests themselves - they want something that works painlessly the very first time they use it. If I had Amidol at my disposal, I would have tested Gainer's recipe and given approximate development time for a couple of films.
Yes esteemed teacher (Raghu)
In fact, I must admit that I owe you great credit for always supporting me in the field of black and white photography. I testify that you will never hesitate to provide everything you know in the field of photography. Thank you from my heart .
- But there is a simple correction ,,
I am not a merchant in the literal sense of the word ... and my customers are not customers ,,
The Egyptian Analog Club is a project based on cooperative thinking, and not making profit is the first goal. (Please note that we do not refuse to obtain a profit),
But the main goal is to help young amateur photographers, and in most cases I distribute this chemistry for free and in the best of circumstances (if the amateur young man is well off I will get from him the actual cost of the developer + the transfers made to purchase the materials).

So they are not customers in the literal sense.
But they are crazy guys. As I told you before, it is rare for you to find a smart person in them, only there is a physical girl who can respond to that.

They only know (D76) ,,, I am working on publishing many formulas in Egypt so that amateurs are aware that the world of black and white is not only limited to (D76) and that it is a large and diverse world that resembles a basket of fruits and every kind of fruit has it. A different taste that sets it apart.
This thought was met with fierce resistance and indifference, and I resorted to some tricks, by writing the phrase (D76) but inside it (AGFA17). Later on I confessed to people about this. My goal was for young men to try other formulas with a different taste, even Their eyes become accustomed to noticing the differences between different factions, and this is in order to make their eyes sensitive to the beauty of photographic art. I actually succeeded in these endeavors and people really realized that my goals are wonderful goals.
Now they accept any formula that I give them, but on the condition that it is written on it the temperature and the time.

Logically speaking, they have some right to that. Most of these young men have come from the world of digital photography, for months, and it is really difficult for them to accept or understand the matter.
He is a young man who came from the digital world months ago, barely bought a development tank, and barely fumbled his way in the analog world, he would never understand that you told him to mix this with that and do a test for and and and.
- This young man wants to develop his films not to enjoy the development process, but to save the development fees that he used to pay to the professional lab.

- I am establishing to create a real analog community in Egypt, and with great regret most of the members come from the digital world, and dealing with them is very difficult,
So I am trying to attract young men and keep away from them all the things that might worry them or make them feel that analog is a difficult and complicated world.
I'm sorry, I went too far,
But I just wanted to clarify the reality of the situation.
 

MattKing

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Apr 24, 2005
Messages
52,236
Location
Delta, BC Canada
Format
Medium Format
May God have mercy on you (Patrick Gainer).
I'm not sure whether you are aware of this, but Patrick Gainer passed away in November 2015. He left an amazing legacy.
 

relistan

Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
1,554
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Format
Multi Format
Karl, if I understood correctly, his concern is that Gainer's amidol-ascorbic developer is largely untested and development time data is not available. Unfortunately, he doesn't have b&w film with him for doing his own tests. And it's quite expensive too. His goal is to prepare concentrated developers and supply them to hobbyists in his country. So he wants some formula that is either well-tested or someone in this forum is willing to test on a few films and give accurate data to him. Unfortunately, his customers are not ready to do the tests themselves - they want something that works painlessly the very first time they use it. If I had Amidol at my disposal, I would have tested Gainer's recipe and given approximate development time for a couple of films.

Ah I see, I didn't understand that. If I had Amidol, I would test it out, because that formula is quite simple. But I don't and wouldn't have a general use for it if I did.
 

reddesert

Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2019
Messages
2,343
Location
SAZ
Format
Hybrid
In my opinion, Amidol is not suitable for distribution to amateurs who have little or no experience with photographic chemistry and are likely to be mixing developer in their kitchens or bathrooms. I know Mohmad reacted strongly to this as a supposed "environmentalist" concern. Even if you want to pave every tree in the planet, the problem is that Amidol is poisonous to people and should not be left lying around in inexperienced people's houses.

You have Metol. Metol with sodium sulfite, or Metol plus ascorbic acid and other ingredients, will make a good developer.
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
In my opinion, Amidol is not suitable for distribution to amateurs who have little or no experience with photographic chemistry and are likely to be mixing developer in their kitchens or bathrooms. I know Mohmad reacted strongly to this as a supposed "environmentalist" concern. Even if you want to pave every tree in the planet, the problem is that Amidol is poisonous to people and should not be left lying around in inexperienced people's houses.

You have Metol. Metol with sodium sulfite, or Metol plus ascorbic acid and other ingredients, will make a good developer.
Hello my dear brother
Yes ,,, I almost became convinced of your point of view and tend to really take it ,,,,
Your point of view really makes sense.
- We must be careful ,, you are right, my dear brother. Perhaps the harms from using Amedol will be more than the benefits we can get.

The developer of (Kalogen) unit will do the job and will run very efficiently.
And, in this regard, I do not want to forget to extend my thanks and gratitude to our dear colleague Mr. (Raghu) from India, for he provided me with very valuable assistance in preparing this amazing formula.

God bless you all .
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,639
Location
India
Format
Multi Format
You have Metol. Metol with sodium sulfite, or Metol plus ascorbic acid and other ingredients, will make a good developer.

There are many Metol/HQ/Ascorbic based developers but a long lasting concentrated developer is what he is interested in. Kalogen is one Metol-HQ developer that meets his requirements and he has already brewed it. As para-aminophenol was available to him, he has prepared a Rodinal substitute. Similarly, with ascorbic acid, he has prepared Gainer's Ascorbic-Aminophenol based concentrated two part developer. The interest in Amidol comes from the fact that it is available to him at a bargain price. Unfortunately, there's not much publicly available information on Amidol based film developers. Interestingly, Formulary offers an Amidol film developer though it might not be best suited for roll films.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
There are many Metol/HQ/Ascorbic based developers but a long lasting concentrated developer is what he is interested in. Kalogen is one Metol-HQ developer that meets his requirements and he has already brewed it. As para-aminophenol was available to him, he has prepared a Rodinal substitute. Similarly, with ascorbic acid, he has prepared Gainer's Ascorbic-Aminophenol based concentrated two part developer. The interest in Amidol comes from the fact that it is available to him at a bargain price. Unfortunately, there's not much publicly available information on Amidol based film developers. Interestingly, Formulary offers an Amidol film developer though it might not be best suited for roll films.


I do not have a Metol / HQ / Ascorbic based developer formula.
I have a large amount of (HQ) so I hope to benefit from that amount with some speed, the atmosphere in the warehouse tends to be a little humid and I am concerned about the (HQ) stock. I try to ventilate the warehouse whenever I have the opportunity .. but I see that the best way To take advantage of this quantity is by transferring this stock to a concentrated developer.

According to my humble information, (I don’t know if a piece of information is true or false) ,,
Any developer containing Ascorbic will definitely have a short life if it is a solution in water, so it has to be a solution in propylene glycol for it to be a long-lasting solution.
I really don’t know, every day we learn new information.
 

relistan

Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
1,554
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Format
Multi Format
Since you are looking for concentrated developers, @mohmad khatab do you have phenidone? ID-67 was available in a concentrated stock that @Ian Grant has on his site: http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/formulae/developers/devID67.htm

If you do not have phenidone, you can probably make a stock with metol. ID-67 is the phenidone version of ID-2 so you should be able to make the 1L stock with 5g of metol in place of the 0.625g of phenidone (calculating back from ID-2).

I don't have dev times to offer you, but I would expect (If I have done the math properly) that if diluted 1+9 times near to ID-11/D-76 would work, with a higher contrast result. Maybe cut 10-15% off ID-11/D-76 times.

Metol5 g25 g
Sodium Sulphite (anh) 187.5 g625 g
Hydroquinone 20 g100 g
Sodium Carbonate (anh) 93.8 g468.75 g
Potassium Bromide5 g 25 g
Benzotriazole 1% soln 37.5 ml 187.5 ml (or 1.88g)
Water to 1 litre 5 litres
Someone correct me if that much metol won't dissolve!
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
Since you are looking for concentrated developers, @mohmad khatab do you have phenidone? ID-67 was available in a concentrated stock that @Ian Grant has on his site: http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/formulae/developers/devID67.htm

If you do not have phenidone, you can probably make a stock with metol. ID-67 is the phenidone version of ID-2 so you should be able to make the 1L stock with 5g of metol in place of the 0.625g of phenidone (calculating back from ID-2).

I don't have dev times to offer you, but I would expect (If I have done the math properly) that if diluted 1+9 times near to ID-11/D-76 would work, with a higher contrast result. Maybe cut 10-15% off ID-11/D-76 times.

Metol5 g25 g
Sodium Sulphite (anh) 187.5 g625 g
Hydroquinone 20 g100 g
Sodium Carbonate (anh) 93.8 g468.75 g
Potassium Bromide5 g 25 g
Benzotriazole 1% soln 37.5 ml 187.5 ml (or 1.88g)
Water to 1 litre 5 litres
Someone correct me if that much metol won't dissolve!
Hello dear Irish brother.
This is a prescription that looks quite promising and will help me get rid of my legal stock of Hydroquinone.
I thank you very much
Don't worry the metol soluble issue will go away (in the "Kalogen" recipe I managed to dissolve 13.5 grams)
... But there is a small detail regarding the equation of Phenidion with Metol ,, I read many times in the large format forum that the ratio is 1 X 10 ,, and this means that the amount of metol should be 6.25 grams and not 5 ,, and it has been said That even if there is an increase in the account, that is better than a decrease.
- I will study the formula until I am certain of the necessary times, the proportion of dilution, and so on.

- But we were going to think about preparing concentrates that contain a flavor of ascorbic acid, so that we would have many different flavors in the concentrates that we prepare.

Thanks and regards.
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,639
Location
India
Format
Multi Format
- But we were going to think about preparing concentrates that contain a flavor of ascorbic acid, so that we would have many different flavors in the concentrates that we prepare.

If you have a bit of phenidone with you, PG110B could be something worth checking out. It meets all your requirements - it's a concentrated ascorbic acid based developer that can be prepared with chemicals available to you; has a long shelf-life; is economical; has been tested; development time is available; many examples available on Flickr.
 
Last edited:

relistan

Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
1,554
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Format
Multi Format
I read many times in the large format forum that the ratio is 1 X 10 ,, and this means that the amount of metol should be 6.25 grams and not 5 ,, and it has been said

That's right in general, but that is not what Ilford used here. I used the amount they used for ID-2, which is the Metol version of ID-67.
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
If you have a bit of phenidone with you, PG110B could be something worth checking out. It meets all your requirements - it's a concentrated ascorbic acid based developer that can be prepared with chemicals available to you; has a long shelf-life; is economical; has been tested; development time is available; many examples available on Flickr.
Done successfully
Every day you amaze me, man.
God bless you ,,
The formula looks very premium and inexpensive.
- Phenidion replaced with Metol (10x1)
- Important note ,,
Whoever does not have a microwave, prefers to be distracted from preparing this formula ,, preparing this formula without a microwave is almost impossible.
Thank you very much the distinguished Mr. Rago and many thanks to the distinguished Mr. Jay DeFehr
 

Attachments

  • photo5985397867893863857.jpg
    photo5985397867893863857.jpg
    71.2 KB · Views: 49
  • photo5985535504415830793.jpg
    photo5985535504415830793.jpg
    102.4 KB · Views: 49
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,639
Location
India
Format
Multi Format
- Phenidion replaced with Metol (10x1)

Mohmad: I'm not sure the substitution of phenidone by Metol will work as you intended for PG110B. It might work but you're charting your own course with this substitution. Patrick Gainer did a lot of experiments on Metol-Ascorbic developers and you should definitely read up his posts on the same to get more insights.

It's interesting that you were able to dissolve Metol in propylene glycol which I thought was impossible to do. But I've never tried it myself. What temperature did you heat the glycol to?
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
Mohmad: I'm not sure the substitution of phenidone by Metol will work as you intended for PG110B. It might work but you're charting your own course with this substitution. Patrick Gainer did a lot of experiments on Metol-Ascorbic developers and you should definitely read up his posts on the same to get more insights.

It's interesting that you were able to dissolve Metol in propylene glycol which I thought was impossible to do. But I've never tried it myself. What temperature did you heat the glycol to?
You're absolutely right ,,
The formula consists of only three elements, but it is very difficult.
Dissolving borax was the most difficult stage, and dissolving metol was also difficult.
But I was able to because I read between the lines.
The writer (the photographic researcher) who created the formula, wrote between the lines some words that I had read.
The man said, put the solution in the microwave for 20 seconds, then remove it and stir for a while, but he forgot to say after a while, put the cartridge again, but I did that and every time the elements dissolved better.

Yes, it was a very stressful process, I do not deny it, you need to wear fish gloves, because you will have to hold the glass vessel by its edges and it is very hot and inflamed everywhere .. I did not notice the first time, but I did He brought another 100 ml and paid attention to all those little things.
I can benefit others with the preparation techniques that I have acquired.
Any formula with Phenidion I immediately add metol instead, and the formula succeeds ,, This is not the first time ,, but the replacement percentage must not be less than X10
 
Joined
Jan 16, 2010
Messages
1,685
Location
Atlanta, GA
Format
Medium Format
D-23 is a possibility. It uses only Metol and sodium sulfite. Grant Haist's D-76H uses just Metol, sodium sulfite, and borax (borax is usually easy to find). D-76H was designed to be similar to D-76 but eliminate the hydroquinone, see Tim Layton's description at https://www.timlaytonfineart.com/bl...ow-to-make-an-eco-friendly-b-w-film-developer

If I was distributing film developer to young photographers, one of the D-23 variants would be my first choice. I sort of stumbled in to mixing my own D76-H type formula by using the Beutler's formula with metaborate instead of carbonate. It's not quite as sharp as Beutler's but better on grain, and much sharper than standard D-23. Frankly, I think these formulas are as good or better than many of the more complicated formulas which require more expensive, toxic, or hard to find ingredients.
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
If I was distributing film developer to young photographers, one of the D-23 variants would be my first choice. I sort of stumbled in to mixing my own D76-H type formula by using the Beutler's formula with metaborate instead of carbonate. It's not quite as sharp as Beutler's but better on grain, and much sharper than standard D-23. Frankly, I think these formulas are as good or better than many of the more complicated formulas which require more expensive, toxic, or hard to find ingredients.
Hi Mister Parker ..
Actually I partly agree with you in principle,
D23 is very good formulas and is considered an injustice.
The D76 developer is the worst developer in the universe, in my opinion, a developer with absolutely no personality or anything special.
It is impossible for me to prepare this developer, I am against him as I am against the windows operating system,
The formula that I prepared looks more than wonderful and environmentally friendly (PC110B) with the number that I do not understand the significance of this name, but in general it is a great developer initially although I have not tested it practically but it seems from the pictures that I saw to the author that he will be a developer more than Great for containing ascorbic acid.
In addition to that, it has a very long life due to the fact that it lives in a preservative that there is no water at all.

Despite the difficulty of the preparation, despite the hardship, pain during preparation, stinging the fingertips, and so on, but in reality all this suffering produced a very distinguished developer from my point of view ,,
I think if I had some modern lab equipment it might have been a lot easier.
- I will give the bottle to the father of the young man and not to the young man, because there was already a young man who wanted to commit suicide and drank a AGFA -14, he did not die, but the police called me and blamed me for giving a young man under the age of 18 years these chemicals.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,639
Location
India
Format
Multi Format
- I will give the bottle to the father of the young man and not to the young man, because there was already a young man who wanted to commit suicide and drank a defloper 14, he did not die, but the police called me and blamed me for giving a young man under the age of 18 years these chemicals.

Wouldn't it be better if you develop the film for such young hobbyists than giving them the developer?
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,639
Location
India
Format
Multi Format
Yes ,, mostly I already do it.
But there are guys who are very passionate about buying a tank from amazon and gadgets and asking me for chemistry. What should i say to them . ?

I hope and pray that you don't get into legal trouble because of the services you render to film hobbyists in your country. It's one thing if somebody attempts to harm himself by drinking your developer, but it's a bigger disaster if a criminal gets hold of concentrated poisonous developer for the purpose of harming others. Thank god you're not making concentrated pyro developers.
 
OP
OP
mohmad khatab

mohmad khatab

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2012
Messages
1,228
Location
Egypt
Format
35mm
I hope and pray that you don't get into legal trouble because of the services you render to film hobbyists in your country. It's one thing if somebody attempts to harm himself by drinking your developer, but it's a bigger disaster if a criminal gets hold of concentrated poisonous developer for the purpose of harming others. Thank god you're not making concentrated pyro developers.
The pyro component is not available in Egypt - nor is the glycine component available?
If I found them ,, I am the first one who will drink them until I get rid of my life
 
Photrio.com contains affiliate links to products. We may receive a commission for purchases made through these links.
To read our full affiliate disclosure statement please click Here.

PHOTRIO PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Ilford ADOX Freestyle Photographic Stearman Press Weldon Color Lab Blue Moon Camera & Machine
Top Bottom