B&H not shipping chemicals anymore?

[Sirius Glass]

An extremely useful and helpful bit of information. Would you drive to Freestyle for me and ship me my regular order of DD-X, Microphen and various packs of paper (only about 400 sheets) for free?

Yes, if you were on my A list, so you will have to pay for gas, mileage, handling and shipping.

 

[Born2Late]

Because there are far fewer inbound shipments, types of product can be bundled (i.e. all chems from one manufacturer in one shipment), trucks can be routed to an allowable bridge, and trucks can meet the specific transportation requirements (including exterior signage and listings of contents). Contrast that with the (presumably) many UPS trucks that go out every day with a wide variety of items. A truck may have 200 digicams on it but have to be rerouted for the 1 bottle of HC-110.

There are special shipping regs that impact B&H (and others shipping from Manhattan or Brooklyn) that don't impact Freestyle. B&H could find ways to deal with this (special shipping for hazmat, warehouse in New Jersey) but none of us know if that's economically justified. Bottom line, it sucks.

I think that theory is a bit of a push. I can find out for sure though. We have a major UPS hub locally (Louisville Kentucky), and I know lots of folks that work there including many pilots and even my brother-in-law. I'll ask around, or I could just take a package containing Kodak HC110 up to the local UPS terminal and ask to ship it to B&S, they will be able to tell if it can't be sent due to restrictions. Anyone want to donate a bottle for the test?

 

[winger]

I remember asking someone about it several years ago (within the last 8 years or so) when I discovered I could get stop bath at Freestyle (shipped), but not at B&H. What I was told then was that someone had to be specially trained and certified to properly package ORM-D items and that they had to go ground. At B&H, they couldn't control who was packing up which order in order to make sure anything ORM-D got done by the right person. While nothing has changed in the regs apparently, if something had been misclassified before, they likely took the tone of "make it all pickup only so we don't have to figure out which items are properly classified and which aren't."
Freestyle's shipping might be partially due to a lower volume than one that would get them (and us) better prices. Maybe if they get most of B&H's business for chemistry (and sundries), they can negotiate a better price for shipping?

 

[Larry the sailor]

It was only a $750 order and it got split up between Freestyle and Adorama. I'm sure B&H will never miss it but I feel better.

 

[Colin Corneau]

A 20 year old airplane crash is pretty lame, far as rationalizations go.

B&H is not being forthright, here.

Freestyle is out for Canadian photographers, given the exhorbitant shipping costs. I'm lucky to have a local retailer carrying most of the chemistry I use -- but for how long? How about those who don't have a local retailer to support?

Bad move by B&H. I'd appreciate HenryP chiming in, to elaborate on this and to at least convey our messages to management to reconsider this move.

 

[bvy]

I read the first 2 pages and skipped to the end, because it looks like some plane crash in 1996 is causing this foolishness NOW? Am I missing something?

Yes. We all are.

 

[Agulliver]

Something does not add up about B&H's stated reasons. Clearly they were able to ship chemistry until very recently, clearly there has been no change in the law, and clearly other retailers are still sending out chemicals.

On my next trip to the USA I was going to place an order with B&H for some film that is cheaper than here in the UK. Probably $200 worth.

I'll be using Freestyle. Outright dishonesty and poor treatment of longstanding customers are deal breakers for me.

 

[faberryman]

The regs dealing with hazmat, especially given the bridges and tunnels necessary to reach Manhattan and Brooklyn (where I think their warehouse is) may be much easier for a specialized carrier than a mixed carrier like ups. There are special regs and exclusions. So, as an example, some/all tunnels restrict all hazmat materials. So as an example, an inbound truck can be properly marked and limited to only bridge traffic. But to require all outbound trucks to using just bridge access might be unreasonable. Looking at a map of Brooklyn NY will give you more insight into the potential issues.

They are going to have to truck it from their Brooklyn warehouse to their Manhatten store if the are going to offer in-store pickup. Queens-Midtown Tunnel?

 

[MattKing]

I'm disappointed with this change of affairs, but I wonder if any of the change originates either directly or indirectly with the shipping company(ies) they use.

Something like their contract with UPS is up, and the only way they can still get the low volume pricing is if they stop including the chemicals amongst the shipments.

 

[Sirius Glass]

It is not dishonesty. Both B&H and Adorama have the same problem, so it is probably a regional problem with shipments of all delivery companies.

 

[MattKing]

It is not dishonesty. Bot B&H and Adorama have the same problem, so it is probably a regional problem with shipments of all delivery companies.

But Adorama is still shipping most chemicals. B & H has ceased shipping almost everything.

I say "almost everything" because of Kodak Polymax T print developer still shows as being shippable on B & H's website (I placed an order after this thread started and it has reached Kentucky, on its way to my shipping address in Washington State).

 

[faberryman]

Well, they are in New York, which is the #1 terror target of the world.

I'm sure that's it. ISIS is now behind the change in B&H's shipping policy.

 

[Larry the sailor]

Just for reference I placed an order with freestyle Wednesday evening for chemicals and it arrived this afternoon via "The White truck of happiness" .
Considerably faster that had I placed the same order with my former favorite purveyor of photographic materials.

 

[hacked - sepiareverb]

It is not dishonesty. Both B&H and Adorama have the same problem, so it is probably a regional problem with shipments of all delivery companies.

Well, many people find that a B&H rpresentative continuing to profess they do not ship by UPS Ground while B&H continues to send things by UPS Ground isn't actually a truth. Tho some apparently have a different notion of what truth is.

 

[Sirius Glass]

So B&H is the only company in the whole world with an inconsistency between policy and what is posted on the web site?

 

[mgb74]

They are going to have to truck it from their Brooklyn warehouse to their Manhatten store if the are going to offer in-store pickup. Queens-Midtown Tunnel?

Or Williamsburg Bridge. But it's not the issue of getting a specific, periodic supply on a scheduled basis. It's - likely - the issue of combining certain materials that represent a relatively small volume in a much larger mix of packages without forcing all those packages to go through the same hoops.

If you've done any supply chain work you understand that dealing with a dedicated, known shipment is much easier than a mix of shipments where only some require special handling (unless you want to force all those shipments comply with special handling - which you don't). So it's not a question of "if it can come in, why can't it come out", it's the complexity and cost of having it "come out" legally. And what you can get away with as an individual on an isolated basis may not be possible for a retailer.

Also, anyone who's dealt with a bureaucracy (government or corporate) knows that rules can be ignored until there's an issue - then suddenly they're strictly followed. Here's a partial example: I've shipped ammunition, legally and properly marked, via UPS. UPS, in their stated requirements, says it must be in "new packaging". That's a UPS, not a government, rule. But they've never enforced that. But that could easily change should UPS decide to do so.

Those who want to believe that it's some great conspiracy are free to do so. But in all likelihood the B&H felt the cost and complexity of shipping these chemicals wasn't worth it. If you want to boycott them to send them a message, that's certainly your right.

 

[mshchem]

Checked a couple times tonight XTOL is back in play , free shipping etc. Hypo clearing agent, some liquid fixers etc. Last night XTOL was out now it's back . lots of formulary items . Oy Vey what is going on?
I'm going to place a nice big film order now maybe get a pack of Xtol ?
Best Mike

 

[Ozxplorer]

Profit is not a dirty word! The fact that some brands and not others are either available through the shop while not being shipped, brands not available online but can possibly be made available by contacting the shop and all imported European brands are basically boycotted it seems to me that B&H may be exercising market clout to extract a "better deal" from their supply chain. The fact that product is "moving" is testament to their duplicity in this matter while as I believe some other issue is resolved. It may be possible too that the free shipping concept is dead necessitating higher retail pricing for it to be part of their offer.
Consider, example, Kodak TX 400 @ 30m = $129.95 older, still current inventory, is being offered @ $99.95. I note, the price differential between new stock pricing and new comparison Ilford item is more than double! Alaris not meeting demand for TX or cynically manufacturing a pent up shortage so as to command premium pricing is yet something else to ponder... An APUG SPONSOR IS OFFERING THE SAME PRODUCT AT $179.95 noting the short supply as a reason to buy now.
Photographers' Formulary product attracts shipping charge across the range most of which is not in stock. Is it conceivable orders of this product, a very wide product assortment, will henceforth be supplied direct ex the Formulary? Does this change the B&H business model to the extent they become an agent in the sale process rather than the retailer?
Possible too is the opportunity for manufacturer/suppliers to adopt a vertically integrated distribution system made more viable because of Internet/online shopping... We really don't know, but, one thing is certain - using this medium we are going to find it increasingly difficult to obtain supplies and more costly to continue our art interest.

Whatever, the "inconvenience" regretted by B&H, it remains just that - a platitude! Fred

 

[faberryman]

Those who want to believe that it's some great conspiracy are free to do so. But in all likelihood the B&H felt the cost and complexity of shipping these chemicals wasn't worth it. If you want to boycott them to send them a message, that's certainly your right.

No one has alleged conspiracy. The issue is honesty. If, as you say, "in all likelihood the B&H felt the cost and complexity of shipping these chemicals wasn't worth it", which I think is what everyone here believes, let them say so, instead of spouting all the BS they have posted so far.

 

[brofkand]

Checked a couple times tonight XTOL is back in play , free shipping etc. Hypo clearing agent, some liquid fixers etc. Last night XTOL was out now it's back . lots of formulary items . Oy Vey what is going on?
I'm going to place a nice big film order now maybe get a pack of Xtol ?
Best Mike

I emailed B&H Customer Service and they are working with the shipping department to see what's going on. The CS Rep I worked with was surprised that powders like D-76, ID-11, etc., which have no shipping restrictions, are being marked as in-store only. The shipping department manager comes back in on Monday so I'm expecting a reply from my CS Rep sometime tomorrow or the next day with a final answer.

Since we've seen many more products come back online like XTOL (and LegacyPro's XTOL clone), I think that we can assume at this point that they've acknowledged the mistake and are correcting it.

 

[bvy]

How convenient -- a "mistake" that stopped them from shipping heavy and relatively unprofitable darkroom chemicals during the busiest shopping weekend of the year.

Glad things are back to the way they were, in any case.

 

[canuhead]

very interesting so now some b/w chemistry is available for shipping to Canada,]. wonder if a ahigher up said enough is enough after seeing their rep and decision get blasted online.

 

[faberryman]

I emailed B&H Customer Service and they are working with the shipping department to see what's going on... The shipping department manager comes back in on Monday so I'm expecting a reply from my CS Rep sometime tomorrow or the next day with a final answer.

I thinking it was not the shipping department manager that went into the computer and changed all the chemicals to store pickup only on his own initiative.

 

[brofkand]

I thinking it was not the shipping department manager that went into the computer and changed all the chemicals to store pickup only on his own initiative.

Certainly not - it was either a bug in the system, someone clicked the wrong button at some point, or B&H is getting out of the chemistry business. I am hopeful that the CS rep I emailed will give us a more useful reply than Henry did earlier in this thread - where he blamed a 20 year old airplane accident that has no bearing on shipping products like powdered D-76 that have no shipping restrictions.

How convenient -- a "mistake" that stopped them from shipping heavy and relatively unprofitable darkroom chemicals during the busiest shopping weekend of the year.

Glad things are back to the way they were, in any case.

They are not back to where they were - a lot of products, namely D-76 powder, are still listed as in-store only. However, they've restored a number of products that were in-store only back to being shippable.

 

[mshchem]

Beautiful Sodium Thiosulfate pentahydrate crystals are available on ebay $2.20/lb free shipping. This little incident has made me think about making my own again
Best Mike