First SLR

138bb · Mar 23, 2023

Hi, guys! New user here.

I’m looking for an SLR for beginners. I want to learn how to use a manual camera. I’ve been using a P&S but it’s starting to feel boring.

I have a small budget and I would prefer not to expend more than 50€. I have already made some research but I’m not sure which camera should I pick. I’ve been looking at Zenit 12 and some Praktica (MTL3, LTL3, MTL 5B, MTL 50, Super TL1000…).

I’ve also been looking for some Canon AV1, but seem to be a lot more expensive

Any thoughts or recommendations on cheap SLRs for beginners?

Thank you

runswithsizzers · Mar 23, 2023

Some 50€ used cameras are going to work, but many will not. The hard part is going to be finding one that works. It may be necessary to be flexible about brand and model, and concentrate on finding one that you know will work without needing expensive repairs.

grain elevator · Mar 23, 2023

My most recent under 50 € SLRs off ebay with lens (I assume you also want a lens in that budget) were a Minolta XD-7 and an X-500, each with a 50 1.7 IIRC. I can recommend both models, as well as the more common X-700 and X-300. No problem with some patience, but there is a risk of getting a faulty one, having to argue with the seller etc. Pretty much all old SLRs will need new light seals, which isn't hard to do.

runswithsizzers · Mar 23, 2023

I don't know what the used camera market is like in Europe, but from the perspective of an American, the brands you mentioned - Praktica and Zenit - would not be at the top of my list. Mostly, because they are less common where I live, and I don't know much about them. I'm sure there are many Praktica and Zenit users who are very happy with them. But I think a 35mm SLR camera that was made in Japan in the 1970s or 1980s is more likely to be a good reliable camera than some others. Of course, generalizations tell us nothing about any one camera, in particular.

Also be aware that some (but not all) camera meters of that era were designed to use mercury batteries which have since become unavailable. Depending the camera, and depending on how much you require accurate meter readings - this may be either: insignificant, a minor annoyance, or a major inconvenience. So before buying any used camera, find out what kind of battery the meter needs, just so you know what you are getting into.

BAC1967 · Mar 23, 2023

I would keep your options open and get whatever good working one you can find. If you can find an M42 camera of which there are many that are affordable, there are also many affordable lenses.

chuck3565 · Mar 23, 2023

I would avoid Zenits and Kievs. Limited shutter speeds and the Kiev 19s have light leaks plus light through the viewfinder affect the light meter accuracy. Cosina made cameras are very nice. Available as Vivitar, Promaster and even one Nikon model. Chinese copies of the Cosina like the Hikaris are pretty good.

138bb · Mar 23, 2023

I think im going to look up for a Minolta, as they seem more reliable. And I think I might be able to find a cheap one.

Thanks a lot for your help! I really appreciate it.

koraks · Mar 23, 2023

Minolta's are nice, Praktica's can be nice as well - I quite liked the B200 and in fact I think we must have a couple somewhere in the family, still. Mamiya's are around as well, and...well, lots more.

You know, pretty much anything can work. I think @runswithsizzers made the most relevant remark right away: the trick is to find a camera that's in operational condition. My experience is that the 1990s models that are predominantly electronically controlled are actually the more reliable workhorses. They are also often deemed as less 'sexy' and more boring, and hence tend to be undervalued (in my opinion). The Minolta's mentioned by @grain elevator neatly fit into this category. They're very functional cameras, fairly common (at least in Europe) but less sought after than Canons and Nikons from the same era, and there's some really decent glass for them floating around (although less so quantitatively than for Canon & Nikon).

Anyway - just see what you run into and pick it up if it appeals to you. Check second hand stores, let people know you're looking, check 2nd hand websites, etc. Buying in person is generally a better idea with this sort of thing than online, IMO.

mshchem · Mar 23, 2023

Yard and garage sales

BAC1967 · Mar 23, 2023

138bb said:
I think im going to look up for a Minolta, as they seem more reliable. And I think I might be able to find a cheap one.

Thanks a lot for your help! I really appreciate it.

That's what I learned on, an srTscII. Really nice cameras and lenses, any of the srT models would fit your requirements.

Beverly Hills · Mar 23, 2023

runswithsizzers said:
I don't know what the used camera market is like in Europe, but from the perspective of an American, the brands you mentioned - Praktica and Zenit - would not be at the top of my list. Mostly, because they are less common where I live, and I don't know much about them. I'm sure there are many Praktica and Zenit users who are very happy with them.

I would definitivly recomandet the Zenit, because it can't hardly be cheaper and you can also used it in a varity of ways.

Seriously folks, you can drive a nail into the wall with this
if you want to hang a picture at home. Imediatly afterwarts you can used it to take a picture of the hanging picture.
If you use it to hang up more valuable paintings and are surprised by burglars - it won't be difficult to overwhelm
the strongest predators

with a Zenit!

You collect cameras but have not yet found a LEICA IIIc
"LUFTWAFFE" in the very rare dark grey version ?
Lucky you, you just saved a Lot of money

!

There are 3 different color variants of the Zenith in the
"Luftwaffe" version !!

There is also a dark blue with the engraving :

" Eigentum U96 Kriegsmarine" (I've seen them
for a little less than 890.00 )....!!

But this here is absolutely sufficient for the OP :

That is the cheapest from the "Luftwaffe" series of 1975
(without engraving "LUFTWAFFE").....

!

And the budged Zenit is this here :

(that's my serious recomandet 138bb)

mshchem · Mar 23, 2023

Nikon F80

mshchem · Mar 23, 2023

Beverly Hills said:
I would definitivly recomandet the Zenit, because it can't hardly be cheaper and you can also used it in a varity of ways.

Seriously folks, you can drive a nail into the wall with this
if you want to hang a picture at home. Imediatly afterwarts you can used it to take a picture of the hanging picture.
If you use it to hang up more valuable paintings and are surprised by burglars - it won't be difficult to overwhelm
the strongest predators with a Zenit!

You collect cameras but have not yet found a LEICA IIIc
"LUFTWAFFE" in the very rare dark grey version ?
Lucky you, you just saved a Lot of money !

There are 3 different color variants of the Zenith in the
"Luftwaffe" version !!

There is also a dark blue with the engraving :

" Eigentum U96 Kriegsmarine" (I've seen them
for a little less than 890.00 )....!!

But this here is absolutely sufficient for the OP :

View attachment 333481
That is the cheapest from the "Luftwaffe" series of 1975
(without engraving "LUFTWAFFE").....!

And the budged Zenit is this here :

(that's my serious recomandet 138bb)
View attachment 333482

These are actually quite attractive, great lenses (so I've been told)

Beverly Hills · Mar 23, 2023

mshchem said:
These are actually quite attractive, great lenses (so I've been told)

Yes, but it is a bit relative. The lens coating is not quite up
to western standards compared to cameras of the 50s, 60s!

The more modern 122 has also a Carl Zeiss Helios/Biotar copy.

GRHazelton · Mar 23, 2023

I have a Praktica LTL I bought perhaps 50 years ago. About 30 years ago I switched to K mount Pentaxes, and the LTL was put aside.
Despite heavy use and having been bounced off a sidewalk it still works; the shutter sounds accurate, and its implementation of stop down metering is excellent, as compared to most other systems. Since it mounts 42mm lenses there are hundreds out there. The 50mm f1.8 it came with gave excellent results, although it now needs a CLA to cure a sticky diaphragm.
The LTL is not flawless. The viewfinder is not the brightest, although adequate. Fit and finish is not the best, the camera feels a little agricultural. But it is rugged and probably cheap.
While the camera calls for a PX625 mercury cell, I think it uses a bridge meter circuit which would work properly with a silver oxide cell.

CMoore · Mar 23, 2023

I have NO Idea about price, but..................... the Minolta XG-M is a fabulous camera.
And it has a lot of great lens to choose from.
good luck

Beverly Hills · Mar 23, 2023

GRHazelton said:
While the camera calls for a PX625 mercury cell, I think it uses a bridge meter circuit which would work properly with a silver oxide cell.

You have experienced a lot with these batteries. I remember ...how I had to take out a bank loan in the 90s because of 2 zinc air batteries as a replacement for the px625 for my Braun nizo.

@ 138bb.....the Zenit 12 need Lr43. Also very cheap and good for 2 years. I just bought a 10 pack at about 2.50 today!! ( 10 x LR 44 = slightly different)

xkaes · Mar 23, 2023

138bb said:
I think im going to look up for a Minolta, as they seem more reliable. And I think I might be able to find a cheap one.

Thanks a lot for your help! I really appreciate it.

Check out the Minolta MAXXUM 5. And amazing DO-IT-ALL camera. I have three of them -- I got each one, like, new, with lenses, for under $25 each. Built-in flash, built in motor drive, tiny body.

xkaes · Mar 23, 2023

138bb said:
I think im going to look up for a Minolta, as they seem more reliable. And I think I might be able to find a cheap one.

Thanks a lot for your help! I really appreciate it.

Check out the Minolta MAXXUM 5. And amazing DO-IT-ALL camera. I have three of them -- I got each one, like, new, with lenses, for under $25 each. Built-in flash, built in motor drive, tiny body. 150 page manual to explain everything it does!!!

GRHazelton · Mar 23, 2023

Beverly Hills said:
You have experienced a lot with these batteries. I remember ...how I had to take out a bank loan in the 90s because of 2 zinc air batteries as a replacement for the px625 for my Braun nizo.

@ 138bb.....the Zenit 12 need Lr43. Also very cheap and good for 2 years. I just bought a 10 pack at about 2.50 today!! ( 10 x LR 44 = slightly different)

My Pentax Spotmatic F uses a bridge meter circuit, and its happy with silver oxide cells with the same physical dimensions as the PX 625. The tip off to a bridge circuit seems to be that the meter needle, when the desired exposure is correct, rests on a fixed point in the viewfinder, rather than lining up with a movable pointer.

Marcelo Paniagua · Mar 23, 2023

Definetly Minolta would be the best bang for your bucks on that budget. If you buy it from the bay look for a seller with good reputation. The bay always sides up with the buyer but be sure it is described in working condition, no fungus, etc.

Marcelo Paniagua · Mar 23, 2023

mshchem said:
Nikon F80

Thats a great camera but you wont get one for $50 dlls (body only). One with lens is going around for $90-100.

Marcelo Paniagua · Mar 23, 2023

xkaes said:
Check out the Minolta MAXXUM 5. And amazing DO-IT-ALL camera. I have three of them -- I got each one, like, new, with lenses, for under $25 each. Built-in flash, built in motor drive, tiny body. 150 page manual to explain everything it does!!!

Yep great cameras and fantastic lens selection. No quality issues there. Not really my cup of tea but best cameras you Will get at the specified budget.

George Mann · Mar 24, 2023

Praktica's are a good choice. Most of them still work. But 90% of the used cameras and lenses sold today have serious defects, if they work at all.

I would buy the camera and lens from a local seller if possible so you can inspect it.

Roberts UsedPhotoPro is also a legit outfit to purchase from.

cliveh · Mar 24, 2023

I think you should try and extend your budget and buy a Pentax K1000. The best universal student camera ever.

First SLR

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