B&W Supply Reliability and New Providers

[Richard Jepsen]

A few months ago I had to purchase Dektol as LPD paper developer in powder was unavailable. Dektol provided good results. A month ago I sourced the now expensive LPD. When mixing the contents the powder was caked and the working solution color darker than normal. Not sure I will use it even if it did produce a nice print with extended development.

After the XTOL package failures several years ago I moved to ID-11 which has been unavailable for months. I backfilled with XT-3 and I’m satisfied except a change in film developers means fine tuning again.

The LPD situation irritating because it was expensive and reminds me of buying a bad bag of Dektol procured as I needed developer fast. I moved to Ilford chemistry for film after the Sino Promise packaging issues.

The new reality is supply shortages and quality issues.

I’m seeing more products availability from Flic Film out of Alberta, CA. They sell a neutral paper developer named Quintol for a low price. What are the comments on Flic Film and Quintol in particular. No MDS data was available on the sites I visited.

 

[cmacd123]

Quintol

https://flicfilm.ca/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Quintol-MSDS-Rev1-28Jul2021.pdf

Phenatol-Green

https://flicfilm.ca/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Phenatol-Green-Neutral-Tone-Paper-Developer-MSDS-Rev1-06Nov2021.pdf

Dave has all his Black and white chemicals on this page on the Flic Film site:

Black & White Colour Chemistry | Flic Film

flicfilm.ca

(hint: he also runs "film Experience Camera store" for the Canadian Market. (which is generaly where I buy any Flic Products I use) Sometimes their is more info on flic products there. https://filmexperiencecamerastore.com/ )

Dave seems to have his mission to fill what he percevies as Gaps in the market, and he also seems to enjoy when he causes market disruption...

 

[mshchem]

I wouldn't get to worried. Adox, Kodak (PSI), Ilford etc, they'll be around.

 

[koraks]

Quintol
https://flicfilm.ca/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Quintol-MSDS-Rev1-28Jul2021.pdf
Phenatol-Green
https://flicfilm.ca/wp-content/uplo...-Tone-Paper-Developer-MSDS-Rev1-06Nov2021.pdf

The first is a usual MQ developer, the other an equally common (nowadays) PC developer.

There's very little a company could do to mess up with a B&W paper developer. I'd feel entirely comfortable trying those out.

 

[Agulliver]

Over on Facebook, Ilford have said that their photo chemicals will be reappearing "very soon".

 

[brian steinberger]

I will stand by and wait for ID-11.

The LPD thing upsets me too. Such a great developer. Mine mixes up darker than it used to but seems to work just fine. But it has gotten really expensive and not sure it’s worth it. I’ve been planning to mix my own ID-62 to see how it compares to LPD but haven’t gotten around to it yet. If I do and like it I may never worry about a packaged paper developer again.

 

[Richard Jepsen]

Phenatol Green appears to be ascorbic based.

I agree Ilford will be the last major photo firm standing. However, since 2020 there have been Ilford product shortages at the major mail order retailers from either coast.

Because of supply disruptions I bought substitute paper developer which underperformed in several cases. I wonder if the shelf life of Quintol is better than Arista Premium?

LPD is a great paper developer. However, LPD pricing is now 2x Dektol causing me to rethink what developer to use.

Ilford’s Bromophen is a quality substitute for LPD. It mixes up to 5L. I would prefer not storing that quantity for several reasons to include shelf life during a summer reduction of DR time. Can Bromophen be stored in 1L hard plastic containers and perform as fresh six months later?

If I was going to print for the next 5 years I would mix my own paper developer at these prices and supply reliability.

 

[retina_restoration]

After buying bad packages of not only Xtol, but also Dektol and D-76 a few years back, I quit buying pre-made developers and switched to DIY for everything. There's no reason you can't make D-76 from scratch for half the price, and you'll get consistent, reliable results every time.

ArtCraft Chemicals

 

[ic-racer]

After buying bad packages of not only Xtol, but also Dektol and D-76 a few years back, I quit buying pre-made developers and switched to DIY for everything. There's no reason you can't make D-76 from scratch for half the price, and you'll get consistent, reliable results every time.

ArtCraft Chemicals

The individual components of Dektol don't go bad? It only turns brown after the powder is mixed together?
Maybe that is why Ilford Perceptol and Microphen come as two separate packets of powder.

 

[Paul Howell]

As Kodak is now a brand rather than a manufacturer, and ILford outsources it's chemistry, I buy what suits me from whoever has what I want at a price I am willing to pay. ID 11 and D76 are in the same ball park in term of being a middle of the road developer. Freestyle Artista and Legacy pro brands along with Photowearhouse Ultrafine all sell a D76 clones at a decent price. I did buy a bottle of Kodak HC 110, will replace it Legacy Pro version. I wanted a quart size of D76 so I bought a liter size from Photographer's Formulary. I currently use Clayton's print developer which I plan on using. I bought DK 50 and Acufine on ebay for 4X5 in cans, mixed well and no issues with development of Foma 400. In terms of mixing chemistry from scratch, I have done it, but with the price of chemistry including shipping, buying from Freestyle or Ultrafine works for me. It is odd that the Phoenix Metro area is a very large city, but no local source for photochemistry.

 

[Renato Tonelli]

LPD is my favorite paper developer; I ordered quite a bit after it became available again. I think it’s a matter of time before they stop making it altogether - they are pricing it out of reach.

Some packets are darker - some air must have gotten in. Paper developed as usual.
I have been putting a few packets in sealed plastic gallon bags hoping it will keep better XTOL also). I don’t like this type of packaging; it’s also prone to puncturing.

 

[NedL]

My last batch of LPD was very dark ( much darker than cola ) and it is not as active. I'm worried that it won't last as long ( I use it replenished ). I'm probably going to try to make myself some DS-14 and become more self-sufficient.

 

[Tim Stapp]

These reports scare me! I'm on my last packet of LPD powder.

 

[logan2z]

FWIW I've been using liquid LPD and it's nearly clear when mixed to working solution and only gets marginally darker as it ages. Not sure why it would be so different when mixing it from powder.

 

[brian steinberger]

I wish they would go back to packaging LPD in cans. Would probably be even more expensive then…

 

[logan2z]

I wish they would go back to packaging LPD in cans. Would probably be even more expensive then…

https://www.adorama.com/chlpdp5g.html

 

[Melvin J Bramley]

Here in BC Canada I have never had a problem purchasing Ilford ID11.
Suppliers are few but the service and pricing reasonable.
On occasion Ilfords DDX is unavailable but never for too long.
I think it wise to stock up for at least 6 months of darkroom chemicals.
The post recommending bulk chemistry is becoming to make sence.

 

[NedL]

I wish they would go back to packaging LPD in cans. Would probably be even more expensive then…

+1

I can't remember if I got my last LPD from B&H or Adorama, but it had the picture of a can on the website, came in a pouch.....

 

[logan2z]

+1

I can't remember if I got my last LPD from B&H or Adorama, but it had the picture of a can on the website, came in a pouch.....

Ah, the link I posted above shows a can, but perhaps it wouldn't actually arrive that way.

 

[GregY]

I use LPD a lot and still have some cans left. The last order from B&H i bought 2 gallons of the liquid version. I don't find much difference in the results. Yes it's more expensive than any of the developers you mix at 1:9.... but so is the Ansco 130 formula.... & that & LPD are 2 of my favourites.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

FWIW I've been using liquid LPD...

As have I.

I use LPD a lot and still have some cans left. The last order from B&H i bought 2 gallons of the liquid version...

It's good you can use that much, since it appears the one-quart bottles, which better match my occasional printing, seem to have been discontinued.

 

[Richard Jepsen]

https://www.adorama.com/chlpdp5g.html

OMG….I loved the cans…..but I’m not paying through the nose for a 14 year old canned developer.

My recently mixed LPD is a darker than a light beer by several shades and seems to not have normal activity. I’m extending development to get a solid black.

Who has the liquid LPD quarts in stock?

 

[Sal Santamaura]

...Who has the liquid LPD quarts in stock?

I've found no seller that still has any. My most recent quart bottle of it came from B&H last August; it's currently listed as "No Longer Available:"

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/17326-REG/Ethol_ETLPDL32_LPD_Developer_Liquid.html

Thus:

...it appears the one-quart bottles, which better match my occasional printing, seem to have been discontinued.

 

[albada]

You can mix ID-62 yourself. In my experience, it's reasonably long-lasting and makes good prints neutral tones and deep blacks. I like it. You can buy a gram scale (measuring 100ths of grams) for under $20 from amazon, and the chemicals are cheap and available from photoformulary.com and artcraftchemicals.com. Then you can mix any amount you want, any time you want. The dry chemicals last for years. Here's the formula:

Start with 750 ml warm water (125f or 52c).​

sodium sulfite (anh) ............ 50 g​

hydroquinone ..................... 12 g​

phenidone .......................... 0.5 g​

sodium carbonate (anh) ..... 60 g​

potassium bromide ............. 2 g​

benzotriazole ...................... 0.2 g​

Water to .............................. 1 litre​

Dilute 1+3, and develop for 1.5 to 2 minutes. If you also add 4 g of disodium EDTA, then you can use tap water instead of distilled/DI water for both the above concentrate and working solutions.

Mark

 

[Rolleiflexible]

LPD was my paper developer of choice for silver gelatin. Someone whom I trust suggested I try Ansco 130 as a substitute for LPD and also Amidol. The Formulary sells it,

130 Paper Developer

Developer 130 Amidol Paper Developer Photography Chemicals

stores.photoformulary.com

and DIY formulas are online, e.g.,

Ansco 130 print developer: well worth the effort ‹ SilverFixation

silverfixation.com

Has anyone on the thread used Ansco 130? If so, how does it compare with LPD?