Help a beginner make their first enlargement from scratch?

[bdial]

Exposing the print at your determined base exposure in one shot is just fine.
It looks like you are doing pretty well.

 

[removed account4]

nice printing chrisbcs.
looks like now it is just fine tuning
not sure if you know about "dry down" but
wet prints look lighter than dry ones, and some papers
dry down darker than others. if you have a blow dryer
you can dry down your test strips after you make them to see
which looks best >> dry.

one thing i enjoy doing, and i only mention this
because it seems from your first print you have the hang of things ...
is to throw in a higher contrast grade filter to burn things in ... it can give
the print a bit of snap / crispness if it is missing it. it is kind of like split grade printing
but instead of sharing the whole exposure with the higher contrast grade, it is just the burning ...

have fun!
john

 

[klownshed]

Now what you're saying is that if I liked the 16 second strip as a base exposure, in order to replicate it I would need to give it 6 + 2 + 4 + 4?

No. One exposure of 16 seconds is the same as two of 8 seconds, four of 4 seconds, etc.

Test strips wouldn't work otherwise! You'd get into a right mess trying to work out which combination of times to use.

 

[ChrisBCS]

No. One exposure of 16 seconds is the same as two of 8 seconds, four of 4 seconds, etc.

Test strips wouldn't work otherwise! You'd get into a right mess trying to work out which combination of times to use.

Thanks. That's what my brain says makes sense. Maybe I just am misunderstanding Craig75's post.

 

[twelvetone12]

The lamp in the enlarger does not light instantly, it takes a split second to go from off to fully on and back again. When making many small exposures this small latency piles up so exposing a print for n times can result in less light than a long equivalent exposure.

 

[MattKing]

No. One exposure of 16 seconds is the same as two of 8 seconds, four of 4 seconds, etc.

Test strips wouldn't work otherwise! You'd get into a right mess trying to work out which combination of times to use.

Actually...
You may see a difference between the two approaches, because there is some "warm up" and "cool down" times for most light sources. It is definitely better to use the same approach for both your test and final prints.
With that in mind, I do my tests with the enlarger turned on once, and a card that sequentially covers over the paper in discrete steps. If I did my tests with several small additive exposures, I would need to use several small exposures to duplicate exactly the test exposure.
Good job with your first print.
One general suggestion: You started out with a backlit subject. Backlit subjects are kind of difficult to print, and the approach to printing them might be a bit different than the approach for more evenly lit subjects.
It would probably serve you well to do some practice with something simpler .

 

[ChrisBCS]

Actually...
You may see a difference between the two approaches, because there is some "warm up" and "cool down" times for most light sources. It is definitely better to use the same approach for both your test and final prints.
With that in mind, I do my tests with the enlarger turned on once, and a card that sequentially covers over the paper in discrete steps. If I did my tests with several small additive exposures, I would need to use several small exposures to duplicate exactly the test exposure.

The explanation makes complete sense. HOWEVER, and please don't take offense, what is the latency of enlarger lamps? I think I need some convincing that a person's reaction time to a seconds timer/metronome is faster than the latency on an enlarger lamp. As a scientist, that's a claim I would want to test for myself... Two "identical" test prints, one made incrementally, and another with the lamp remaining on.

 

[MattKing]

It is merely a question of consistency. The latency is small but meaningful, and is influenced by the timer used.
It becomes particularly relevant if you are using short exposures - as an example four one second exposures instead of one four second exposure.

 

[Bob Carnie]

I was taught and found out that the sweet spot for time on a enlarger, is between 8seconds and 30 seconds, many factors with this but I always try to be within this time line.

 

[ChrisBCS]

Roger that. Thank you!

 

[Leigh B]

If i liked the strip that was 10 seconds + 5 seconds + 5 seconds on test strip that is not the same as giving print a constant 20 seconds!

HUH???

- Leigh

 

[pentaxuser]

It is merely a question of consistency. The latency is small but meaningful, and is influenced by the timer used.

I wonder how the "Elephants" match up to all of this latency?

pentaxuser

 

[mmerig]

I've been re-reading voraciously. Split grade, etc.

But starting from "scratch", since as I have been taking photos continuously I'm in need of a little (a lot?) of anchoring. . . . .


Best,
Chris

Although I am replying to the original post, I have read to the last one as of now, #37. The following may be difficult to accept for some APUG members, my apologies in advance for any offense. Hopefully, with some reflection before posting, the content of APUG posts will improve. I should add that my posts are not perfect either.

You're doing fine with printing, but in case you have not noticed, APUG can be a great source for great advice, but also a great source of conflicting, trivial, and incorrect advice on how to do things. Your science background should help a lot on the technical aspects and sorting out the conflicts and minutia (your response in #32 is worth asking, for example). Other beginners may not fare as well, and may get caught in never-ending discussions with no satisfactory conclusion, or at least, not an obvious one. In other words, APUG can be a stormy place to anchor, and it is sometimes better to sail away to safer waters.

So now that I have pointed out how APUG advice can be dubious, here is my advice (perhaps dubious too?), in the form of problem and solution classification, for you and other beginners that are new to APUG to be aware of in posts:

1. Quick and easy solutions to trivial problems. Example, using the grain focuser with and without paper under it- usually a negligible effect on focus shift, but the paper is usually there while focusing so rarely a problem anyway.

2. Slow and difficult solutions to important problems. Example, contrast and tone control on film and prints, with the result often depending on the viewers' taste and a huge range of film, developer, paper, and image characteristics to account for.

3. Slow and difficult solutions to trivial problems: Example: Split-printing with supposedly sharper yet much denser optical filters, rather than using a single gel filter, especially when the negative is not difficult to print anyway.

4. Quick and easy solutions to important problems: Example: Calculating a new printing exposure for a new enlargement ratio based on an existing print with known exposure.

Of course there could be situations that are Quick and difficult, and Slow and easy, but I think the point is made using the four classes above that are common to APUG posts.

Most technical information on photography is covered in various texts. If there is conflicting or missing information in such texts, APUG is a good place to try and rectify the situation. APUG is also a good source for advice on nuances of photography, just don't expect a definitive answer (just look at a thread dealing with negative developer preferences, for example). APUG is also a good source for getting a sense of common problems that may be covered in a book, but easy to miss in a book or not explained well, hence the frequent APUG posts about them. It's also a great site to see what people are up to and what's new.

I think the essence for success in reading APUG posts (or anything else) is critical thinking. This comes naturally for some people, and although a very important aspect of education, is hard to teach.

 

[M Carter]

I think you did a great job on your first print - you're really at a point with that one where subjective stuff comes in.

I'll throw in that if you only buy one darkroom printing book, my favorite by a mile is Tim Rudman's "Master Printing Course", discontinued but still available. Amazing wealth of techniques from pure beginner to advanced masking, bleaching and so on. It's a real eye-opener of ideas on print finessing.

 

[cliveh]

I was taught and found out that the sweet spot for time on a enlarger, is between 8seconds and 30 seconds, many factors with this but I always try to be within this time line.

But at what size enlargement?

 

[Bob Carnie]

Any size I change the bulbs to match the need

 

[Leigh B]

Any size I change the bulbs to match the need

How can you accurately predict the enlarging time after you change the bulb?

- Leigh

 

[cliveh]

Changing the bulb to match the need is a strange way of working. Most people would change the exposure to match the need.

 

[Dinesh]

I think that the OP did a terrific job whether it was his first or the last of many.

I was taught and found out that the sweet spot for time on a enlarger, is between 8seconds and 30 seconds, many factors with this but I always try to be within this time line.

Clearly you haven't made many prints in your lifetime.

 

[MattKing]

Changing the bulb to match the need is a strange way of working. Most people would change the exposure to match the need.

Not when you are a production printer, and you print in both high quality, and high quantity.
And probably have systems set up that permit including that variable to improve the production efficiency.
All of which is much more likely to describe Bob Carnie, than me, you or the OP.
And to the OP, if you are lucky, you may see one of those epic exchanges between Dinesh and Bob Carnie. They've been quiet lately, it seems time .

 

[Leigh B]

Not when you are a production printer, and you print in both high quality, and high quantity.

But we're not talking about production printing.

This thread is about a newbie's first print.

- Leigh

 

[Peter Schrager]

Best book is fine art of b+w photography
By Bruce barnbaum...
Next best book:
hire me to reach you how to print.... you could learn at the side of a master printer...lessons learned..do it right from the beginning. .
Results...why spend the next 3 to 5 years figuring it out...

 

[MattKing]

But we're not talking about production printing.

This thread is about a newbie's first print.

- Leigh

It is, but it is important for a newbie to understand that answers on this forum come from people with a tremendous range of experience.
Remember that this is the same newbie who has a plan to print really large, poster size and up prints.

 

[Luis-F-S]

I'll try to answer the questions you asked, as my background I've been printing some 35 years and taught B&W printing at the college level for around 12 years. Here goes:

I have a Fujimoto G70 enlarger. I can use it as a Condenser or Diffuser source. Dichroic head with clean filters.

Make your life simple, use it in diffusion mode if possible, set all three filters to 0.

I've been re-reading voraciously. Split grade, etc.

Can I split grade print and dodge and burn this paper?[/QUOTE

Learn to print first before you worry about split grade. Learn to walk before you try to run.

I have 3 enlarging lenses available. 50mm, 80mm and 105mm. All Durst Neonon. The 80mm does not have click stops for the aperture, just the numbers, and the the 50mm has light falloff at larger sizes using the 6x7 carrier, my understanding is that it is too short for MF negatives.

My first questions are: 80mm or 105mm? Should I start with a test strip at grade 2?

With 6x6 you can use either, I personally like the 105 over the 80. With 6x7 or 6x9 I'd use the 105. The 50 is for 35mm & smaller. Yes, start with a test strip at grade 2 (all 3 dials at 0). Also, do yourself a favor and buy Fred Picker's the Zone VI Workshop book. It's under $4 used on the auction site. You can voraciously read it. I'd also use 8x10 paper to learn with instead of 11x14. It's cheaper.

 

[ChrisBCS]

It is, but it is important for a newbie to understand that answers on this forum come from people with a tremendous range of experience.
Remember that this is the same newbie who has a plan to print really large, poster size and up prints.

And it still is my end game! Even more so now seeing how much I enjoy the process...