What's with Kodak film pricing?

[pbromaghin]

Foma have just announced a new mono.

Is that the Retropan 320? I haven't gotten to Foma yet in my slow exploration of film. Trying not to get too spread out.

 

[R.Gould]

This is why I have such high hopes for Ferrania. They and Harman just might be the only hope for keeping film alive 10 years from now.

I would include Foma in the list of firms that I have great hopes for keeping film alive, they have just anounced a new film, and seem to be quite a power house in the czech Republic

 

[Xmas]

Is that the Retropan 320? I haven't gotten to Foma yet in my slow exploration of film. Trying not to get too spread out.

Yes

http://www.foma.cz/ew/ec816f17-da8b-49ce-bd89-1d75aa19fee6-en

Given they have a 100, 200 & 400 already the 320 seems strange.

 

[Rodinalforever]

One of the best thread ever!
Now the Apug community is almost ready to start-up a new film producer company... We have only to decide where to settle in the production facilities (Usa to compete with Kodak? Asia to take advantage of low labour cost? Germany to put "made in Germany" on the label? Which format? What speed? What price? If Kodak is so stupid it would be easy to compete with...
My business plan:
Production: Asia
Format: only medium and large (in 35mm competition is fierce and digital results are satisfying)
Speed: only 100 and 400 (they meet 90% of demand)
Price: 30% less than Kodak
Distribuition channel: only on-line sale whith warehouse storage in Us and Europe (no retailers, no wholesales distributors that can only mark-up prices without any service to final consumer).
Financial resources: now is the less important issue because there are many funding sources (crow-funding, private equity and venture capital funds) and interest rates are at the minimum of all time.
This is my dream.

 

[Prof_Pixel]

One of the best thread ever!
Now the Apug community is almost ready to start-up a new film producer company... We have only to decide where to settle in the production facilities (Usa to compete with Kodak? Asia to take advantage of low labour cost? Germany to put "made in Germany" on the label? Which format? What speed? What price? If Kodak is so stupid it would be easy to compete with...
My business plan:
Production: Asia
Format: only medium and large (in 35mm competition is fierce and digital results are satisfying)
Speed: only 100 and 400 (they meet 90% of demand)
Price: 30% less than Kodak
Distribuition channel: only on-line sale whith warehouse storage in Us and Europe (no retailers, no wholesales distributors that can only mark-up prices without any service to final consumer).
Financial resources: now is the less important issue because there are many funding sources (crow-funding, private equity and venture capital funds) and interest rates are at the minimum of all time.
This is my dream.

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride

 

[Paul Verizzo]

What's with Ferrania these days? Last I saw was that things were firing up about two years ago. Since then, crickets. At least to my ears.

 

[Prest_400]

What's with Ferrania these days? Last I saw was that things were firing up about two years ago. Since then, crickets. At least to my ears.

They posted an update a few days ago abot the status of their factory, which has had a few difficulties with asbestos in the building. Given the technical challenges that Colour film manufacturing has, they are doing ok with all the set up.

As the old adage says, Rome wasn't built in a Day.

 

[Xmas]

Hi Guys

got an apology looked at the Tmax 400 prices as well as the Tx - since I don't buy either at retail I had not looked.
In my local brick shop the Tmax 400 is still at last years figure. But the Tx has increased.
So 135 Tx is 10% more than Tmax 400!
Maybe the shop or KA are selling more Tx, maybe they are dumping Tmax.
If I was stuck I'd buy Tmax400 for the 10%.
The bulk ratio is Tx is about 30% more, so it is not finishing costs driving bulk but something else?

I'd only buy Kodak expired, unless there was no Ilford or Foma or adox etc.

Noel

 

[Rodinalforever]

The same in Italy, in medium format Tmax400 is 10% less than Tri-x and Tmax100 is the cheapest. I feel that Trix is the top seller, while Tmax100 is the least favourite because very often it's been offered at huge discount with short expiration date. It's a pity for my wallet because Tx is my favourite among 400 Iso and Tmax100 never impressed me.

 

[Richard S. (rich815)]

...and Tmax100 never impressed me.

Really? I know opinions vary but Tmax 100 in Rodinal is sublime.

 

[Rodinalforever]

Really? I know opinions vary but Tmax 100 in Rodinal is sublime.

I'll try Tmax100 in Rodinal soon because I've just bought some 35mm rolls that were in offer. What I like in Trix (developed in Hc110 dil H) is the tonal separation between dark areas and the mid-tones. I couldn't reach this result with Tmax100 in Rodinal since now. I expose tmx@50 because Rodinal usually loose some speed and what I see is a murkier dark area, a sort of compression in the mid-tones and a quick move to highlights (it's difficult to describe a film by words, in particular with my poor english). My developing time for Tmax100@50 in Rodinal 1+50 is 10 min

 

[Xmas]

I'll try Tmax100 in Rodinal soon because I've just bought some 35mm rolls that were in offer. What I like in Trix (developed in Hc110 dil H) is the tonal separation between dark areas and the mid-tones. I couldn't reach this result with Tmax100 in Rodinal since now. I expose tmx@50 because Rodinal usually loose some speed and what I see is a murkier dark area, a sort of compression in the mid-tones and a quick move to highlights (it's difficult to describe a film by words, in particular with my poor english). My developing time for Tmax100@50 in Rodinal 1+50 is 10 min

The tabular grain films tend to have a different toe shape from cubic grain films in their characteristic curve. You seem to have detected that
You could try either

Tmax developer or
Rodinal 1:100 for 60 minutes full stand but invert a few times at beginning for bubble removal

The full stand or the Tmax developer will separate the toe values more
But you still may not like.

You may prefer even 5222 or Ilfords cubic grain films, to Tx, and I use a lot of Foma 100 and 400.

 

[NB23]

TMax 100 was formulated with D76 in mind. Just use D76.

 

[Xmas]

So why did Kodak do the Tmax developer, they did not do a trix developer.

 

[Richard S. (rich815)]

TMax 100 was formulated with D76 in mind. Just use D76.

That works. But I'll use it in Rodinal too:
Mallard Lake GGP SF commute ContaxT2-blk 38f2-8Sonnar Tmax100 Rodinal1-50 11min30sec 20C 30secAg2x 2013-05 VSmac 4000 Scan-130524-0001 by Richard Sintchak, on Flickr

Rick's Sonoma place Rolleiflex2-8CXenotar Tmax100 Rodinal 12min 20C 30secAg 02-2009 VS 4990 Scan-090214-0009 FFw by Richard Sintchak, on Flickr

 

[Richard S. (rich815)]

NB23 is correct - D-76 was the original release developer for the TMax films. Like any other films they were designed to give excellent results with D-76. TMax developer is Kodak's PQ developer designed for higher emulsion speed than D-76 (like a Microphen or DDX type). Kodak didn't have one of these at the time. Its "TMax" name should not be taken to mean it is necessarily optimized for TMax films specifically. For all we know they decided to call it "TMax" so that it might be viewed as a TMax family member. After all, Kodak was looking for ways to get people to accept/adopt the TMax films.

Whatever the case, the TMax films work wonderfully in a wide variety of developers, and contrary to what some people say, I have found them to be very easy to use.

True that. It's all good. I like D-76 but don't always have it mixed up and once mixed only lasts about a month for me. Main reason I mostly use HC-110 and Rodinal, but as I've mentioned and many have concurred, once you get it all dialed in practically any film and developer combo are capable of terrific results.

 

[Xmas]

NB23 is correct - D-76 was the original release developer for the TMax films. Like any other films they were designed to give excellent results with D-76. TMax developer is Kodak's PQ developer designed for higher emulsion speed than D-76 (like a Microphen or DDX type). Kodak didn't have one of these at the time. Its "TMax" name should not be taken to mean it is necessarily optimized for TMax films specifically. For all we know they decided to call it "TMax" so that it might be viewed as a TMax family member. After all, Kodak was looking for ways to get people to accept/adopt the TMax films.

Whatever the case, the TMax films work wonderfully in a wide variety of developers, and contrary to what some people say, I have found them to be very easy to use.

Yes in 86 or so Kodaks benchmark developer was D76 and people who independently step wedged the Tmax films in D76 said that the toe was higher contrast than Trix or HP5.
See page 15 of Kodaks data sheet for Kodaks take on D76 v Tmax.

Kodak also say that Tmax gives better shadow quality when pushing.

If you are having problems as post #160 then Tmax is a better option.
Or Rodinal stand 1:100.

I need to use ID68 or Rodinal stand to use tabular grain film YMMV.

 

[Rodinalforever]

Beautiful images, Richard! you have managed excellently an high contrast scene with a good details in the shadows without blowing up the lights. Have you exposed Tmax100 at nominal or at lower speed (50-80)? Rodinal is superb with low speed film, I would use it in my cappuccino for breakfast too! Thanks for your advice. Thomas

 

[MattKing]

Back on subject ...

I was in my local full service camera store today (Beau Photo) and asked them about the fact that there website indicates that all their film prices are being updated, due to supplier changes that arose because of the recent currency fluctuations. I looked over their current prices, and sadly, it appears that the Ilford prices have undergone the same sort of increases that Kodak went through a couple of months ago. Their Foma films are up as well, as are Fuji.

I guess I may have to get used to paying about $8.00 CDN for a roll of 120 black and white film.

 

[robinal]

Those continuous price increases remind me of the documentary "Time Zero - the end of Polaroid film". It seems like Kodak's shareholders have decided to milk the cow. How can those people justify that bulk film got more expensive that rolls?
In 2015, Silver is back to the price of 2008-2010 and continues to fall.


Envoyé de mon iPad à l'aide de Tapatalk

 

[MattKing]

Those continuous price increases remind me of the documentary "Time Zero - the end of Polaroid film". It seems like Kodak's shareholders have decided to milk the cow. How can those people justify that bulk film got more expensive that rolls?
In 2015, Silver is back to the price of 2008-2010 and continues to fall.


Envoyé de mon iPad à l'aide de Tapatalk

My local "best" film and darkroom provider has had to deal with a whole bunch of price increases lately from all the distributors they buy from.

Factors like currency fluctuations have caused a lot of problems.

As a result, everything is now expensive - Kodak, Ilford, Foma.

Silver prices have little to do with it now. There are all sorts of other factors in play. Remember, Simon Galley has confirmed here that it costs them more to buy the backing paper for a roll of 120 film than it does to actually make that roll.

 

[NB23]

Guys, best deal on one of the BEST films on the market (according to many): TMax 400 BULK.

59.99$ from Henry's on ebay. 3 months expired.

When I see such a deal, I usually buy Three. So I purchased Three.

 

[Paul Verizzo]

Guys, best deal on one of the BEST films on the market (according to many): TMax 400 BULK.

59.99$ from Henry's on ebay. 3 months expired.

When I see such a deal, I usually buy Three. So I purchased Three.

I hear what you are saying, and that's a great price on a great film. Throw it in the freezer, good for years.

But that won't always be around as an option. We MUST look at retail prices to figure out trends and rip-offs.

In film, I've always leaned to buying and supporting The Great Yellow Father. The home team and all that. But when bulk TMY-2 is at least 50% greater than Delta 400, and more than per roll pricing, one has to come to one's senses and say, "Enough!"

Unless the price drops substantially, back towards where it should be, I'm going to Ilford as my "go to" brand. And I'm very appreciative of Foma's efforts, but I don't think their films are up to Ilford's. A good bargain, especially under the Arista.edu relabeling, but as I showed on another thread, spend another 5% and get Ilford, at least in the 120 size.

 

[NB23]

I hear what you are saying, and that's a great price on a great film. Throw it in the freezer, good for years.

But that won't always be around as an option. We MUST look at retail prices to figure out trends and rip-offs.

In film, I've always leaned to buying and supporting The Great Yellow Father. The home team and all that. But when bulk TMY-2 is at least 50% greater than Delta 400, and more than per roll pricing, one has to come to one's senses and say, "Enough!"

Unless the price drops substantially, back towards where it should be, I'm going to Ilford as my "go to" brand. And I'm very appreciative of Foma's efforts, but I don't think their films are up to Ilford's. A good bargain, especially under the Arista.edu relabeling, but as I showed on another thread, spend another 5% and get Ilford, at least in the 120 size.

I do my Ilford part. 10 Bulk Pan-F and so many different papers in the past 2 months.
400 rolls of HP5 3 years ago.
Many bulks of FP4 last year...

I'm questioning my sanity. You should see my freezer.

 

[flavio81]

and Tmax100 never impressed me.

Which speed did you use it at?