Concentrated long lasting paper developer formula

ruilourosa

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Hello
Does anyone know any formula of this type?
With the qualities around dektol or ilford multigrade...

Thanks!!!
 
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ruilourosa

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I would much prefer a known formula as i have acess to raw chemistry and cost os also an issue...
 
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ruilourosa

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in id-62 type developer could i substitute potassium carbonate (more soluble but more expensive) for some some sodium carbonate plus hidroxide?
This without altering stock and tray longevity and activity?
 

KPA40

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I would try the standard sodium carbonate version first to see if the developer suits you. I have always used it up within four months (stored in high-filled ½ litre bottles). If all works well, you can always use the more concentrated form next time.
If you do want to buy a ready-made developer, I would recommend ADOX Adotol-Konstant, which is known for its durability.
Moreover, it is very cheap

https://www.fotoimpex.com/chemistry/adox-adotol-konstant-paper-developer-to-mix-5000-ml.html

Olaf
 
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ruilourosa

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Id 62 is very long lasting as is d-72 but i would really like to have a long lasting concentrated Dev... 1+9 would bem great!
 

Raghu Kuvempunagar

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ruilourosa said:
in id-62 type developer could i substitute potassium carbonate (more soluble but more expensive) for some some sodium carbonate plus hidroxide?
This without altering stock and tray longevity and activity?
Click to expand...

You can turn ID-62 into a two part formula easily where the first part is glycol based and the second part is mixed as per need. No need for any Potassium salts. First part contains only Phenidone and Hydroquinone and is long lasting.
 

markbau

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I find Ansco 130 to be very long lasting, I often use it over two print sessions. It is every bit as good as D 72/Dektol. A word of warning though, Glycin seems to go off quicker than most chemicals, I keep it in the fridge. Unless buying it from the Formulary you never know how long it has sat around.
 
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ruilourosa

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Raghu Kuvempunagar said:
You can turn ID-62 into a two part formula easily where the first part is glycol based and the second part is mixed as per need. No need for any Potassium salts. First part contains only Phenidone and Hydroquinone and is long lasting.
Click to expand...

Not very convenient... Its for school use and i want to mimic the convenience of 1+9 and economy...
 
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ruilourosa

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There is... Id 62 could go into solution more concentrated to be diluted 1+9 but using potassium carbonate and hidroxide because sodium carbonate is not so soluble... Im trying to use sodium carbonate not potassium...
 

john_s

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ID-78 can be made 3x standard strength using potassium carbonate instead of sodium carbonate without any other changes such as Ian Grant's use of sodium hydroxide to replace some carbonate. So normal working solution is now 1+5. I use Dimezone-S which might make dissolution easier.

It's supposed to be a warm tone developer but the effect is extremely subtle.

Ian Grant has a mod that would give you 1+9. See http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/formulae/formulae.htm
 

john_s

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You could use sodium carbonate and still do some modification using hydroxide as in Ian Grant's formula. You might get to 1+6 (guess) or better.
 

Alan Johnson

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ruilourosa said:
There is... Id 62 could go into solution more concentrated to be diluted 1+9 but using potassium carbonate and hidroxide because sodium carbonate is not so soluble... Im trying to use sodium carbonate not potassium...
Click to expand...
https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/source/hsdb/5018#section=Solubility-(Complete

If you don't mind a few crystals when it cools down, note that the part B of Pyrocat HD can be 200g/L sodium carbonate:
https://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/PCat/PCat2/pcat2.html
 
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ruilourosa

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200g/liter of sodium carbonate could be put into solution in id 62 or another developer?
What about a fully soluble amount of sodium carbonate plus some amount of hidroxide?
 

RalphLambrecht

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Nikola Dulgiarov

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As others have commented, the Ilford series of published formulas are probably as good as you can get, and have been time-tested by users across the board. ID-78 is an excellent neutral tone developer. In patents, I've come across various modifications, but they start involving compounds like diethylene glycol, etc.
If you want a 1+9 concentrate, it's hard to avoid using potassium salts. I don't think I've ever seen a concentrate for 10x and higher dilutions that uses sodium salts. Many even specify potassium sulfite, whereas Ian Grant's adaptation achieves it using Na2SO3.
Potassium carbonate is not that much more expensive. Considering that a kilogram of it is enough for maybe 50-60 L of working dilution developer, I don't think you should try to avoid it.

Edit: I looked up the formula for ID-78. Increasing the concentration of ingredients 2.5x will give you the 1+9 concentrate. This means you need 155g/L Na2CO3. Perhaps this will actually dissolve OK, but I have never tried this. Ian's formula calls for about 100g/L K2CO3. So a kilo will make 10L of 1+9 concentrate.
 
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