Do you crop your photos?

[Bill Burk]

https://www.photrio.com/forum/media...075/full?lightbox=1&last_edit_date=1621309308

Oh I cropped this.

 

[Mike Lopez]

It’s not unfair to say HCB was against cropping.

Lest anyone point to post #197 and say “Aha! He doesn’t talk about cropping! Gotcha!” here is another snip from that introduction (with added emphasis):

If you start cutting or cropping a good photograph, it means death to the geometrically correct interplay of proportions. Besides, it very rarely happens that a photograph which was feebly composed can be saved by reconstruction of its composition under the darkroom’s enlarger; the integrity of vision is no longer there. There is a lot of talk about camera angles; but the only valid angles in existence are the angles of the geometry of composition and not the ones fabricated by the photographer who falls flat on his stomach or performs other antics to procure his effects.

 

[Bill Burk]

I dug into a photojournalism book “Photographic Communication” from 1972. The index entry for Henri Cartier-Bresson lists 28 pages. Everyone who mentioned him in this book admired him, was inspired by him, remembered the first time they published a book by him etc.

Ernst Haas sat on a panel in 1970 and was asked “Do you have a philosophy about discipline?” I think his answer speaks to the heart of the matter.


HAAS: Yes, I think that there’s no liberty without a discipline. Because liberty gives you too many possibilities. In order to come to a discipline you have to wall in your liberty. It means you only come to a subtlety within the same not within the different. Beethoven works with differences, and is very dramatic; Bach works with sameness. These thoughts are in a little 30-page booklet which I wish everybody would read. It is by Stravinsky it is called “The Poetry of Music.” It is fundamental and fits any art form. He says in music we have liberty — all of these sounds, all of these possibilities — and yet we have to narrow ourselves, not take all the liberties. It is this narrowing of the self that I call discipline. Many photographers discipline themselves and have a very intellectual explanation for it. Edward Weston did not make enlargements. What a pity, because it would be beautiful to see his images very huge. But that was his discipline. Cartier Bresson said despite the wide angle lens I will only shoot with the 50mm. He let himself see it only one way. After one has worn out a discipline, he should put himself into another one. But you always arrive at any liberty by putting yourself into a new client of discipline.

 

[Ivo Stunga]

This thread is... Soo many generalolzations - should I think that you guys place your subjects of interest along the edges and leave no room for your subjects to breathe in? Who cares what person X did years ago, how he composed his images - are we bunch of retarded monkeys simply to follow and regurgitate or Human Beings born to inspire and fly with our minds eye without end in sight? Relax your sphincters, guys, it's getting ridiculous.

Flashack to reality: you are cropping constantly with your limited field of vision and take this to extreme the moment you pick up a camera and a lens. I crop the reality constantly - with where I am on the Planet in space and time and more importantly - headspace. Additional crop is introduced by my limited field of vision, my experiences, knowledge and my previous training. Then some is introduced by viewfinder coverage percentage. Then additional when mounting the slide or printing an image both optically and digitally. Tell me more how you don't crop : D

Hell, even the film, chems and processes you use can be considered a crop of reality, no? Regardless of what you do with your pictures later, because these have a very direct influcence on how the image will be made and perceived.


I'll dare a guess - what's happening along the edges is the least of our problems photographically.

 

[radiant]

Non-cropping / Cropping is a religion. All other views must be eliminated because they threat my beliefs.

I do both, I modify my gear to make it possible to print without cropping and next day I'm doing 6x crops from 35mm negative. I find both very inspiring, equally. There is something beautiful in both methods.

 

[snusmumriken]

I sometimes "crop" my negatives all the way into the trash bin .

100% crop? Excellent! I do the same with 99% of my photos.

Incidentally, wasn't HCB's POV (and reason for starting his own photo agency, with its own T&C) that the photo was his artistic vision and not to be hacked about by picture editors? I don't know at what stage the idea of printing the film rebates came in, but I understand it was necessary for some shots with early model Leicas where the film could wander across the gate so that the image strayed across the perforations on one side. So it wasn't purely to emphasise artistic control. Anyway, there's a limit to how accurately anyone can frame with a rangefinder camera.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I hate to say this, but even in they're heyday, slide shows were terrible, unless part of a good presentation. Today, I wouldn't sit through one if you paid me and tied me to the chair. The only reason for a slide was as an original for reproduction.
P.S. I spent a few years of my career running a 12-projector slide show sales presentation, with nearly 1,000 slides and an automated synchronized sound track.

No wonder you hate slideshows. But I understand your point. We used to promise guests a nice dessert if they stayed around to watch the slideshow.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I love slide shows, the ones I put on were always worth sitting through. Synchronized to music, pictures included experiences shared with friends in audience. I shot Kodachrome and Velvia (with a little Panatomic-X when I felt broke) 1978 through 1989. Must be where I got the impulse for not cropping. Only cropped a few slides with foil tape back in the day. Otherwise you just pick a better slide if there are problems with one. Shooting slides involved exploring a scene from a variety of perspectives. A couple wide angle shots followed by some macro studies.

Eventually I decided to switch to black and white for everything but the desire to not crop remained.

I used to do that as well except without the music. Today, I'll make slideshows with video clips and background music, narration, credits Etc using digital video software and play it on my TV. It's much more convenient and it's easy to set up. Just press a button and it gets rolling before your visitors fake a headache and say they have to leave.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Cropping maybe more necessary in Street shots since the street is so confusing chaotic and you have to operate within a second or two otherwise you missed the shot.

Landscape shooting on a tripod where you have time to walk around and set up the picture to perfection, cropping is less required except maybe along the edges.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

HCB's cropping around a little dog and the woman's feet doesn't prove that cropping is the answer. It proves that you have to catch it in the camera. All cropping does is remove some unnecessary real estate. The angle and the interesting subject is what counts. The original shot determines that.

He proves it by the fact that the rest of the pictures on his contact sheet are worthless. You can crop them all day long and still not get a great picture. It has to be caught in the camera.

 

[snusmumriken]

HCB's cropping around a little dog and the woman's feet doesn't prove that cropping is the answer. It proves that you have to catch it in the camera. All cropping does is remove some unnecessary real estate. The angle and the interesting subject is what counts. The original shot determines that.

He proves it by the fact that the rest of the pictures on his contact sheet are worthless. You can crop them all day long and still not get a great picture. It has to be caught in the camera.

Exactly, but you mean Elliott Erwitt, not HCB.

The creative brilliance was to put the camera on the little dog's level. Perhaps the first time anyone thought of doing that. He happened to be using a 6x6 that day, and it probably wasn't possible to frame the shot exactly. He then went on to make scores of brilliant shots of dogs through his lifetime. The frames he wasted are irrelevant. Sometimes you have to keep shooting to prove to yourself what doesn't work.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Yes Erwitt. Thanks for correcting me.

 

[Vaughn]

I...
Ernst Haas sat on a panel in 1970 and was asked “Do you have a philosophy about discipline?” I think his answer speaks to the heart of the matter....

Good quote. It is why I just have to shake my head when people worry about what I am 'missing' by not cropping.

In a world of infinite possibilities, it is impossible to reduce the possibilities. Why should I take the time to fuss and crop an image that I don't want when I could be spending that time making images I love?

 

[Dwayne Martin]

Most of my images are 4x5 and I crop them often but I have to admit it's often difficult to give up part of the image.

 

[Sirius Glass]

No wonder you hate slideshows. But I understand your point. We used to promise guests a nice dessert if they stayed around to watch the slideshow.

I plied them with food and drinks. And my shining personality.

 

[Mike Lopez]

This thread is... Soo many generalolzations - should I think that you guys place your subjects of interest along the edges and leave no room for your subjects to breathe in? Who cares what person X did years ago, how he composed his images - are we bunch of retarded monkeys simply to follow and regurgitate or Human Beings born to inspire and fly with our minds eye without end in sight? Relax your sphincters, guys, it's getting ridiculous.

Flashack to reality: you are cropping constantly with your limited field of vision and take this to extreme the moment you pick up a camera and a lens. I crop the reality constantly - with where I am on the Planet in space and time and more importantly - headspace. Additional crop is introduced by my limited field of vision, my experiences, knowledge and my previous training. Then some is introduced by viewfinder coverage percentage. Then additional when mounting the slide or printing an image both optically and digitally. Tell me more how you don't crop : D

Hell, even the film, chems and processes you use can be considered a crop of reality, no? Regardless of what you do with your pictures later, because these have a very direct influcence on how the image will be made and perceived.


I'll dare a guess - what's happening along the edges is the least of our problems photographically.

I stopped reading at the word “retarded.”

Bye.

 

[Mike Lopez]

In a world of infinite possibilities, it is impossible to reduce the possibilities. Why should I take the time to fuss and crop an image that I don't want when I could be spending that time making images I love?

Yep. There’s a whole hell of a lot out there to do and to photograph. I don’t think I’m missing anything by not going back to hack away at pictures I’ve already intentionally made. (Key word: “intentionally.”)

 

[Sirius Glass]

I stopped reading at the word “retarded.”

Bye.

 

[Auer]

If I feel like cropping an image I crop it.

There are no rules.

 

[MattKing]

I stopped reading at the word “retarded.”

Bye.

Same here.

 

[Auer]

Good quote. It is why I just have to shake my head when people worry about what I am 'missing' by not cropping.

In a world of infinite possibilities, it is impossible to reduce the possibilities. Why should I take the time to fuss and crop an image that I don't want when I could be spending that time making images I love?

You do you man. Everyone arrives at their destination in their own time and own way.

 

[Bill Burk]

Good quote. It is why I just have to shake my head when people worry about what I am 'missing' by not cropping.

In a world of infinite possibilities, it is impossible to reduce the possibilities. Why should I take the time to fuss and crop an image that I don't want when I could be spending that time making images I love?

And I don't know anyone more disciplined than you.

 

[Bill Burk]

@Ivo Stunga



Recommend cropping that English word from your message, it has highly charged connotations. Plenty other ways to accuse a person of deliberately not applying thought without using an archaic word that denigrates those who can’t help it. A quick edit or rephrase may help, otherwise you’ll lose some friends, and I was interested in hearing what you wanted to say.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I plied them with food and drinks. And my shining personality. View attachment 295785

Did they actually stay? Be honest.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Yep. There’s a whole hell of a lot out there to do and to photograph. I don’t think I’m missing anything by not going back to hack away at pictures I’ve already intentionally made. (Key word: “intentionally.”)

Sort of like visiting your ex-wife to have a chat.