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ADOX CHS 100 II is back in 35mm!

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Finally got to try some. I like it. What is the status for 120? Here are a couple 35mm (Contax iia; Nikkor P.C 105mm f2.5) developed in HC110.


stump by Mark Wyatt, on Flickr


ex-tree by Mark Wyatt, on Flickr
 
markjwyatt said:
What is the status for 120?
Click to expand...
I believe that is a somewhat sensitive subject, I think they are close, since a year ago in PhotoKlassik was written that 120 would come in summer 2020. Well then came some virus which slowed things down.

TeamAdox, what do you need at the moment? People, money, special resources, machining with very small tolerances? Regarding money, can't the community help you? I could already buy a dozen rolls now and receive them whenever the machine is ready :smile:
 
m00dawg said:
Of note, I know 4x5 is not 120 :smile: But I can attest it is absolutely gorgeous in sheets (which are currently produced by Adox)!
Click to expand...
Sadly, unobtanium here in the US. I don't know of a vendor that has the 4x5 sheets - of the places I checked either they don't carry it or it is out of stock. The box of 4x5 that I ordered in November sits in a lonely cell in Frankfurt awaiting freedom.
 
I have seen images from 4x5, and I also noted that there are some images from around 2015 on 120. Both formats look quite good. I understand that one of the main issues around 120 in general is the backing paper.
 
markjwyatt said:
I have seen images from 4x5, and I also noted that there are some images from around 2015 on 120. Both formats look quite good. I understand that one of the main issues around 120 in general is the backing paper.
Click to expand...

AFAIK a big problem is to have their slitter operational. There is a pretty old video on it, and I haven't heard about success on that front yet. Probably operational limitations due to Covid-19.

And even if they have quietly completed their work on the slitter they have mentioned on Photrio that their Swiss facility is pretty much unreachable at the moment. Unless their coater at HQ is operational already they couldn't do any 120 test coatings, let alone production.

I also haven't heard anything about how they will be rolling those 120 films. Do they have a machine or will they have an economic means to have those pancakes converted into finished product by a service provider.
 
m00dawg said:
Of note, I know 4x5 is not 120 :smile: But I can attest it is absolutely gorgeous in sheets (which are currently produced by Adox)!
Click to expand...

Ditto!
 
markjwyatt said:
100' rolls of 35mm would also be good (at rational prices)!
Click to expand...

I asked them about that. They said it is not being planned for now. Very unfortunate. Adox does try to have competitive pricing, and Silvermax bulk rolls were good value, while they had them. But with my Silvermax roll finished I bought a roll of FP4+ as my main medium speed 35mm film.

FP4+ is great in any case, and I really don't like the PET (or whatever it is ) base of CHS100-II. But I do like a clear, untinted base and the possibility for reversal. CHS is supposed to be very good at reversal.
 
lantau said:
I asked them about that. They said it is not being planned for now. Very unfortunate. Adox does try to have competitive pricing, and Silvermax bulk rolls were good value, while they had them. But with my Silvermax roll finished I bought a roll of FP4+ as my main medium speed 35mm film.

FP4+ is great in any case, and I really don't like the PET (or whatever it is ) base of CHS100-II. But I do like a clear, untinted base and the possibility for reversal. CHS is supposed to be very good at reversal.
Click to expand...

I can of agree with you. FP4+ has been my main medium speed film for 35mm. I just got a nice bulk loader (and have an older one too), so may start rolling my own. I would consider CHS 100 if available, but can go with FP4+ (or maybe HP5+). In any case, I would still shoot some individual rolls of CHS 100 II. I note that CHS 100 II seems to be priced more like Delta 100 than FP4+ at Freestyle.

@Ernst-Jan - I think CMS-20 and HR50 are too low an ISO to use all the time (especially CMS-20), but I may like to try those in the future. For bulk loading I am struggling between med/high speed, not low speed! I do remember Pan-X though, and like low speed films for their qualities.
 
lantau said:
AFAIK a big problem is to have their slitter operational. There is a pretty old video on it, and I haven't heard about success on that front yet. Probably operational limitations due to Covid-19.

And even if they have quietly completed their work on the slitter they have mentioned on Photrio that their Swiss facility is pretty much unreachable at the moment. Unless their coater at HQ is operational already they couldn't do any 120 test coatings, let alone production.

I also haven't heard anything about how they will be rolling those 120 films. Do they have a machine or will they have an economic means to have those pancakes converted into finished product by a service provider.
Click to expand...

They were providing CHS 100 II in 120 at least during 2015-2017 (I have seen images on Flickr), so I suspect they have the inherent capabilities available.
 
markjwyatt said:
. What is the status for 120?
Click to expand...

We are working very hard on implementing and improving all 120 converting steps in our factory. Film converting on an industrial scale and at high quality is really high-tech business and very difficult. Most film photographers are probably underestimating the multiple challenges.
At the momet we cannot give a timeline, it would not be sincere.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.
 
Ernst-Jan said:
TeamAdox, what do you need at the moment? People, money, special resources, machining with very small tolerances? Regarding money, can't the community help you? I could already buy a dozen rolls now and receive them whenever the machine is ready :smile:
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support.
The best you all can do as our customers to support our efforts in construction our own, independent 120 film converting line at the moment is just keep buying our products. Every single cent of revenue is invested in the construction of our new factory, and 120 film converting capability is one of the absolute priorities.
Thank you very much for your support!

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.
 
macfred said:
Even if they will roll it on the tighs of a teutonic queen, I will buy it ...
Click to expand...

Nice idea, but then we would of course have to implement the costs for the teutonic queen as well....... we can't get them for free.......:laugh::wink:.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.
 
markjwyatt said:
They were providing CHS 100 II in 120 at least during 2015-2017 (I have seen images on Flickr), so I suspect they have the inherent capabilities available.
Click to expand...

They had 120 rolled by someone else. The film was also toll coated by someone else. And that has been a big problem the last few years as various precurser products and services either disappeared or became too expensive for a competitive product. Look at the lovely MCC and MCP papers. They were toll coated, but prices have gone up too much. Now they'll try to do it in house. Listening to what Adox occasionally comments it seems that things at times become unavailable faster than they can build up in house capabilities.

I received three rolls of the original 35mm CHS100-II in the first week of 2016. Used the first in 2018 at a festival celebrating the history of Magdeburg and people wear different period dress. I'm with the 1600s, Thirty Year War groups. The second roll was used last August in Florence. The third is still waiting for a special occasion and I got two new stock rolls in with a recent order.

The results have been really good and I think I will keep buying occasional single rolls. The film looks nice and clean. There's a little grain, as expected, normal for a 100 speed. FP4+ probably won't have less, I haven't used FP4 much in 35mm. But my impression was that the grain looked very smooth, evenly distributed. Literally fine grain. I have 100ft now, to try out.

On that 2018 occasion I used this roll of CHS100, a roll of TMX and otherwise my staple HP5+, which I'm bulk loading as well. I just started a new roll. It was a good comparism. HP5 isn't terribly grainy on well metered frames. So it looks fine. Then medium speed. O so clean looking. CHS100-II worked really well. And TMX was the cherry on top, of course. Just to remind me how good 35mm can get. Such a lovely choice of aesthetics But the Adox does really well for what seems to be a fairly simple emulsion.
 
Team ADOX said:
No, we've had done it in-house by ourselves. Besides getting all production steps in-house, we are also working on further quality improvements.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I seem to have had a wrong memory there. I'm thrilled that you already have the machine and had it working!

There are just too many details and changes about these last years. When I started reading about photography, probably around 2011, to pick it up as a hobby I came across Adox. I thought that I read at that time that you bought the old machines from Agfa and with the help of former engineers made MCC on those machines in house. When I finally got into film and printing years later this seemed to be incorrect. I guess only now is it happening.

You should commision a Foto Impex/Adox history book!
 
lantau said:
Sorry, I seem to have had a wrong memory there. I'm thrilled that you already have the machine and had it working!
There are just too many details and changes about these last years.
Click to expand...

No problem. Film and photo paper manufacturing is indeed a very difficult, complex and challenging high-tech business. And a lot has changed in the last years. For the film photographer and customer all these technical details and industry changes can certainly be a bit confusing from time to time.
The 120 film converting machine is working in full automatic mode. That means you "feed" it at the beginning with a slitted 120 film pancake, the needed backing paper and tapes, and at the end you get a completely finished 120 roll film.
But we are working on some refinements and improvements of this machine as well.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.
 
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