Brbo, do you know off hand which films are on the polyester base? I just shot a bunch of Lomo Fantome which is Orwo Dp31/21 (I forget which) and no issues apart from it curls like a pretzel when it dries.
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DP31 seems to be on polyester, but thicker (0.125mm) than usual for 135 PET film.
Kodak has started using polyester for ColorPlus 200, Portra 800 and CN 800 that they make for Lomo. A lot of Rollei, Adox 135 film are on PET, too. Probably a lot of repurposed films that are now sold to lomo crowds as well...
Kodak has started using polyester for ColorPlus 200, Portra 800 and CN 800 that they make for Lomo. A lot of Rollei, Adox 135 film are on PET, too. Probably a lot of repurposed films that are now sold to lomo crowds as well...
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MattKing
Moderator
There is a worldwide shortage of the acetate, which is mainly manufactured in Europe, and depends on the petrochemical supplies there.
Eastman Kodak, for one, has to buy the acetate elsewhere, but manufactures its own polyester (Estar) base material. For that reason alone, polyester is a preferred option for them.
But switching the substrate material is not a trivial matter, so it is unlikely that you will see that happen quickly.
Eastman Kodak, for one, has to buy the acetate elsewhere, but manufactures its own polyester (Estar) base material. For that reason alone, polyester is a preferred option for them.
But switching the substrate material is not a trivial matter, so it is unlikely that you will see that happen quickly.
Yeah, none of the color film I have been using has had thin bases.
wait until you try gold 200 in 120
Don't have any... cuz have lots of other color 120 in my freezer! Anyway, got my R9 loaded with the cat, so I'll see if this roll has issues loading onto my Arista reel.
although tri- Acetate has less petroleum content than Polyester. in fact vinegar (acetic acid) can be fermented from sugar, and cellulose actually DOES grow on trees. Still it does appear that MOST of the world's film base comes from ONE factory in the former East Germany. When Kodak shut down their TAC line they said they had enough to last years, but that is by now a few years ago. Who knows if Fuji still has any capacity to make TAC. (I doubt it)
further complication is that TAC is also used as Packaging material, (I belive that it is considered "Compostable" and I am not sure if that is one of the film materials used to make flat screen displays. I belive it is ESTAR that they want to use to make Li batteries.
Ok, so my third roll, on a completely clean and dry Arista reel that I have no issue loading other films on, again bolloxed up. It took me four attempts before I got almost all of it on.
Unfortunately because of this I will not be buying this film again. 2 rolls left...
Other films loaded with zero issues:
Trix, Pan X, Plus X, 3200, Iford Ortho 80, 50, 125, 400, 3200, Lomo Berlin, Fantome, Babylon, Kino, Arista 100, 200, 400, Kentmere 100, 400, Adox CMS, Siberra Orta...
Unfortunately because of this I will not be buying this film again. 2 rolls left...
Other films loaded with zero issues:
Trix, Pan X, Plus X, 3200, Iford Ortho 80, 50, 125, 400, 3200, Lomo Berlin, Fantome, Babylon, Kino, Arista 100, 200, 400, Kentmere 100, 400, Adox CMS, Siberra Orta...
That was a short honeymoon.
Perhaps the others who loaded the film successfully could share what reels they use.
Perhaps the others who loaded the film successfully could share what reels they use.
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I've loaded two short rolls of 135 and one 120 without issues on Paterson reels. The film is noticably thinner than the ilford film I usually use. The 135 has light piping on the first two frames, but my Pentax zx5n winds past them when loading. The 120 backing paper is identical to ilford's.
Considering that the experts here have been writing for years that there is only one remaining maker of 120 backing paper, is that surprising?
Agfa at their Leverkusen site and Orwo in Wolfen got own Acetate base plants. Both plants were sold, the Agfa one vanished meanwhile.
I mentioned the light piping too. Most probably because the film is so thin.
p.s what do you mean by short rolls? I have issues w the regular 36exp Catlabs rolls.
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I've been a member of this forum for less than a year, so I didn't know that. I was just reporting something I found interesting. Some people had asked if the Catlab 120 paper would have standard numbers. Thanks for pointing out my lack of knowledge in a less than friendly way.
I think the light piping may be related to the clear base as well, I am waiting for some Santacolor film which doesn't have a mask and they report light piping as an issue in their instructions.
I divided my first roll into three in a dark bag for testing, so the strip was pretty short when loading the reel.
By the way, I think your photos with the Catlabs pro are great, probably worth trying to figure out the reel loading.
BrianShaw may have been speaking sarcastically about experts and one maker of 120 backing paper. Perhaps he can clarify.
What does the film itself have to do with light piping? Isn't it a result of defective film cassette felt or a light leak in your camera?
My understanding of the term light piping is that light is able to travel through the film lengthwise, somewhat like fiber optics, so the felt does not stop it. In my case, this occurred in a band across the first frame and along the sprocket holes for the second frame.
Thanks for the clarification. I have never experienced it.
Hi Dwight. I apologize for my terse comment and coming off as rude. That was not my intent. In fact, I was one who asked about the backing paper and the question was partially answered by CatLabs. Your observation was valuable additional information. Thanks, and again… it was not my intention to annoy or embarrass you.
I appreciate your response, and I must admit I have started reading this forum with a grumpy old man voice in my head, so I misinterpreted your comment. And I can be a grumpy old man myself in the morning.
MattKing
Moderator
It's interesting, I took BrianShaw's response to Dwight's comment as being more directed to the thread in general, not Dwight in particular.
Wearing my moderator hat for a brief moment here - a suggestion to everyone to pause before you assume the worst about a post. Without the benefit of intonation or the sort of visual or auditory clues that a face to face conversation add, there is often multiple ways to read something.
EDIT: Kudos to Brian and Dwight for straightening out the misunderstanding between yourselves.
Now back to our regularly scheduled thread.
Wearing my moderator hat for a brief moment here - a suggestion to everyone to pause before you assume the worst about a post. Without the benefit of intonation or the sort of visual or auditory clues that a face to face conversation add, there is often multiple ways to read something.
EDIT: Kudos to Brian and Dwight for straightening out the misunderstanding between yourselves.
Now back to our regularly scheduled thread
.
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MattKing
Moderator
And on the subject of the thread itself, in addition to their being no apparent choice with regard to sources for backing paper, there is little choice with respect to finishing/confectioning resources.
Are Shanghai and Kodak using the same backing paper?
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