Would you buy a Nikon FM2n in 2020?

zanxion72 · Dec 22, 2020

flavio81 said:
These are the advantages:

- FE meters with manual focus lenses, the F60, doesn't.
- FE has a better viewfinder
- FE allows you to easily manual focus a lens through the viewfinder
- FE uses common LR44 batteries instead of the rather uncommon CR123A lithium of the F60.

These are not. Because:
F60 has a fast auto focus system
F60 uses the far better AF-D lenses
F60 has an equally bright viewfinder and manual focusing is equally easy
F60 speed and aperture readings are also available in the dark
F60 offers Auto, Aperture and Shutter priority modes
F60 has 3d matrix metering and it is by far more accurate than that of FE. CR123A li aren't uncommon at all and they sell for 2 euros (Varta) where I live
The F60 price wise is far better than a FE in terms of features offered for your buck. For just 20-30 euros, the only real advantage of the FE would be its quieter and less vibrating shutter.

zanxion72 · Dec 22, 2020

flavio81 said:
A Lomo Smena 8M would probably never fail on a himalayan trip either. Maybe never fail after 10 Himalayan trips. Yeah, it's reliable. It also has extremely cheap build quality, fit, and finish.

I stand for what I wrote, as a Nikon fan. Never understood the glorification of the FM2. And again, I've owned it. As well as the FM, FE, and FE2 (which is preferable).

Now you are pulling it... I bought a Smena 8M just because it was for just 5 euros. It has failed on the first roll of film where the plastic film advancing gog just broke. Not sure if it wouldn't at Himalayas, but at sea level it just doesn't stand for it. The same way you cannot understand the glorification of an FM2 over the FE would stand the same between a top medium format camera and a Lubitel.
Among the older electronic shutter cameras, FA is my preferred one. For a camera that does not work without batteries it offers the best features among FE, FE2 and the rest low cost ones like FG, etc.

flavio81 said:
Compared to the F, F2, EL, EL2 and the Nikkormats, yes. Flimsy. The F3 is also better built. My hands don't lie, i had the FM2N, the F3, F2S, EL and Nikkormat FTN on my table.

At least the FE2 gives a great auto mode and a wonderful match needle meter. The FM2 doesn't offer none of this.

As for the himalayas this or that, i wasn't speaking about reliability. I was speaking about fit, finish and apparent build quality.

When your FE2 dies, can it be fixed, who would fix it, is it worth fixing it? Be carefull with what you say:

A Lomo Smena 8M would probably never fail on a himalayan trip either. Maybe never fail after 10 Himalayan trips. Yeah, it's reliable.

zanxion72 · Dec 22, 2020

albireo said:
Sorry to be that guy, but..

I just don't get all the love for the FM/FE lines of cameras.

There I said it. I should be ashamed of this, as a Nikon fanboy and owner of so many of their cameras, I know. I bought a minty FE last year. It just doesn't do it for me. I really wanted to love it but there's something.. off. It feels (I know sorry) _cheap_ when you press the shutter release. I never got used to the"twang" springy bell sound it makes when taking the shot, for starters. The viewfinder is 'meh'.

Love Nikon and I will never part with my F3HP and F90x, but when it's about a simple (mostly) mechanical camera, I just find myself reaching for my Olympus OM2n over my FE. All the time. A much smoother, more enjoyable experience for me. ymmv.

FM is a lot different to FE. F3HP is some of a beast but I like my Canon New F-1 over it, F90x is blown away by my F100. F90 has a really noisy shutter, so annoyingly noisy that I sold it for a mere nothing. I like my OMs too quite a bit. OM-2n is my preferred one too:

I have always regarded OM-1 and OM-2s as simple and elegant cameras. I love them.
(sorry for the off-Nikon hijack)

138S · Dec 22, 2020

darkosaric said:
Buy it, sell 45mm f2.8, and buy 50mm f2 and tons of film. Easy .

Yeah !!!!

The FM2 body comes for free !!! Not much FM2 bodies for free around !

zanxion72 said:
What do you think?

FM2 and the like are a way of life. A plastic/cheap F65 (to not say F80) has much better features, but having in the hands a FM2 with a metal AI-S lens offers a unique experience. It is difficult to explain how a FM2 is to yield better images... but one feels extremly happy with one in the hands and this may allow a better approach to the subject, that happiness is the major feature a FM2 sports. Of course this is totally personal...

zanxion72 · Dec 22, 2020

138S said:
Yeah !!!!

View attachment 262044

The FM2 body comes for free !!! Not much FM2 bodies for free around !

FM2 and the like are a way of life. A plastic/cheap F65 (to not say F80) has much better features, but having in the hands a FM2 with a metal AI-S lens offers a unique experience. It is difficult to explain how a FM2 is to yield better images... but one feels extremly happy with one in the hands and this may allow a better approach to the subject, that happiness is the major feature a FM2 sports. Of course this is totally personal...

In will keep that lens just for its weird looks. I might even try it on my Sony A7 II, just to see instantly how it fares (I rarely shoot digital).

That's what I think too. One can take great shots, especially if we speak of exclusively artistically and not for technically perfect images even with the Smena stated before. Another factor at least for me is how I feel with the camera in my hands. It adds a lot to my urge for taking pictures. Me thinks that this is personal too. A couple of friends of mine have decoupled themselves completely from this and focus on the taking of the images with whatever falls in their hands. I tried to, but I am still stuck to feeling nice with just two-three of the cameras I own.
One comment for the FE mentioned before. With regards to its reliability, I had two of them in like new condition. Both of them developed issues advancing the film with that bent leaf of metal at their base. It is an easy fix, but you cannot do that when you are out shooting. I sold the black, kept the silver not because I really like it, but it sits nicely among my other Nikon cameras.

138S · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
Another factor at least for me is how I feel with the camera in my hands. It adds a lot to my urge for taking pictures.

Anyway, from the FE/FE2 to the FM/FM2 we get a very similar feel... Still, it is nice having a pure mechanic camera, but to me this is more a collector's concern, sure it's a also a personal matter.

film_man · Dec 22, 2020

flavio81 said:
These are the advantages:

- FE meters with manual focus lenses, the F60, doesn't.
- FE has a better viewfinder
- FE allows you to easily manual focus a lens through the viewfinder
- FE uses common LR44 batteries instead of the rather uncommon CR123A lithium of the F60.

I never understood what makes LR44 "common" and CR123A "uncommon". I can buy them equally easily from a number of shops online including amazon and ebay. The supermarkets don't stock either. So...? I mean, right now I have about 10 CR123, a handful of CR2 and more LR44 and other button sizes than I can count. All I had to do is click a couple of buttons on amazon a year or two ago and I'm done for the next 10 years when it comes to battery consumption.

138S · Dec 22, 2020

film_man said:
I never understood what makes LR44 "common" and CR123A "uncommon". I can buy them equally easily from a number of shops online including amazon and ebay.

Also one may buy a rechargeable version of the CR123... And the CR123 advances the film automaticly Still, actioning the film advance lever of the FE/FM is a preasure... so YMMV

darkosaric · Dec 22, 2020

138S said:
And the CR123 advances the film automaticly

When I read about Konica Hexar RF - one of the key notes in reviews is that is better than Leica, because (between other features) advances film automatically. Same for Contax T2 over some other P&S like Olympus 35RC. But all is relative to the needs of the user .

Ariston · Dec 22, 2020

138S said:
Also one may buy a rechargeable version of the CR123... And the CR123 advances the film automaticly Still, actioning the film advance lever of the FE/FM is a preasure... so YMMV

The cost of automatic film advance is that you will need to change/charge your batteries much more frequently. Of course, you can haul around an N90S brick like I do, that houses four AA batteries...

On the other hand, my folder and TLR cameras never need batteries.

All that being said, I still usually take my FE or FM, for some reason.

Huss · Dec 22, 2020

darkosaric said:
When I read about Konica Hexar RF - one of the key notes in reviews is that is better than Leica, because (between other features) advances film automatically. Same for Contax T2 over some other P&S like Olympus 35RC. But all is relative to the needs of the user .

Off topic, sorta, but japancamerahunter refuses to source Konica Hexar RFs, even though there are lots easily available, even new old stock.
Too many of them break shortly after delivery due to their aged electronics. Not much fun having a camera that refuses to take a pic, or one that automatically rewinds the film after you have only taken a few shots.

Huss · Dec 22, 2020

Acticus said:
F3 blows, FM2 sux, FM2T rules. What can I tell you, I have two of them. Nananana.

Well it's easy to have two of something no-one else wants.

Les Sarile · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
The FM3A is the next to get.

Really there is only one Nikon camera accessory you need to have - if you don't already have one. And it will benefit all your other film cameras regardless of the brand/model as long as it uses film up to medium format . . .

138S · Dec 22, 2020

Ariston said:
All that being said, I still usually take my FE or FM, for some reason.

Yeah... It is a pleasure...

George Mann · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
These are not. Because:
F60 uses the far better AF-D lenses

There no AF-D lenses that better my manual focus Nikkors.

zanxion72 said:
F60 has 3d matrix metering and it is by far more accurate than that of FE.

I have found that not to be the case as well, as Center-weighted metering can yield better results in the hands of a skilled operator.

DREW WILEY · Dec 22, 2020

Les - I'd think a more important accessory would be a lens for any of those cameras! Oh yeah, a lens collector got to those first. The Coolscan is indeed a nice bookend. But I simply use a brick. Why waste good film shots scanning them?

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2020

DREW WILEY said:
flavio - I don't really care how cute a camera is and have no use for auto anything. I do care about reliability. Nobody in their right mind is going on a serious expedition with a toy camera. But frankly, I outfitted my nephew with just a simple little Pentax MX, which worked perfectly for the most difficult month-long climb ever done in the arctic, the most difficult climb ever done in Patagonia, a very extended New Zealand climbing project, multiple Himalayan climbs, and just kept working. No winterization needed. I used the heck out a basic early Honeywell Pentax H1 in the mountains when I was young. The great Himalayan photographer Shirakawa used a simple Pentax Spotmatic in addition to his Pentax 6X7 system. These are lightweight 35mm cameras, so one can understand why Nikon would want to market a reliable lighter weight version of their own.
.

Those two cameras (Pentax MX and Honeywell H1) are better built than the FM2, by my own account and experience (having owned the FM2 and the MX at the same time, and having owned several Spotmatic variations).

Is it that hard to admit that the FE/FM/FE2/FM2 line isn't as well built as the previous NIkons and the F3?

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
These are not. Because:
F60 has a fast auto focus system
F60 uses the far better AF-D lenses

I don't use AF or AF-D lenses because the manual focus lenses are much better built. And sometimes they are optically better (i.e. 35/2 AFD versus the manual focus version, 28/2.8 versus the previous manual focus version, etc).

I don't care for matrix metering. To each its own, though.

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
Now you are pulling it... I bought a Smena 8M just because it was for just 5 euros. It has failed on the first roll of film where the plastic film advancing gog just broke. Not sure if it wouldn't at Himalayas, but at sea level it just doesn't stand for it. The same way you cannot understand the glorification of an FM2 over the FE would stand the same between a top medium format camera and a Lubitel.

The Smena 8M is very reliable once you get it working first. There is very little to fail there.

zanxion72 said:
When your FE2 dies, can it be fixed, who would fix it, is it worth fixing it? Be carefull with what you say:

You realize that the FM2 and the FE2 have many many parts in common right?

Yes, the FE2's electronics are not bulletproof, but at least they're more reliable than the FE. If my FE dies, i can use any of my other Nikon cameras.

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2020

zanxion72 said:
F3HP is some of a beast but I like my Canon New F-1 over it

At least we agree in something...

Les Sarile · Dec 22, 2020

DREW WILEY said:
Les - I'd think a more important accessory would be a lens for any of those cameras! Oh yeah, a lens collector got to those first. The Coolscan is indeed a nice bookend. But I simply use a brick. Why waste good film shots scanning them?

Because it's much better then having someone else finish the fine work you started . . .

I don't recall ever seeing such poor results from a perfectly well exposed frame of Kodak Gold 100 that would make you think they were from two different films! For me the most unfortunate side of this is people who may be new to film and not know any better and think those poor results are just what is to be expected from film.

DREW WILEY · Dec 22, 2020

Zzzzzzz .... Flavio - anyone who imagines moulded plastic toy cameras will hold up without shattering in extreme cold would not be at the head of my list of people to consult with about the topic of durability. My dear ole H1 finally wore out the shutter speed cog. I happened to like the somewhat less contrasty rendering of those older lenses for Kodachrome usage. But I almost never shoot 35mm color film anymore, so more contrasty Nikon lenses are just fine for current b&w work, which is mostly just TMY400 snapshooting anyway. I have plenty of heavy artillery for sake of big enlargements. I use 35mm more for spontaneous understated poetic shots printed small, where evident grain is acceptable. Different tools for different subject matter.

Les - my idea of a minilab is when I've stuffed too much gear into one of my four darkrooms and am stumbling around it in the dark. I've turned down free drum scanners - nowhere to put one, plus no time to learn a whole different manner of color printing. Need to enjoy the toys I already have, while I still can ! You should take that green shot and list it on EBay for some absurdly high price as a rare collector's version of a military Pentax.

138S · Dec 22, 2020

flavio81 said:
Those two cameras (Pentax MX and Honeywell H1) are better built than the FM2, by my own account and experience (having owned the FM2 and the MX at the same time, and having owned several Spotmatic variations).

Is it that hard to admit that the FE/FM/FE2/FM2 line isn't as well built as the previous NIkons and the F3?

Why hard?

F3 is a Pro camera and an FM2 is a Prosumer camera, they play in different leagues. The F4 was better build than the F90, and the F5 was better build than the F100...

The Pentax MX is mostly Pro level, while the ME Super is Prosumer.

You should compare the Pro level cameras of a brand with the Pro level cameras of the other brand, again with the Prosumer level. Compare the MX to the F2/F3 and the FM to the ME Super, this is the way. In each segment Nikon was usually better than Pentax, but a Pro Pentax is better built than a Prosumer Nikon, no doubt. This is quite straight.

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2020

DREW WILEY said:
Zzzzzzz .... Flavio

Don't sleep over the keyboard. And, it appears you were dreaming and my name appeared. Sorry for tampering with your dreams. Did you dream of being in the Himalayas with a Lomo Smena 8M? Was I using a Canon F-1 there?

zanxion72 · Dec 22, 2020

George Mann said:
There no AF-D lenses that better my manual focus Nikkors.

I have found that not to be the case as well, as Center-weighted metering can yield better results in the hands of a skilled operator.

There are quite many AF-D lenses if not all that outperform you AI-S lenses. Actually almost all AF-D version is better in terms of IQ.
The super cheapo F60 offers you center-weighted too.

Would you buy a Nikon FM2n in 2020?

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