But Matt, that still leaves the question of what allows these persistent bubbles to form during processing, for some people?
That is a fascinating link but, in relation to what we are discussing here I think the major take-away for me is how it makes clear that there are a variety of different surfactants, and that some of them promote much more foaming than others. This may be one of the reasons household detergents - which are designed to promote foam - are poor choices for film.
The combination of the small amounts of surfactant in the emulsion that some films have, the water and developer used by those people, the tanks, reels and setup used by those people, including how much air and liquid is in the tank, the temperature, and the agitation schemes used by those people.
And of course that doesn't deal with the more important question about whether or not the foam matters.
I don't think you have mentioned that pox before now? The OP didn't think bubbles had any deleterious effect, and I don't think anyone else in this thread has posted evidence that they do.
I fully agree with your answer. Kodak's Photo Flo builds up on reels whether plastic or stainless steel and acts as a catalyst among other problems. Rinsing in hot water does not remove it. Only a hard scrubbing with a brush will do so. When I began teaching at the local college it was a big problem until we hand scrubbed each reel and switched to a different surfactant. The foaming and catalytic action went away immediately.
I said in post #112 that I would report back after trying a couple of things. So today I tried two things.
First, I took the tank and spiral with which I had previously generated the foam. There was a possibility that they carried wetting agent residue, because I merely rinse the tank and spiral after the final wash with wetting agent. So I poured 400ml of plain tap water into the tank and inverted it continuously for 5 minutes. No foam whatsoever. I didn't really think there would be.
Next, there was the possibility that my re-used 2-bath developer carried a build-up of surfactant from previous films. I developed a Kodak Double-X film, using a brand-new tank and spiral that I've been keeping as a reserve, and re-using the same chemicals as in post #112. Again, I performed constant inversion agitation for 4 min in bath 1, then every 30 sec for 4 min in bath 2. At the end of bath 1 there were about 10 bubbles, not enough to even take a picture. After bath 2 there were 3 bubbles.
So subject to further experience, I am beginning to believe the OP's proposal that heavy foaming is an Ilford thing, even if it doesn't happen to everyone or in every case. But I must also point out that no-one has so far produced evidence that foaming is in any way deleterious. It occurs to me that the same circumstances (e.g. heavy agitation) that create a lot of bubbles probably also continuously dislodge them? So this is all very interesting, but it's probably a storm in a teacup (neat metaphor, huh?). Anyway, I'm sticking with my preference for Ilford films.
I recommend that you use a toothbrush to scrub the reels before you process any more film.
OK … Total Care or Whitening formula? The advice doesn’t suggest you actually read my post.
If there is any residue, and it doesn't come off by washing, how is it a problem? How should I know whether there is a surfactant residue on my reels?I read it. I am stating for others that rinsing alone did not remove the surfactant from the reels.
If there is any residue, and it doesn't come off by washing, how is it a problem? How should I know whether there is a surfactant residue on my reels?
If any surfactant is left on the reels it can impede the film loading or cause the film to stick and jamb.
That's why I use stainless steel reels...
With these reels, the film doesn't have to be pushed to slide into a (sticky plastic-) reel, but you start in the centre of it and gently wind the film outwards.
And stainless steel stands the washing machine treatment too!
I really don't like plastic things, but, unfortunately enough, there isn't always an alternative (and yes, this is a personal point of view)...
I kind of wish I COULD load them, but I always, always, had trouble with them, especially with 36 exposure lengths of 35mm. Just gave up - good non sticky plastic reels work for me. Use what works for you!
Hey I just wanted to add to this thread; whatever I've tried, my Ilford films also foam massively, especially fp4 and hp5
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