Ektachrome E-1 Processing Kit Unopened Should I Open?

[mshchem]

E-1

Color Developer inner carton with glass bottle of NaOH

 

[mshchem]

Little bottle of Na OH inside inner carton of E-1 Color Developer, 355mL water can for reference.

 

[LAG]

Excuse me

We crossed posts (i'm new in the forum and too slow writting in english) I'm glad you've changed your mind Mike

P.S. Edit Message to check for spelling errors, and say thanks for the Photos

 

[Photo Engineer]

That is different than the E1 kit that I used. Mine had a tiny bottle of Benzyl Alcohol in the can of CD.

There was a foil packet of a trimer of formaldehyde (a solid powder which was difficult to dissolve) and a tiny bottle of Photo Flo in the kit as well. Later kits had replaced this with one bottle of 37% formalin and Photo Flo.

PE

 

[AgX]

Where did that Benzyl Alcohol go? Or how was it substituted?

 

[mshchem]

Note that the cans of hardener and clearing bath/fixer are labeled for E-1 or E-2. The instructions are a 1956 revision, this is a 1/2 gallon kit. Outer box says for 120 and 620 films. I'm wondering if the 3 1/2 gallon version was different? My instructions are dated 3-56, it says that E-1 kits are available in 1 and 3 1/2 gallon sizes. Mine is 1/2 gallon? Maybe this is an amateur kit??
Looks like Ektachrome was ASA 8 in my 1950 handbook I wonder if 100 speed fuji Provia will work in this soup. I'm going to shoot a 36 exposure roll, about 10 frames at iso 100 then I'm going to bracket 3 or 4 stops in either direction, may not get anything at all, I know this will be my only chance to try
Best Regards Mike

 

[Photo Engineer]

Nothing today AFAIK will work in this process. I hope I am wrong.

BZA can be substituted in some cases by pH or by things disclosed in Eaton's book.

PE

 

[mshchem]

I was just reading a Google e book copy of a 1955 Popular Photography. EK had just introduced the Kodacolor Universal film and new C print paper and 122 process. The editor said he was going WAY OUT on a limb to predict that the C print would soon replace dye transfer for all but the most demanding applications. Kodak was printing the hew paper with 3 separate exposures RGB, but all the talk was about using a single exposure filter pack with CMY. The recommendation was basically wait until the experts figured it out it wasn't ready for home use..
Best Regards Mike

 

[AgX]

The kit is stilll usable and one can put the solids back into their boxes and seal those in a foil bag.

The kit is now more informative than in its virgin state.

 

[mshchem]

Disemboweled Elk? If someone has 60 year old ektachrome in a desk drawer they probably aren't in any rush to get it processed
Mike

 

[LAG]

Excuse me Mike

… The instructions are a 1956 revision, this is a 1/2 gallon kit. Outer box says for 120 and 620 films. I'm wondering if the 3 1/2 gallon version was different? My instructions are dated 3-56, it says that E-1 kits are available in 1 and 3 1/2 gallon sizes. Mine is 1/2 gallon? Maybe this is an amateur kit?? …

I don’t think so, those kits were prepared to use by any kind of photographer in their own darkrooms … no such distinctions.

…Looks like Ektachrome was ASA 8 in my 1950 handbook I wonder if 100 speed fuji Provia will work in this soup. I'm going to shoot a 36 exposure roll, about 10 frames at iso 100 then I'm going to bracket 3 or 4 stops in either direction, may not get anything at all, I know this will be my only chance to try

Best Regards Mike

8ASA for sheet film, but 32ASA for roll film. Bracketing is (always) a good idea

 

[Photo Engineer]

I processed E1 Ektachrome at the age of 12 or thereabouts. I saved money and bought one of the first kits sold. I still have some pretty good slides from the 1950s on E1 and later E2.

I have several unopened kits here for E2, E3 or E4 (I've forgotten and they are stored), and I'm pretty sure they are going bad.

PE

 

[mshchem]

I will be surprised if I get anything. Good to know if any old rolls of Ektachrome Elk come along they will have a chance. Can't really say I feel like I committed a crime against humanity by opening the cans. More to come. I still have the minor inconvenience of working 2 or 3 days a week. I only defile antique color kits on my days off. Disembowled really? That's funny. Best Mike

 

[falotico]

Gee, they even opened King Tut's Tomb--I didn't know there was a cult of the E-1 Kit. Half expect the Mummy to come staggering out of the dark room and threaten us all, "You have broken the seal of the sacred home-processing box! Now all your film will turn magenta!" Incidentally, when they opened King Tut's Tomb they discovered that the fixer still worked. Little known fact.

 

[Michael Howard]

If Einstein was correct, and you put that E1 kit on a rocket aimed at a planet that would take 60 years to get there at warp 1, wouldn't the kit be factory fresh when it arrived?

Um, no. You have to slingshot around the sun at warp 8.

 

[LAG]

I will be surprised if I get anything ...

Joking apart, this is what i’d do with that Fuji 100/135 to avoid surprises (because you don’t have to ruin all the film in a single shot, but i'd bet you already knew this) Making tests with shorts strips first (doing the whole process) or confirming some chemical conditions before you begin with, will help to shorten and clearing the unknowns.

Besides, perhaps it's possible to change the First Developer (if ruined) with some other fresh and new, and even if the Colour Developer is useless (the crux), if the rest of chemicals are "in good shape" you can get B&W slides

I would also set the speed of that Velvia to 50 on your camera (if possible), besides those +/- e.v.'s you plan to do

I processed E1 Ektachrome at the age of 12 or thereabouts. I saved money and bought one of the first kits sold. I still have some pretty good slides from the 1950s on E1 and later E2.

I have several unopened kits here for E2, E3 or E4 (I've forgotten and they are stored), and I'm pretty sure they are going bad.

PE

There is a way to find out, and many people would love to

 

[Photo Engineer]

They have gone bad. The CD portion is eating the metal caps of the tiny bottles. Sorry, all I have is a rather incomplete digital pic. And, it is too big to upload. The kit shown is an E3 kit.

PE

 

[mshchem]

Do I dare run this on my Jobo? I remember old days before the factory hardened emulsions that stuff was pretty soft. The thought of standing and inverting a Nikor tank every 30 seconds for an hour and a half seems like a lot of work.. I have loaded a Nikon F5 with Fuji Provia-F iso 100. Set it to P auto, with 3 exposure auto bracketing -1, 0, +1, EV. This is how NASA did it when they were shooting F5's. So this will be a good place to start.
I'm going to make up the chemistry and divide it into 4 x 1 pint bottles at least for the developers. This will give me at least 4 good runs with "fresh" 60 year old chemistry. If I get anything resembling a slide I will consider it a victory.
To boldly go where no one has gone before!
Ha Ha, Mike

 

[Photo Engineer]

It uses a hardener, and runs at a lower temperature than modern color films.

But the CD will probably not work!!!!!

PE

 

[stefan4u]

Wasn’t the color developing agent in Process E1 CD1 (N,N-Diethyl-p-phenylenediamine Sulphate) or a similar stuff? Genochrome (N,N-Diethyl-p-phenylenediamine Sulphite) maybe…

It should be a pale, slightly pink powder. I used a few years ago a similar stuff, called “T-22” (Diäthyl-p-phenylendiamsulfat, written in german… this is CD1 too). It was factory sealed in its little bags from former East German ORWO, about 25 years old and just worked like intended.

I would give it a try…

Edit:
You surely can use it in your Jobo, but I would use a separate bottle for that color developer and clean everything good after use. CD1 based developers of that decades are aging quite quick / are barely stable and stains plastics dark-pink with ease…

All the best, stefan

 

[Photo Engineer]

I believe that all processes offered for home use used CD3. It is the least toxic and least allergenic of all of the early developing agents. But then, it should say somewhere on the package what CD is present.

PE

 

[stefan4u]

Oh, you are probably right, processes above and including E2 used CD3 for sure.

All the best, stefan

 

[mshchem]

Wasn’t the color developing agent in Process E1 CD1 (N,N-Diethyl-p-phenylenediamine Sulphate) or a similar stuff? Genochrome (N,N-Diethyl-p-phenylenediamine Sulphite) maybe…

It should be a pale, slightly pink powder. I used a few years ago a similar stuff, called “T-22” (Diäthyl-p-phenylendiamsulfat, written in german… this is CD1 too). It was factory sealed in its little bags from former East German ORWO, about 25 years old and just worked like intended.

I would give it a try…

Edit:
You surely can use it in your Jobo, but I would use a separate bottle for that color developer and clean everything good after use. CD1 based developers of that decades are aging quite quick / are barely stable and stains plastics dark-pink with ease…

All the best, stefan

I have no idea what developing agent it is. Cans have all kinds of warnings, don't breathe dust, don't get solutions on skin, can cause allergic skin irritation, and if it does don't blame EKc. The powder in the inner carton of the color developer is a finely divided uniform powder with a very slight pinkish cast when viewed under a "Daylight" LED light source. There are absolutely no ingredients listed on either developer can , the box, or instructions. The instructions warn that these chemicals are more hazardous than black and white. They recommend in case of contact with skin wash at once with an acid type hand cleaner such as pHisoderm or pHisoHex and rinse with plenty of water.Use gloves for every aspect of the procedure and wash the outside of the gloves with acid hand cleaner before removing.

Sounds like KGB spy dust to me, probably something EK "borrowed" from Agfa in late '45. I'm going to be very careful I'm an old Chemist, not a bold Chemist.
I'm going to try to get a roll shot and give it a try in the next few days. I need to see if I still have a photo-flood around, other wise I've got a 500W enlarger bulb.
Best Regards Mike

 

[AgX]

I am very surprised to learn about such comprehensive warning advice given on a US product from 1955.
From that I rather would have located the kit much later in time.

 

[LAG]

Excuse me

... Genochrome (N,N-Diethyl-p-phenylenediamine Sulphite) maybe…

I think that's right

.... Cans have all kinds of warnings, don't breathe dust, don't get solutions on skin, can cause allergic skin irritation, and if it does don't blame EKc. The powder in the inner carton of the color developer is a finely divided uniform powder with a very slight pinkish cast when viewed under a "Daylight" LED light source. There are absolutely no ingredients listed on either developer can , the box, or instructions. The instructions warn that these chemicals are more hazardous than black and white. They recommend in case of contact with skin wash at once with an acid type hand cleaner such as pHisoderm or pHisoHex and rinse with plenty of water.Use gloves for every aspect of the procedure and wash the outside of the gloves with acid hand cleaner before removing....

Colour chemicals are usually more varied or complex and do requiere more attention, but not necessarily have to be more hazardous than B&W (B&W Direct Positive process uses Bleach ...). With the standard precautions and handled with care, there should be no problem at all. Remember to pay attention on their disposal as well.

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