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Durst M605: can't focus 50mm Rogonar lens with bigger magnification -

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Melvin J Bramley said:
It is confusing but i think the original poster has either an assembly issue with his m605 or should just purchase a better lens that is readily available inexpensively.
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Yeah.. now if you look from the OP's perspective, this is exactly the dilemma. Try to fix the enlarger (which may not need fixing), or buy a new lens (which may see the same problem if the enlarger is botched)?
 
BeselerOrNot said:
Already did. Waiting for Royal Mail to do it's part. I hope that Durst Neonon won't have the same issue!
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The Durst Neonon lenses have 6 elements in 4 groups and were made from 1980. When you experience the same problem, I don't think you can blame the lens anymore.
 
So Durst, one of the best enlarger makers in history of ... enlarging making, beating most other brands in every category, made an enlarger that does not focus with a Rogonar, a very popular at the cheaper end of things enlarging lens. Does this make sense to anyone?
 
Hassasin said:
a Rogonar, a very popular at the cheaper end of things enlarging lens.
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As far as I can tell the Rogonar-S was quite popular. How popular the Rogonar was, I don't know. What I also don't know is what the variations in barrel housing have been throughout the product life cycle of the Rogonar; the only thing I do know is that there have been variations.

So yes, it seems entirely plausible that a (non-S) Rogonar exists that Durst didn't specifically take into account when designing the M605. In fact, it's demonstrably the case, given the pictorial evidence presented in this thread.

It is of course still possible that the Rogonar OP has was some kind of special-edition manufactured for a specific purpose that required a longer barrel - so that this particular lens is a bit of an oddity. IDK.

I do note that despite the popularity of this lens that you seem to suppose, so far nobody has come along on the largest analog photo forum on the net who is using it.
 
koraks said:
As far as I can tell the Rogonar-S was quite popular. How popular the Rogonar was, I don't know. What I also don't know is what the variations in barrel housing have been throughout the product life cycle of the Rogonar; the only thing I do know is that there have been variations.

So yes, it seems entirely plausible that a (non-S) Rogonar exists that Durst didn't specifically take into account when designing the M605. In fact, it's demonstrably the case, given the pictorial evidence presented in this thread.

It is of course still possible that the Rogonar OP has was some kind of special-edition manufactured for a specific purpose that required a longer barrel - so that this particular lens is a bit of an oddity. IDK.

I do note that despite the popularity of this lens that you seem to suppose, so far nobody has come along on the largest analog photo forum on the net who is using it.
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In that case it's simple, put another lens on it and things are back to normal. No matter how we slice it, Rogonar is a cheap lens (unless this is indeed about a "special" one, maybe even "rare", and a collector's gem?), otherwise plethora of choices come well under $50, many under $25.

Of course this may be an exercise in problem solving, similar to trying a square shape as a wheel.

I can understand OP's frustration with seemingly normal set up not working out. If other lenses focus without a problem, and one does not ... try another of same focal length nobody seems to have ever had a problem with.
 
Hassasin said:
OP's frustration with seemingly normal set up not working out.
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No frustration really, but it came as a surprise. I thought the mount was universal. I also thought it actually has the original Leica's flange distance of 28.8mm, which is apparently not true.

Also, I needed to be sure which part is givng me troubes: enlarger, or lens. I am convinced it's lens.
 
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koraks said:
It is of course still possible that the Rogonar OP has was some kind of special-edition manufactured for a specific purpose that required a longer barrel - so that this particular lens is a bit of an oddity. IDK.

I do note that despite the popularity of this lens that you seem to suppose, so far nobody has come along on the largest analog photo forum on the net who is using it.
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The M605 is essentially derived from the M601 which dates back to the early 1970s long before Schneider and Rodenstock updated their lenses to composite barrels.

Out of interest I tried a Schneider 50mm Componar, also a triplet on my M605 that will focus at full head height, then I remembered I might have a Rodenstock Trinar, I checked and I do, it's in a composite barrel, and like the Ronar it won't focus much larger than approx a 10x8 print. The Rogonar is identical to the Trinar, it was probably renamed when Linos took over Rodenstock.

As both @koraks and I said earlier it appears Rodenstock deliberately limited the Rogonar by design, It is a budget lens, look at what Rodenstock say about the lens: The Rogonar forms a solid base for the “first steps” in the amateur’s home lab. This lens is already a standard feature of many low-price enlarging units.

Ian
 
Ian Grant said:
The Rogonar is identical to the Trinar, it was probably renamed when Linos took over Rodenstock.
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I think it predates Linos, but there's some subtlety to it.
I have the fairly detailed June 1987 enlarger lens brochure.
It appears that they were calling the 50mm f/2.8 the 'Rogonar' and the 50mm f/3.5 and 75mm f/4.5 'Trinar's.
 
Thread title updated.
Question for the OP: Have you tried your enlarger with any longer lenses and larger film?
 
The OP's image of the bellows compressed matches my own M605, I have 3 recessed lens boards, all similar in depth. No issues with any 50mm lenses, El Rokkor, Durst Neonon., Componon, Componon S. Comparon, Componar, El Nikkor, except the Rodenstock Trinar which came in a job lot, and I'd never even tried until today.

It is VERY CLEARLY not a Durst enlarger issue, rather a decision by Rodenstock to limit the Trinar/Rogonar 50mm f3.5 lens.

I would add that I had a 645 negative in my M605 enlarger and it was clear that wide open that the Triplet lens performance was rapidly deteriorating towards the edges & corners as expected.

It's a bit like using a Meyer Domiplan lens on a Pentax, Spotmatc you can't expect high quality results. Durst enlargers in the M600 series are high end enlargers, so why bother wasting paper with a low end budget lens.

Ian
 
BeselerOrNot said:
No, and I don't have a lens, lensboard and even a camera.
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This drives home how lucky those of us are who have nearby friends who can bring over alternatives to try on our new-to-us photographic equipment to see if it is working as expected.
Not that some of us don't already have lots of alternatives at hand 😲
 
On my Durst M601 I can use a flat lens board LAPLA 39 to make prints in excess of 16x20 inches. The bellows was fully compressed when I did so, and I could not tilt the lens board for "corrections". El-Nikkor 50mm/2.8, so what I did was buy a SETOPLA 39. The M601 manual actually states the flat board can be used with 60-80mm lenses and that the recessed board is for 50mm lenses. The SIRIOTUB is correct for the M605 but seems to have only half of the recess that the SETOPLA has. BTW, want a hack? I have a set of Closeup filters that fit the front threads of my El-Nikkor, in a pinch a +1 CU lens will give you just a touch more magnification.
 
Yeah.. I tried to get smth local, but the country is small, so is the market. Finding a Meopta enlarger with a color head was only possible on ebay from elsewhere, so grabbing the Durst during my visit to France looked like a better option. The price was OK, but there was no lens. When I asked for one, the seller said he will look for something. So this Rogonar came for free, can't complain much. I just wish he'd tell me about this quirk. I guess he did not know, but obviously he did not check either.
 
BeselerOrNot There is a company called SDS which stands for Secondhand Darkroom Supplies in the U.K. It supplies to Europe and has 5 pages of 50mm lens, some of which are of the type that do not suffer from what appears to be your RodagonRogonar lens problem

I was able to google SDS so I see no reason why you can't if you want to have a look at them Your particular lens is on sale there for £19 and yes this is very cheap in comparison with other lenses but other lenses suitable to overcome your problem are available for between £40 and £60

I hope this helps

pentaxuser
 
I come back to the condenser:

For a 35mm negative and the 50mm lens you need to use the single glass condenser called Siriocon 50

For a medium format negative and the 80mm lens you need to use the double glass condenser called Siriocon 80.

Have you done this correctly?

(I looked quickly at the many posts, but didn't find any mention of the condensers. Sorry if I missed something)
 
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Hilo said:
I come back to the condenser:
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The condenser setup, if present, will affect illumination. It will not affect focus of the enlarging lens. So this can be left out of the equation in any case.
pentaxuser said:
Your particular lens is on sale there for £19 and yes this is very cheap in comparison with other lenses but other lenses suitable to overcome your problem are available for between £40 and £60
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Expect to pay around €100-120 for a GBP60 lens if you want to have it delivered to an EU country. Shipping costs, taxes & duties. Sadly, purchasing from the UK isn't so attractive anymore for us.
 
Whilst trying to find an answer to the problem in hand I found this site selling Durst lens boards.

It's a handy source to bookmark.

Lensboards for Durst enlargers

Lensboards with 78mm diameter for most Durst enlargers. Available with all common thread sizes up to 72mm x 1. Lensboards can be made with other lens thread sizes.
customphototools.com customphototools.com


I have never used them, so cannot comment on the quality etc.
Also no connection.
 
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