Any former processing lab people out there?

VinceInMT

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I wasn't sure where to post this but this seemed about the closest. Feel free to redirect me.

After my military service in the early 1970s I worked in a medium sized color photo processing lab, you know, the place that the camera store, grocery and drug stores, etc. sent film off to be processed.

As these labs are largely a thing of the past I was reminiscing and wondering how many others on these forums might have worked in them?

I worked in one in Southern California. We did about 3,000 rolls of color film per day. We processed both C-22 on a dip and dunk processor and C-41 on a more modern continuous processor. I worked in the printing department, starting off as a film cutter on a graveyard shift. I was the guy who cut your 35mm, 110, 126, 120 film into strips and reunited it with your envelope. I used a manual blade operated by a treadle. Very primitive. I also learn retouching/spotting so I had something to do if I got ahead of the film guys.

After 8 months or so of that I advanced up to to "printer" and learned operate a printer for primarily 35mm, on a Kodak 2620 color printer. Next to me was our only automated printer, another 2620, and I kept it loaded with film and paper. In slow times I learned to use our other Kodak machines (numbers escape me) that were used to print other formats and paper sizes. During my breaks I'd hand out at other stations and learned how to run our paper processors, one for reversal and one for regular prints from negs.

The lab underwent a reorganization and I was moved to a new position: quality control. I was sent to Kodak training in Whittier, CA where I learned how to set up all of our machines so the color and density output were all the same, how to mix our chemicals, how to track quality with test strips through the system using a Macbeth color densitometer, etc. After that I started coming in ahead of our midnight shift and setting up all the machines and tracking their output and keeping chemistry mixed, which I did at 200 gallons per batch. We also added some automated machines that cut the prints up faster and I learned to do some maintenance on those.

I really enjoyed the job, being a photo lab rat, and it allowed me to take college classes on the GI Bill during the day, and it paid just enough ($3-5 per hour) that I could afford to have an apartment without a roommate. Eventually I left that job and became a drafter/designer in the petro/chem industry.
 

ozphoto

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I spent almost 15 years managing a semi-pro lab, straight out of high school, in an Australian KMart, during the late 80s to late '90s. This lab was pretty much the same process as yours, although we didn't do dip-and-dunk, and the C41 and (originally) EP2 then RA4 machines were Noritsu's.

It was a great learning curve and I did enjoy it, but it didn't continue to challenge me and like you, I ended up changing careers - I'm now an architectural photographer. On the plus side, the job helped me buy some nice glass: a 300 f2.8 and 180 f2.5 Tamron lenses, earned me long service leave* (15 weeks holiday) for trip to the UK, EU and USA for 3 months and assisted me in purchasing the car of my dreams.

It was fun, stressful and rewarding, ultimately, it gave me a solid base for the years that followed - I haven't looked back, but remember it fondly.

* Long Service Leave applies to all states and Territories in Australia, the rules for South Australia are:

Under the Long Service Leave Act 1987 (SA) an employee is entitled, after ten years continuous service, to long service leave on full pay amounting to thirteen weeks [s 5]. A further 1.3 weeks is granted for each completed year after 10 years service.

Some employees may have their entitlements to long service leave regulated by a workplace agreement or award which is different to these statutory entitlements. As a general rule, provisions in a Federal award or workplace agreement will override a State law if there is inconsistency and an intention to exclude the State law. Employees that come under a Federal Award are entitled to 13 weeks leave after 15 years of service. These Federal Award employees are entitled to a pro rata payment if they leave work after 10 years continuous service.

https://lawhandbook.sa.gov.au/ch18s05s01.php

I know of several friends who have taken LSL PLUS their accrued annual leave (Australians get 4 weeks/yr) and taken an entire year off on full pay PLUS 15% holiday loading.
 
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markbau

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Nanette, you might have to explain Long Service Leave for our American friends. When I lived there I found that Americans had a hard time getting their heads around it. One bloke in a bar even called me a "goddamn liar"! Sure glad I don't live and work there anymore.
 

Arvee

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While going to school on the GI bill, I worked for Rene Larson Studios (mainly advertising photography) in Costa Mesa, CA doing their color printing (machine and enlargements) and assisting in running the E6 line. Following that, I did all the b/w processing/printing for the local police department crime photo lab for a year. In that job had to document an autopsy in a murder case; it was my one and only! Concurrent with these activities I was the sports cinematographer for the UC Long Beach football team and traveled with the team for two seasons and assisted in the processing of my 16mm b/w film on a Houston Fearless 16mm processor. I also shot about a half dozen weddings but decided I really didn’t like that part of the business. It was a ton of pressure not screwing up losing shots/footage but I loved every minute.

However, after I finished school I went into electronic engineering for a career but film photography is still my primary hobby.
 
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Two23

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I worked most of a year in a Fuji TruColor lab. High volume warehouse type operation, C-41 only. This was just as small digital cameras started coming out. While it was interesting I was only doing it while earning money for college and didn't like the fact it was overnight work.


Kent in SD
 

MattKing

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In the late 1970s, I worked as a colour printer in a custom photo lab that only did work for professional photographers.
My father was customer services manage at a Kodak Canada Kodachrome and Ektachrome lab between 1961 and 1983 - so does vicarious experience count?
 

jamesaz

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I was hired to do b/w printing at a small (I was the only employee) custom lab in Detroit after my discharge in ‘73. The owner had a contract for film processing and prints from the Philadelphia Naval facility, some other govt. places and some local things. In a few months I was doing color printing and copy work as well. The color prints were basket processed in a couple big tanks. I stayed there for about a year and a half And moved on when he started to get into trying to compete with the volume places by getting an S printer and VCNA. Becoming a picture factory took the fun out of it. What I learned there was excellent grounding though. It was an excellent stop on my photographic journey, which continues.
 

ozphoto

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Haha - yes, that probably is going to be needed. I'll edit my post to add an explanation.
 
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VinceInMT

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.....I did all the b/w processing/printing for the local police department crime photo lab for a year.....I was the sports cinematographer for the UC Long Beach football team.....but film photography is still my primary hobby.

We did the processing for the Long Beach Police Department. Some pretty ugly stuff would come through. As a side note, the former owner of our lab used to require employees who did the final check and packaging to hold all the orders that had pictures of people breaking the law, this included smoking pot, and these were turned over to the police department. Once he passed away and his daughter took over the business it was only overt violations that were held, like child porn.

I'm a graduate of Cal State Long Beach.

And while I dabble in the convenience of digital, film is still one of my primary hobbies too.
 
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VinceInMT

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....trying to compete with the volume places by getting an S printer...

Yes, that was the printer series I couldn't remember. We had 5-S and 8-S machines.

I will admit to a guilty pleasure I had while working in the lab. This was from 1975-1979 in Southern California and our client accounts included all parts of LA and Orange counties. I was/am a big music fan and we'd see lots of pictures from all the concerts that would play in our area. Some were photographed on or near on stage. When I'd spy those going through I'd reroute the order and print myself a few copies on my break, copies never circulated, only for my private enjoyment. If that was a crime I'm sure statute of limitations has run out by now.
 

Paul Howell

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I worked part time at a minilab, a Moto Photo, started with an older Fuji analog printer then spend time with the Frontier, most minilabs printed on auto, Motophoto corrected color and exposure for each print. Spoiled, me, color was very good, although a subtractive process the monitor was programmed to appear additive, too yellow, take out yellow. I had to quit, my day job at the time was as rehabilitation counselor for state vocational rehabilitation program. One day got some more than sketchy images of nude children, engaged in sexual play. At the time there was no duty for the owner to report they would just return the negative and tell the customer they don’t print such, but I had legal and ethical duty to report and had to call CPS who brought in the police. I quit before I was fired.
 

foc

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Last Friday I retired and closed down my processing/minilab after 35 years.

I started in a wholesale photofinishing lab in 1979. The lab had a dip & dunk C41, Colenta rotary processor for Agfa CNS and B&W was done on a hand line. The printers were Durst (I can't remember the models) and we could print 35mm, 126, 110, 120/620, 127, Disc.
All prints were made on Fuji paper in a Durst EP2 processor. There was also custom hand prints on a enlarger but that never too off.

In the busy summer months the lab ran 24 hours, in three 8 hour shifts and like the OP said there were test strips and chemical mixing before each shift.

In 1985 I started out in my own lab/ studio /shop. I dropped the 120/620, 127 & Disc as I found them uneconomical and time-consuming.
From there I moved premises twice and have used Fuji equipment since 1990.

The equipment became more automated and easier to use but having leaned the old manual way of processing was great back up knowledge, something no program or software can replicate. I adapted to digital as it entered the market but also kept the C41 going, even though some people thought me crazy. I managed to build up a loyal following in film developing and scaning, first with 2 Frontier scanners and then lately with a Pakon.
 
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VinceInMT

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I rummaged through my stuff and found some images I shot in the lab I worked in. These are from July 1976.
 

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Mr Bill

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Hi, I'm also a long-time lab guy. Big lab, largely a QC and process specialist. Including effluent control and silver recovery, areas in which few people seem to have much experience.

I started out doing b&w film and printing, back in the day when my dream job would have been working for Life magazine. I wanted to learn how to do everything, so after some time shooting weddings and then high-volume portraiture I decided that I needed to learn about the "black art" of color photography. (Back then it was Kodak CPS film, C-22 process, and only a pro lab could do adequate work.) So I took a "temporary" excursion into lab work to help fill in this gap in my knowledge.

I cut my teeth running a Kodak continuous processor (heat splices to string rolls together, 2 inch paper leader to start up and end a run), as well as Nord package printers on occasion. Then, like Vince, I moved into QC work. I learned from the ground up with the help of lots of knowledgeable people over the years, too many to list.

I was the QC manager roughly through the 1980s, with a staff of 5 or 6 people. A couple general-purpose techs who could do just about anything - process control, basic chemical tests, set up studio lighting and do test shooting for whatever we needed to look at. We had an on-site chem lab, with chemist, to help keep our chemical systems under control, as well as a full-time product inspector doing semi-random sampling of the finished, ready-to-ship portrait packages.

At that time my techs were handling about 40, maybe 50 control strips on a busy day. It was all our own work; we were the main processing lab of a studio chain. Film was mostly long-roll, run on modified Pako cine processors. The vast majority of what we did was printing - upwards of 300,000 8x10" prints per day, processed on 6 or 8 Pako CP-6000 machines. (These were once an industry workhorse; today nearly lost to internet history.) We ran our main lab mostly in the configuration of 3 lanes of 10" wide paper at 28 ft per minute. (That's about 125 8x10" "units" every minute.) Everything was hand balanced for color, more or less, and dust-spotted.

Just about every time I thought I'd learned "enough," the company would give me some new challenges or opportunity, so I would extend my "temporary" excursion away from pure shooting. Anyway I never did get back to full-time shooting.
 

jtk

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In early 70s I managed Media Generalists, which was by far the best E4 lab in San Francisco, and which did slide duplicates and graphic slides....as a parallel activity we produced commercial slide shows including San Francisco Experience, Hawaii Experience, New York Experience...32-projector glass mounted super slides.

Subsequently I managed marketing for Faulkner Color Lab in San Francisco... Ektacolor, Cibacolor, E6, E4 primarily for photo pros and graphic designers. Created marketing program and restructured pricing (essentially doubled prices) which resulted in doubled profits in one year.

Shifted to marketing graphic services, then built Cibachrome exhibits, then committed to mostly-studio, mostly food, commercial photography....mostly 4X5.
 

simplejoy

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I'm sorry for digging up such an old thread, but given that you've worked with an Agfa MSC 2 I would love to ask you some questions, because I'm very curious about those (seemingly rare) machines:

- do you happen to know the varifocal lenses used in there? For example who could have manufactured them? (I'll attach an image I found)
- do you know something about their optical construction?
- were those lenses used for scanning or printing?
- did the MSC2 also use some fixed focal length lenses? If so, were they labeled Copal E90C?

Hope it's okay to ask so many questions at once, about a forgotten machine from the 1990s all of a sudden... It's just that I'm personally very interested in these machines and lenses and want to find out some more details in order to complete my online-article on the matter.
 

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foc

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I never operated Agfa equipment but I do know that the varifocal lenses were for use on different negative formats to print size.
For example 35mm would have a varifocal lens to cover 6x4 inch (10x15cm) prints and 5x7 (13x18cm)
These lenses were used for printing negatives onto photo paper (on a roll)
AFAIK these machines were pre digital. They were optical printers.
 

simplejoy

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Thanks a lot! I think you're right - that's exactly how (surprisingly similar looking) varifocal lenses were used in Noritsu QSS machines as well. I initially thought there must have been some mechanism in those machines to change their focal length, but all the samples I've seen so far were actually used at a certain focal length fixed with some screws - so it looks like many of those minilabs probably made use of a couple of those varifocal lenses adjusted to the print sizes, just like you described. If that's true it's even more surprising that they seem so hard to find... I'm afraid most of those machines have landed in the garbage bin when they stopped working and the lenses with them.

What I find the most interesting about the MSC2 lenses is that they seem very different to the MSC1 lenses. For the latter Agfa produced quite heavy and unique looking lenses:

They were labeled "Made in Germany" and I was told that the former Staeble factory (another German lens maker Agfa had bought at some point) was responsible for the development and manufacturing.

The MSC2 lenses on the other hand look completely different and I would be surprised to find out that Agfa/Staeble built them. I would rather suspect that they were made in Japan, given their similarity to their Noritsu counterparts. But of course without any written evidence on the matter that's all speculation, which is why I'm very curious to hear if someone working on a machine like that might know more on the matter (like who was responsible for servicing the lenses/if they were labeled 'Japan' or 'Germany' etc.)

 

simplejoy

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That's very interesting to me - what kind of machines did you use in a professional custom photo lab? Regular (high end) enlargers or some minilab/paper processor type? I've been told many of my favorite lenses have been used in labs like that, but when I show how they look no one seems to recognize them. That's why I wonder if they were hidden inside of some big machines and rarely changed or only by technicians rather than the operators.
 

TheFlyingCamera

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I would assume it was a varifocal lens because we never changed lenses when switching from 35mm to medium format. As to what the lens was, exactly, I have no idea. I don't remember ever actually seeing the lens.
 

simplejoy

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I would assume it was a varifocal lens because we never changed lenses when switching from 35mm to medium format. As to what the lens was, exactly, I have no idea. I don't remember ever actually seeing the lens.

That's a pity, but thanks a lot for your response! As stated before, I've never seen any of those lenses attached to some mechanism able to change the focal length, so I doubt this would have been the case in the MSC2. However a listing online seems to suggest there might have been more than one lens inside of it so perhaps it was just switched automatically. Another option might have been an additional zoom lens. The MSC 200 (I don't know how similar that was - it looks quite different) seems to have used one, according to a spec sheet:

"Lenses: Zoom for 135, IX 240 and 110 film formats. Variable focus lens for 120/220/IX240 film formats (option)."

Unfortunately I wasn't able to find any spec sheets/manuals from the MSC 2.

Unsurprisingly there are not many opinions out there who could have made those lenses for either Noritsu and/or Agfa, but my best guess would be Nikon, Tomioka or Copal. The latter was responsible for the whole printing part of the MSC2, so they might be the most likely. However Agfa sourced their 3rd party stuff from a number of (significant) manufacturers at that particular time (including Nikon), so until I find proof challenging it, I consider everything possible.
 
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