The figures in parentheses are mL/meter of 35mm film. Most of the big processing companies, trim and splice many, many rolls of film end to end. This is put on a large reel, like movie film for protection and run through continuously, thus the meter figures. Dig around a bit into some other Kodak literature, somewhere they list by 80 sq. Inches which is equal to 36exp, 120, or 8x10 sheet.
You can ignore the column on the right. Advantix was an APS film. The number in front/outside of the parenthesis is the volume (in mL) per 24 exposure roll of 35mm film. The number inside the parenthesis is the volume (in mL) per meter of film.
Since you are likely to develop 36 exposure rolls multiply the first number by 1.5. So 30mL of developer replenisher LORR per 135/36 roll of film. But this table 4-2 is for a particular minilab process.
Instead, I'd rather look at table 2-4 in document z131. This will more likely apply to you. It gives you replenishment volumes per roll of film for various types of film. Personally I use (used, I have to restart my colour development after nearly two years break) this table:
There is a group that contains Portra 160 and Gold 200 in the heading. I use that for slower films (ISO 100 & 200). 26.1mL per roll of 135/36. 36.8mL for a roll of 120 film.
The group below (last) I use for 400 and faster films. 33.1mL per roll of 135/36. 37.8 mL per roll of 120 film.
All volumes for LORR type developer. I have the normal Flexicolor developer (non LORR) for example. Table 2-4 has the number for this one as well.
Bleach will last forever, I think I used something like 8mL of Bleach replenisher per 36. Fixer is cheap but oxidation is an issue.If this is correct I'm confused. Because I heard fixer and final rinse last a LONG time and can be used plenty of times over and over. Is this not true?
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I can read the dam nthing now. sorry it took me a while. Okay soooo the numbers you added here:
"There is a group that contains Portra 160 and Gold 200 in the heading. I use that for slower films (ISO 100 & 200). 26.1mL per roll of 135/36. 36.8mL for a roll of 120 film.
The group below (last) I use for 400 and faster films. 33.1mL per roll of 135/36. 37.8 mL per roll of 120 film."
that is all info from rack and tank replenishment or from mini lab? or does it even matter?
So I made this chart, changed the second column to 36mm
Is this correct? I know I'm bombarding you. Sorry
View attachment 262258
If this is correct I'm confused. Because I heard fixer and final rinse last a LONG time and can be used plenty of times over and over. Is this not true?
This site is amazing, everything is archived
https://125px.com/
You may find that single use for the developer and fixer is easier. I buy Fuji universal fixer in 5 gallon cubes, super cheap. Bleach is eternal, will last forever
To run a properly replenished system some will say you need control strips, densitometer, pH meter etc.
Look at Unique photo. They're the go to for chemistry. I use developer and fixer one shot in the Jobo machines. Kodak says to use everything one shot in Jobo machines but I replenish the bleach.
So to be clear you're using Flexicolor RA bleach and replenishing 8ml per roll of 135-36 right? You're also using a Jobo processor which fills the tank up completely with chemical, 1/4th of the way like the filmomat correct?Bleach will last forever, I think I used something like 8mL of Bleach replenisher per 36. Fixer is cheap but oxidation is an issue.
Yes, it is. It is the one I think is most appropriate for me using a manual tank.
But I've looked at the machine you are using. You mentioned it in another of your threads. Since it is not a continuous roller transport system like a minilab I assume that this table will still be the best match for your machine. Your chemicals get pumped in and pumped out. It is similar to pouring in and out or diping the film into an agitated deep tank. But that is only my opinion. I'm not exactly and experienced old hand. I simply studied all information I could find and made my decisions.
In any case, the table you mentioned in your first post looks like it has pretty low replenishment rates. My thinking is that this process works in a minilab, which has been designed and optimised by the manufacturer and will run a large amount of film all day long.
Your machine will have a lot more loss of chemicals (small amounts which will remain in the tank). And a lot more aeration (means oxidation) in the process of pumping and rotating. Hence I would choose the table for Rack-and-Tank processors, which I mentioned. There is no table for inversion- or rotation tanks because Kodak does not recommend to use replenishment for them.
EDIT: I made a mistake, it's been a while since I looked into Z131. There is section 3 for Sink-Line processing. That is the one I used when I last did C41 and (blind) replenishment. So it is table 3-2 that I recommend you use.
Section three also states that you shouldn't replenish when using a rotary processor. Probably because the chemicals get aerated so much. That is why I don't think your table 4-2 is a good a good one to use. It is up to you to try out and see. But as mschem says, Flexicolor bought from Unique Photo might still be cheap enough for single use. I.e. mix replenisher with starter to make enough tank solution for one use and then dump it.
Also I don't understand what this machine is and hat it does. It prevents oxidaiton by replacing oxygen in the tank with nitrogen? If so would this work with the machine I'm using?
This is the cutting edge of 1960's technologyAlso I don't understand what this machine is and hat it does. It prevents oxidaiton by replacing oxygen in the tank with nitrogen? If so would this work with the machine I'm using?
This is the cutting edge of 1960's technology. This is a timer that actuates a solenoid valve. The valve is connected to a nitrogen tank with a two stage regulator when the valve is energized it let's a burst of gas, from the regulator, through the valve, into a hose that's connected to a gas distribution manifold, at the bottom of a 3 1/2 gallon stainless steel rack. So for color you have several 3 1/2 gallon tanks, fitted into a water jacket that is temperature regulated. For reel film you would lower a rack that would hold 30 reels into the developer tank, every 10 seconds (or whatever interval you set) there would be a vigorous burst of gas that was the agitation. These tanks would take 8x10, 5x7, 4x5 film hangers or print baskets for color paper. As you moved the rack from solution to solution, you would turn a valve that would substitute compressed air for nitrogen, to save money. The bleach air required the air to be damp, to prevent crystals from clogging the gas orifices. All this in open tanks in total darkness, older processes that took forever. Fun!
I'm just setting up a smaller one for fun. 2 gallon tank 7 8x10 hangers
No this is something that individual commercial photographers used, I don't think anyone uses this anymore. Dip and dunk lines are huge, these are the "Gold Standard" nothing touches the film. Amazing to see.
Way back when amateur photos were all shot on black and white negative film, mostly contact printed, there was a company in Minneapolis, Minnesota called Pa-ko that made huge machines for processing. You can still find artifacts of these huge D&D machines, people saved the weighted film clips that were attached to the bottom of the film strips. These are always popping up on Ebay.
Pako is still in business but they have very little to do with film processing. Name has changed first to Pakon, now Pakor. Great customer service, a couple years ago I was able to get, custom order, canvas belts for a couple of Pako, fiber base print dryers that were made in the 60's.
LMAOOOOI just looked at your processor. If I had one of those. I would sit back and relax with a cup of coffee, to hell with replenisher. Looks like a lot of fun*
So to be clear you're using Flexicolor RA bleach and replenishing 8ml per roll of 135-36 right? You're also using a Jobo processor which fills the tank up completely with chemical, 1/4th of the way like the filmomat correct?
Ok ok so I'll deff use that other table. But as for bleach I read that bleach likes to be oxidized; so much so that it should be be put in half filled containers once opened. If this is true, why would I not be allowed to replenish it? Also I hear fixer is stronger and less susceptible than developer to oxidation. If this is the case, AND also that you mentioned you used to blind replenish back in your day then it's safe to say that I can replenish right (from table 3-2)?
Are you basically saying I should just follow that chart to the T? Not to mention I do plan on buying a densitometer soon and also I won't buy test strips but I'm gonna make my own.. but is that a good idea? Because I would do that then just compare each additional test strip to the first one made... or do I really need to buy the official test strips?
I also do want to add that I'm processing film for other people, so I do expect to have many rolls to process in a given week and I do have 1L, .5L and, .25L storage bottles to fit all chemicals.
I just want to spell out everyhting that I have and have everything you guys advise to be spelled out to me too
I'm using:
Filmomat machine (500ml at a time; 1-4 rolls of 135-36, 1-4 rolls of 120, 1-6sheets of 4x5; tank 1/4th full of chemical, constant agitation) so I'll use table 3-2
I'm using Flexicolor LORR dev starter, Flexicolor LU developer and replenisher(a,b,c), Flexicolor RA Bleach replenisher NR, Flexicolor RA fixer and replenisher
I have pleanty of 1L, .5L and, .25L glass bottles to store chemicals in.
What would be my best move to make these chemicals last the longest and also to get a as much as I could from them?
To follow the chart yes, but since bleach oxidize and likes it shouldn't I be able to sue it a few times?
Also should I mix all chemcails and make working solutons or should I jsut make what i need of each chemical?
Sorry for all the questions, but if you have the time please helppppppp
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