B/W film in summer for urban documentary project, and come kit critique please

Donald Qualls

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RezaLoghme said:
So the lab only received 3 of 5 rolls of film, the envelope was torn open.
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This kind of thing is one of the strongest arguments for developing and scanning/printing your own work instead of using a mail-in lab (walk-in labs have their own issues, sometimes) -- especially for black and white.
 

henryvk

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RezaLoghme said:
(I often "brainstorm" with CGPT but am exhausted by all its disclaimers and politically correct answers)
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I'm curious and not at all familiar with AI. Would you give an example of such an answer and the photography-related query that prompted it?
 
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RezaLoghme

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Today I have been shooting a protest of a foreign group of people here in a northern European cIty, using both my 553ELX chrome and Leica X 113. It was the X which raised the curiosity of the protestors, because "it is a professional camera", they were concerned that my pics would end up on social media, where their government could spot them.

The 553ELX was largely ignored, despite its dramatic noise.
 

Alex Benjamin

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RezaLoghme said:
It was the X which raised the curiosity of the protestors, because "it is a professional camera", they were concerned that my pics would end up on social media, where their government could spot them.
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Sorry to rain on your parade—or rather, protest—, but I don't think you were reading them right. First, the very reason you protest in the streets, at least in democratic countries, is to be seen on the media, social or traditional. You protest because you want to be heard, and the only way to be heard today is to be in the media, social or traditional.

Second, if they were indeed concerned your picks would end up on social media, it wouldn't have made a difference to them whether you were shooting with a "professional camera" or an iPhone.
 
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RezaLoghme

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Hello Alex. What I have posted is what the protesters have said to me, more or less verbatim.
 

Dan Daniel

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RezaLoghme said:
Hello Alex. What I have posted is what the protesters have said to me, more or less verbatim.
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Without knowing the countries involved (location of protest and nationality of the protesters), it's presumptuous of a citizen of a western liberal state like Canada or the US to know what risks protesters are taking, the purpose(s) of the protest, etc. The world is not all TikTok and social media. And a 'real' camera often does evoke fears of authority and such in a sea of smart phones. It may seem naive, but I would take the word of the protesters and respect their concerns. Some people have visa restrictions when in foreign countries, some people are from countries that will exact revenge when they return, etc.

Reza, it sounds as if you are doing well with your project development. It can take time and trial runs to get a handle on what we want to do, and even then things can change. I bet your next trip will be very productive.
 
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RezaLoghme

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Thank you, Dan.

Being at that protest has taught me a lot:

- to make sure my equipment is up for it (X 113's battery gave up with no spare on me, the stupid exposure meter changed its ISO value bc of its wheel, I did not have enough 120 rolls, I will buy a ProShade for the 553ELX etc etc),

- that I get even closer to the subject/into the scene,

- that it is all about HBC's decisive moment (which i missed many times, chatting with the participants),

-that it is also about being physically up for the mission (heat from sunlight, proper clothes/shoes/bag, small bottle of water, mints/choc bar),

- and also about building rapport with whom you want to take a photo of (understanding the setting, having a story, maybe a business card which is not suspicious, being friendly, etc),

- and lastly "knowing your rights", in this case not only when dealing with the protestors, but also with the (local) police which whom i had a dialogue.

It was great.
 
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Alex Benjamin

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RezaLoghme said:
Hello Alex. What I have posted is what the protesters have said to me, more or less verbatim.
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I hereby stand corrected, then.

That said, I do wish you'd be less secretive about the places you photograph, unless, of course, you do so for security reasons. It just makes for more informed conversation.
 

Alex Benjamin

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Actually, living in a western liberal state like Canada, we do even more know what kind of risks people who live in illiberal states are taking. Living in a liberal state does not mean one is not conscious of one's privilege.

That said, I stand by what I say. It is precisely because they are taking risks that protesters in illiberal states — states in which the media often is subservient to the state — not only want but need foreign media to broadcast their actions. Foreign media is often the only voice they have, the only way the have to be heard.

That said, in this particular case, not having any information on the why and the where, I was, it seems, presuming wrongly. Hence my plea for OP to be a bit more transparent.
 
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RezaLoghme

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Thank you.

Can we now return back to the original topic, namely the techniques and gear for an urban documentary project?
 
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RezaLoghme

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I am asking the documentary veterans: not about the camera, but the supporting gear such as bags, exposure meter, shoes etc.- pls share your "best practices".
 

Dan Daniel

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All I will say is to be in comfortable clothes. And be in neutral clothes. Don't look like a tourist, don't look an undercover cop, don't be covered with assorted 'photojournalist' tactical gear, black face masks, political slogans on shirts, etc. Think through how participants will see you- protesters AND police/state authorities. Decide what is important to you, who is important to you if you must tilt one way or another.

I have found a 'barn jacket' type of coat with many pockets is my choice in the field of urban environments. I like messenger bag type camera bags, ones that do not scream 'camera bag.' Well, I've converted messenger bags with inserts rather than buy 'camera bags' per se.

Good shoes are the most important item.

Now I assume a 'day to day' environment, not an active protest or other hot zone where identification via clothing may be necessary, or where safety may require heavier shoes, etc.

I realize that some people will want to, say, look like a journalist from 100 feet. And that there are very good reasons in some situations for this.
 

Dan Daniel

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'Camera' bag that looks like a shoulder/messenger type bag example-

Retrospective V2.0 Series

The Retrospectives combine classic "Old-School" canvas design with room for modern camera gear to create the perfect inconspicuous shooter’s bag.
www.thinktankphoto.com

I used this for a long time with inserts like the Tenba BYOB 7 and 9-
well. looks like they don't allow links to amazon here. whatever, I am not going to track down a work-around... so much depends on what is available where you are. See what people are wearing and using on your streets or your destination's streets.
 
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RezaLoghme

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They look like a camera bag, sans cargo pants pockets (= Billingham).

I think I should buy the bag before actually going on the trip, so " See what people are wearing and using on your streets or your destination's streets." is not an option that would work for me.
 
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RezaLoghme

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Another bullet point for my project: Read and understand privacy laws in the destination country, have locals with me, also because police often do not speak my language.
 

pentaxuser

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Will you be able to tell us where the protest was after you return from it, how it went and what difficulties you had , if any, with the local authorities, the protestors or any other parties that you had problems with?

Will you be able to shows us your photographs? Do you anticipate that the protest will be big enough to attract attention from others such as local or outside news agencies such as newspapers or TV ?

Thanks

pentaxuser
 

Dali

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Hook, line and sinker...
 
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RezaLoghme

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Dan Daniel said:
All I will say is to be in comfortable clothes. And be in neutral clothes. Don't look like a tourist
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Although one could argue that "looking like a tourist" is less "suspicious" than looking too plain-clothed?
 
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RezaLoghme

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Maybe if dressing too straight or even "preppy". When adding some random stuff - like a branded tshirt - something that makes you look even more "random touristy" rather than "JFK's entourage" with government-issued oxford button down shirts and chinos.

But, as mentioned above, I am reading a lot at the moment about the interpersonal aspect of street and documentary photography. Big tele lenses can be perceived as intimidating, a fishing vest with many pockets has a "reporter/journo" vibe, and, as mentioned in the real estate photography thread, having some sort of boring/credible story why you want to take pics (and where they are going to end up) is key, too.
 
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RezaLoghme

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Hello Koraks

Hasselblad 80mm Planar or 60mm Distagon CF for urban documentary project

For my upcoming urban documentary project (capital city in Central Asia, Ara Güler style, available light, no tripod, B&W ASA 400 film) would you use a 80mm Planar (chrome version) or a 60mm Distagon (C, black), or should I buy a CF version of either of these?
www.photrio.com

Here is the missing bit - that is the plan, the region, the idea etc.
 
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