Very true. But I do believe that Richard Eaton has a point: the general perception of these chemicals is uninformed and biased.
Very true. But I do believe that Richard Eaton has a point: the general perception of these chemicals is uninformed and biased.I wouldn't store C41 in the cupboard among the other useful kitchen stuff, like acetic acid, sodium hydrogen carbonate, glycerol triesters, or the scariest (2R,3R,4S,5S,6R)-2-[(2S,3S,4S,5R)-3,4-dihydroxy-2,5-bis(hydroxymethyl)oxolan-2-yl]oxy-6-(hydroxymethyl)oxane-3,4,5-triol aka sugar.
Very true. But I do believe that Richard Eaton has a point: the general perception of these chemicals is uninformed and biased.
The owner of the lab I get my slides processed at (his business is mostly just E-6 developing) told me that Fuji had already shut down their production lines for their slide film and are just selling off old stock. When they run out they'll fire the lines up again, make a few batches, and shut down again, probably raising the price as much as necessary to sustain that kind of operation, but leaving it very vulnerable to the ax if they decide it isn't worth it.
This is why the return of Ektachrome has me worried that it will lead to Fuji pulling out of E-6 altogether,
I wonder what the potential market for E6 films really is ?
I've recently talked to Fujifilm film representatives and they told me that they continue reversal film production.
Gold award for Henning Serger! Excellent post!
Of course, at the prices they charge for their reversal films, it's obvious that they will keep making them as long as there are buyers there...
(I have a love-hate relationship with Fuji. I love their films, i hate how they raise prices constantly.)
I'm sure price is a major deterrent in the wider adoption of slide film, especially among new and younger film users. Those who haven't grown up with slides, don't know what they're missing. With some good marketing, it should be possible to awaken their interest -- but it will be a hard sell if the price remains several times that of colour neg.
Not to speak of the cost of processing and the difficulty of finding somewhere to have it processed. These issues will have to be addressed by the Film Ferrania project for their E6 film to have any chance of becoming viable.
Hello Richard,
the potential is quite big.
Because reversal film has lots of advantages and unique characteristics. Have a look here: A 6-page document made by several professional film photographers and photo technology experts listing all unique characteristics, technical and economical advantages as well as emotional characteristics of reversal film:
https://www.aphog.de/wp-content/downloads/Diapositiv/Ein einzigartiges Bildmedium-das Diapositiv.pdf
(English translation is in the works).
I am shooting both colour negative and reversal film for decades (and of course BW negative/reversal and instant film, too). Professionally and for my own pleasure as an enthusiast. And for more than 25 years now I am doing scientific film tests in my own little independent optical test lab.
Comparing colour reversal and negative film in a neutral side-by-side comparison, there are indeed more advantages for reversal film.
What is absolutely needed to exploit this big potential is a much better marketing for reversal film.
But that is also partly in our own hands.
Just let's do it!
Best regards,
Henning
I was very hesitant when I wrote that, because I knew it was going to prove highly contentious! What you say is certainly true. I was debating with myself whether I should say "significantly more expensive" or "often as much as double the price", etc. etc. But I kept coming back to my own experience in trying to find the most affordable film. As elsewhere, Precisa is by far the cheapest slide film over here - about two thirds the price of Provia or Velvia. In that respect, it's good value and all that I've been shooting in 35mm for quite a while now. Unfortunately, it's not available in 120. Even more unfortunately, its availability over here is extremely limited. I managed to get a few rolls a while back, but for several months now the only local supplier I know of has been out of stock. I frequently order some from places like Macodirect and the price is still good, but most users simply won't go to that trouble.Well, I don't know the situation in South Africa where you are located, but in the big main markets the price for reversal film is not several times the price of colour negative film.
That's one of the biggest appeals of colour slide film. But only really if your ultimate goal is to project the slides - an experience I really hope the younger generation will discover! In most cases, though, I suspect scans will be made. Which, to my mind, almost negates the point of shooting slides in the first place.With reversal film you already have a perfect finished picture after development. No further steps and costs needed.
That's one of the biggest appeals of colour slide film. But only really if your ultimate goal is to project the slides - an experience I really hope the younger generation will discover! In most cases, though, I suspect scans will be made. Which, to my mind, almost negates the point of shooting slides in the first place.
Thank you.
Well, Kodak has done the same (e.g. Kodak colour negative sheet film is now much, much more expensive here in Germany than Fujichrome sheet film). Both had to do it to keep production running. No company can survive by making losses.
I prefer having the films I like at a bit higher price compared to not having my favourite films at all.
Best regards,
Henning
Little off-topic
scanning slides is much easier than scanning negatives in my experience. Negatives have the grain more evident in the high lights rather than in the shadows, as slide do, which is much more pleasant. And negatives create a lot of head-scratching when one must colour-balance them.
The advantage of negatives, in hybrid workflow, is that they compress high-dynamic-range scenes into a low-dynamic-range film which is easy to scan with any scanner.
In order to capture, in scanning, the entire dynamic range of the slide film one must have a serious scanner.
End of Off-topic.
with negative film you don't know how it is supposed to look like, so you just accept your results. With slides you have a direct view of the image so you have to adjust more to make your scan looking like the slide, this may involve some heavy manipulation like selective colour balance.My experience is the exact opposite. I find scanning slides almost impossible. The color accuracy is simply abysmal and no amount of adjustments make it right. It is so bad that I have stopped shooting E6 film, despite having many many rolls in my freezer.
My experience is the exact opposite. I find scanning slides almost impossible. The color accuracy is simply abysmal and no amount of adjustments make it right. It is so bad that I have stopped shooting E6 film, despite having many many rolls in my freezer.
These are important considerations for those doing their own scanning. I had the more casual user in mind, who orders some cheap scans when having their film processed.Little off-topic
scanning slides is much easier than scanning negatives in my experience. Negatives have the grain more evident in the high lights rather than in the shadows, as slide do, which is much more pleasant. And negatives create a lot of head-scratching when one must colour-balance them.
The advantage of negatives, in hybrid workflow, is that they compress high-dynamic-range scenes into a low-dynamic-range film which is easy to scan with any scanner.
In order to capture, in scanning, the entire dynamic range of the slide film one must have a serious scanner.
End of Off-topic.
My experience is the exact opposite. I find scanning slides almost impossible.
Frozen film? That won't be shot?
...SOS...please...send...film...SOS...
For me the statements are NOT spot on because the results do not please me. The colors are ugly, dull, and lifeless. Very very unrealistic. That's why I stopped shooting E6 film.Besides that I have to totally disagree concerning scanning from my own experience (Diapositivo's and Berri's statements are spot on),
I was very hesitant when I wrote that, because I knew it was going to prove highly contentious! What you say is certainly true. I was debating with myself whether I should say "significantly more expensive" or "often as much as double the price", etc. etc. But I kept coming back to my own experience in trying to find the most affordable film. As elsewhere, Precisa is by far the cheapest slide film over here - about two thirds the price of Provia or Velvia. In that respect, it's good value and all that I've been shooting in 35mm for quite a while now.
That's one of the biggest appeals of colour slide film. But only really if your ultimate goal is to project the slides - an experience I really hope the younger generation will discover! In most cases, though, I suspect scans will be made. Which, to my mind, almost negates the point of shooting slides in the first place.
As far as I can tell from other posts, finding good E6 processing is a major problem in many parts of the world.
For me the statements are NOT spot on because the results do not please me. The colors are ugly, dull, and lifeless. Very very unrealistic. That's why I stopped shooting E6 film.
My experience is the exact opposite. I find scanning slides almost impossible. The color accuracy is simply abysmal and no amount of adjustments make it right. It is so bad that I have stopped shooting E6 film, despite having many many rolls in my freezer.
We are are living in a crazy, marketing brain-washed world: People spending thousands of dollars for a 24, 36, 50 MP cam. And in 99,5% of the time they are only viewing their pictures on a 2k or 4k computer monitor which destroy the resolution and limit it to the extremely low 2 MP / 8 MP the monitor can show at max..
Same for those who rave about medium format or large format quality, but then in a first step destroy that quality by using a flatbed scanner, and further limit the quality by viewing the result on a computer monitor.
But people continue to ignore the physical fact that the image quality is not only determined by the input, but mainly by the whole imaging chain.
Don't worry. Soon we will discuss hybrid methods in this forum, and the scans of your slides will sing!
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