End of one Retina era: Chris Sherlock retires

[JPD]

We're these Ektar lenses from Eastman Kodak in USA or were they relabeled Schneider lenses? And why is the 47mm version special?

The pre-war and wartime 3,5 Ektars are Schneider lenses. A few Retinas after the war had american made 3,5/50mm (marked "Made in U.S.A.") and 2,0/47mm Ektars.

The 2,0/47mm Ektar = The faster top lens, made in the U.S. which many americans like, and since most (or all?) of them where sold in America they are attractive for European collectors as well.

 

[Minolta93]

Is yours one of this generation? If so, you can learn to service it if you study Chris Sherlock's video tutorials, yes. But for someone who hasn't had prior experience tearing down and servicing a camera like this, expect to take a week or more to do the job. Whether its worth it or not is up to you. Do you want a project like this on your plate? Is the lens in good enough condition to warrant the effort? Will you actually use the camera when its done?
This generation of Retina IIa is early in the design process, and its not the best engineering. Kodak AG was still learning how to make a beamsplitter rangefinder, and this one's not the best. (they're not easy to calibrate, now that they're 70 years old). I would say that it depends which lens yours has. If its the 47mm Ektar, then definitely, get it fixed up. The f2.0 Schneider Xenon version is also worth fixing. But if yours has the f3.5 "Ektar" like whats on the camera in the photo, I would think twice about investing in getting the camera serviced.

Yes, mine is one of those. The lens seems to be in great condition. It's the f2.0 Schneider. How much might a repair service cost if I were to send it to someone? I'd probably only be willing to pay $50, and I'm sure a service would cost much more than that.

Whatever you do, teach yourself camera-repair using a junker camera, and not a keeper. Buy a Petri 7s or something else that's common and nearly worthless, and practice on it until you're comfortable working with jeweler's screwdrivers and other small tools, and you're confident that you can remove and reassemble the rangefinder without messing it up. Your Retina will thank you.

Mark Overton

I have a few broken/frozen rangefinders like a Konica II, stuff like that. Maybe one of those is a good candidate? For what it's worth, I have taken apart a 50mm Minolta MD lens to clean sand out of it. I definitely don't want to mess up this Retina. It is currently the oldest camera I own and if I could get out and shoot with it that would be wonderful.

 

[removedacct1]

We're these Ektar lenses from Eastman Kodak in USA or were they relabeled Schneider lenses? And why is the 47mm version special?

The f3.5 Ektar is of uncertain origin. I can't say if its a Rochester product, or a rebranded Schneider lens (I suspect it is). Many of the so-called Ektar (and Anastigmat) lenses on the Retinas were rebranded Schneider products.
The 47mm Ektar lens from Rochester is a genuine Kodak product: it has a CAMEROSITY serial number on the front dress ring. Most on the Retina II's are either 1946 or 1947 lenses. In my experience, these are similar in performance to the Schneider Retina-Xenon in most ways, except "bokeh": the 47mm Ektar has very Petzval-like bokeh when used wide open, or maybe as far as f4.0. Otherwise the 47mm Ektar isn't any better or worse than the Schneider or Rodenstock lenses on these Retinas, it just has a bit different "feel" to how it renders images.

People tend to value the Retina II with the 47mm Ektar way more than the other lens version, citing its "rarity" as the driving force behind its price. (Expect to pay $500. for a good example) But the truth is that there were approximately 4000 of the Retina II made with the 47mm Ektar lens on them, so its far from "rare".

 

[removedacct1]

Yes, mine is one of those. The lens seems to be in great condition. It's the f2.0 Schneider. How much might a repair service cost if I were to send it to someone? I'd probably only be willing to pay $50, and I'm sure a service would cost much more than that.

When I service a Retina IIa, the camera is completely disassembled down to its base components, everything is cleaned manually and/or ultrasonically, relubricated where appropriate, reassembled and calibrated. This process involves about 8 to 10 hours of labor, depending on how difficult the camera is being. How much do you think that is worth? (Hint: its definitely more than $50) I doubt you're going to find anyone willing to perform a complete, proper service of ANY camera for $50.

 

[madNbad]

Paul, One of the small things you might look into is a way to keep the metal eyepiece from scratching glasses. Dave Sleeth at Advance Camera has serviced several Retinas for me and has applied a plastic buffer on the eyepiece. If someone would start 3D printing snap on ones, that would be great. Best of luck and it’s always nice to have another repairer in stat.

 

[markjwyatt]

The f3.5 Ektar is of uncertain origin. I can't say if its a Rochester product, or a rebranded Schneider lens (I suspect it is). Many of the so-called Ektar (and Anastigmat) lenses on the Retinas were rebranded Schneider products.
The 47mm Ektar lens from Rochester is a genuine Kodak product: it has a CAMEROSITY serial number on the front dress ring. Most on the Retina II's are either 1946 or 1947 lenses. In my experience, these are similar in performance to the Schneider Retina-Xenon in most ways, except "bokeh": the 47mm Ektar has very Petzval-like bokeh when used wide open, or maybe as far as f4.0. Otherwise the 47mm Ektar isn't any better or worse than the Schneider or Rodenstock lenses on these Retinas, it just has a bit different "feel" to how it renders images.

People tend to value the Retina II with the 47mm Ektar way more than the other lens version, citing its "rarity" as the driving force behind its price. (Expect to pay $500. for a good example) But the truth is that there were approximately 4000 of the Retina II made with the 47mm Ektar lens on them, so its far from "rare".

Hi Paul - do you see any fundamental differences between the 1950s Rodenstock Heligons and Schneider Xenons? I have a 50mm f2 Heligon on a IIIc, and a stand-alone 50mm f1.9 Xenon (not Retina Xenon, likely for the Instamatic) that I use on a Reflex IV. I feel like the bokeh of the Heligon is smoother close to wide open, but not sure if that is just a few cases or more generally true. I suspect the f1.9 Schneider Xenon is very similar if not really the same as the f2 Xenon on the rangefinder models, but I could be wrong there.

 

[Minolta93]

When I service a Retina IIa, the camera is completely disassembled down to its base components, everything is cleaned manually and/or ultrasonically, relubricated where appropriate, reassembled and calibrated. This process involves about 8 to 10 hours of labor, depending on how difficult the camera is being. How much do you think that is worth? (Hint: its definitely more than $50) I doubt you're going to find anyone willing to perform a complete, proper service of ANY camera for $50.

Yeah, with the labor that goes into it, even at a wage that you'd see for a fast food worker, you're already looking at well over $100. I think it's reasonable to assume a servicing from a skilled technician could be around $300 or so. I couldn't spend that kind of money on a camera now, I think. One day when I do have the money I wouldn't mind, I'd consider the money spent as charity and my gift to the world by bringing a camera back from the dead.

$300 is 3 shifts' worth of pay for me. I suppose if I wanted to, I could afford it, but it's not reasonable on my budget. Maybe in a couple years when I get a better job.

I think for starters I'll open up the top case of my Retina and have a look inside. There's something rattling in there--I think it's the small spring that's supposed to work with the frame counter. With any luck the problem will be staring me in the face and I'll be able to fix it without digging in deeper. I think there must be some jammed mechanism stopping the shutter button from activating the shutter release.

 

[removedacct1]

Yeah, with the labor that goes into it, even at a wage that you'd see for a fast food worker, you're already looking at well over $100. I think it's reasonable to assume a servicing from a skilled technician could be around $300 or so. I couldn't spend that kind of money on a camera now, I think. One day when I do have the money I wouldn't mind, I'd consider the money spent as charity and my gift to the world by bringing a camera back from the dead.

$300 is 3 shifts' worth of pay for me. I suppose if I wanted to, I could afford it, but it's not reasonable on my budget. Maybe in a couple years when I get a better job.

I think for starters I'll open up the top case of my Retina and have a look inside. There's something rattling in there--I think it's the small spring that's supposed to work with the frame counter. With any luck the problem will be staring me in the face and I'll be able to fix it without digging in deeper. I think there must be some jammed mechanism stopping the shutter button from activating the shutter release.

If you have a IIa, and the accessory shoe is mounted FROM INSIDE the top cover, there's a very good possibility that one or more of the mounting screws have fallen off INSIDE the top cover, and fallen into the film advance gears. So first things first, look at the accessory shoe and see if the screws mount from the outside (you'll see the top of slotted chromed screws) or from underneath, in which case you'll only see the tiny ends of the screws visible.
Attached photo shows what the accessory shoe looks like if the screws mount it from underneath the top cover. If there's a blank hole in one or more of these places, the screw is loose inside the top cover.

 

[removedacct1]

Yeah, with the labor that goes into it, even at a wage that you'd see for a fast food worker, you're already looking at well over $100. I think it's reasonable to assume a servicing from a skilled technician could be around $300 or so. I couldn't spend that kind of money on a camera now, I think.

I charge $135 USD plus return shipping, for full service of a IIa. As much as I'd like to pay myself what I believe the job is worth, few people are willing to pay much more than this.

 

[Alex Varas]

No, it doesn't mean that at all. As Chris has stated on his web site, he's recommending me as the alternative option for Retina service, and I learned from Chris and follow his protocols exactly. I currently work on an average of 4 cameras every week, and the queue of jobs is about 2 weeks long right now. So its not as if there is no service technician to turn to now that Chris has retired. I see no reason to think that the price of a well-serviced Retina is going to double or triple anytime soon.

+1 Paul, great repairman and great person.

I wish Mr Sherlock a long and nice retirement, I have done all my retinas following his videos and instructions.

 

[Alan9940]

I just got back my Retina IIa from Paul. He did a CLA and the camera now operates smoother than it has in years. Highly recommend his service.

 

[el_37]

This is what I get for dragging my feet for the past 4 years on having my Retina Reflex IV serviced...........

 

[removedacct1]

This is what I get for dragging my feet for the past 4 years on having my Retina Reflex IV serviced...........

I have conversed with Chris about this matter, and as far as he knows, there's nobody else who will work on any of the Reflex models. I don't, and I'm not sure I ever will - they're a mechanical nightmare inside. But I'm not gonna say never, perhaps someday I will. At the moment, my work queue is approaching three weeks long, so I have more than enough camera work here without expanding the list of models I service. One of the issues with servicing the Reflex type Retinas is that they take nearly 3X as long to do as a IIa does, for example, and so my fee for doing them would approach $300USD, and I doubt many people would care to pay that much.
I think you're going to have a hard time finding a repair technician who works on your camera, sorry to say.

 

[removedacct1]

I just got back my Retina IIa from Paul. He did a CLA and the camera now operates smoother than it has in years. Highly recommend his service.

Thank you very much! I appreciate your support.

 

[removedacct1]

+1 Paul, great repairman and great person.

I wish Mr Sherlock a long and nice retirement, I have done all my retinas following his videos and instructions.

Thank you!

 

[Sirius Glass]

This is what I get for dragging my feet for the past 4 years on having my Retina Reflex IV serviced...........

Drag your feet long enough and there will no longer be service people available or the part you need may no longer be available. So hop to it or you will just have to replace it with a Hasselblad. That could be harmful to your finances!

 

[greg zinselmeier]

This is sad

 

[el_37]

Drag your feet long enough and there will no longer be service people available or the part you need may no longer be available. So hop to it or you will just have to replace it with a Hasselblad. That could be harmful to your finances!

You know how it is when you get older- 4 years seems like 4 months....

 

[Sirius Glass]

You know how it is when you get older- 4 years seems like 4 months....

... and the weight goes up.

 

[j-dogg]

No, it doesn't mean that at all. As Chris has stated on his web site, he's recommending me as the alternative option for Retina service, and I learned from Chris and follow his protocols exactly. I currently work on an average of 4 cameras every week, and the queue of jobs is about 2 weeks long right now. So its not as if there is no service technician to turn to now that Chris has retired. I see no reason to think that the price of a well-serviced Retina is going to double or triple anytime soon.

Got time for a Reflex? I think it's a II. I'm on the road trucking when I get home I caan send it to you, with 50mm and 135mm lenses. I was just thinking of sending it to Chris but, you know what, good for him I hope he enjoys his retirement.

 

[removedacct1]

Got time for a Reflex? I think it's a II. I'm on the road trucking when I get home I caan send it to you, with 50mm and 135mm lenses. I was just thinking of sending it to Chris but, you know what, good for him I hope he enjoys his retirement.

I don't work on the Reflex models. They're a nightmare of over-engineered complexity. People would not be willing to pay for the three days of labor involved in servicing one.

 

[el_37]

I don't work on the Reflex models. They're a nightmare of over-engineered complexity. People would not be willing to pay for the three days of labor involved in servicing one.

If it was around $300 as you posted above- I am sure a few people would. I think with international shipping it would have been over $300 to have Chris work on one. If you do have any interest in the future that would be great.

I am a little shocked that a leaf shutter SLR specialist has not appeared- there is enough of a cult around the Retina Reflexes and Voigtlander Ultra/Bessmatics to at least support someone doing part time repairs.

 

[removedacct1]

If it was around $300 as you posted above- I am sure a few people would. I think with international shipping it would have been over $300 to have Chris work on one. If you do have any interest in the future that would be great.

I am a little shocked that a leaf shutter SLR specialist has not appeared- there is enough of a cult around the Retina Reflexes and Voigtlander Ultra/Bessmatics to at least support someone doing part time repairs.

I've reviewed my estimate for the time and effort involved in doing a Reflex, and decided I wouldn't entertain the idea for less than $400. They're a pain in the arse to service, and I don't have all the appropriate tools to do it (would have to get some things made), plus I don't have any spare parts for any of the Reflexes, which makes it rather unfeasible. Plus, I really dislike how they're engineered - they're no fun to work on. I'm hoping to avoid including them in my repertoire.
Besides, I am working 5 days a week doing all the other models already, so I don't really want to be any busier than I already am!

Maybe ask Zacks Camera Repairs in RI and see if they'd do it. They seem to handle almost any camera. How capable they are I cannot say.

 

[el_37]

I've reviewed my estimate for the time and effort involved in doing a Reflex, and decided I wouldn't entertain the idea for less than $400. They're a pain in the arse to service, and I don't have all the appropriate tools to do it (would have to get some things made), plus I don't have any spare parts for any of the Reflexes, which makes it rather unfeasible. Plus, I really dislike how they're engineered - they're no fun to work on. I'm hoping to avoid including them in my repertoire.
Besides, I am working 5 days a week doing all the other models already, so I don't really want to be any busier than I already am!

Maybe ask Zacks Camera Repairs in RI and see if they'd do it. They seem to handle almost any camera. How capable they are I cannot say.

I certainly understand. I used to repair vacuum tube amplifiers and electronics as my sole line of work for a few years and there were certain things I would just not work on because they were just absolutely abysmal for me to work on. I certainly had the skill and parts/tools to work on them- but you had to be a really good/steady customer for me to bother with it. Even then sometimes you really had to twist my arm.

Out of curiosity had Chris ever indicated what the actual volume of Reflex repairs he carried out actually was? I imagine it was a fraction of the rangefinder models.

 

[removedacct1]

I certainly understand. I used to repair vacuum tube amplifiers and electronics as my sole line of work for a few years and there were certain things I would just not work on because they were just absolutely abysmal for me to work on. I certainly had the skill and parts/tools to work on them- but you had to be a really good/steady customer for me to bother with it. Even then sometimes you really had to twist my arm.

Out of curiosity had Chris ever indicated what the actual volume of Reflex repairs he carried out actually was? I imagine it was a fraction of the rangefinder models.

I don't know for a fact, but I suspect that collectively the Reflex variants were maybe 10-15% of his business. You can always ask him.