what mf slr system is likely to conitnue being repairable into the future?

[narsuitus]

MF slr sytems are getting old. Which ones do you suppose will stand the test of time and still be repairable going into the future?

Mamiya RB67 by Narsuitus, on Flickr

Mamiya RB67 6x7cm medium format SLR

 

[DREW WILEY]

A reputation for reliability, plus simply how common a brand might be for sake of spares, is just as important as repairability, which can suddenly itself change with the retirement of remaining individual repairmen, or their own stock of parts. I'll stick with the pre-II MLU Pentax 67 system. Spares are abundant and affordable, and the rig has a proven track record in terms of reliability under adverse conditions (not, not perfect; but nothing is perfect).

 

[markbau]

Simply because of high quality manufacture as well as excellent desired user qualities, Hasselblad mechanical film cameras will outlast all other MF SLR cameras.
My Pentagon died almost immediately, and that was a gift from the factory.

Anything to back up your assertion that Hasselblad's will outlast all other MF cameras? I would confidently opine that the MLU P67 (not the II) and the RB67 are the most solidly built MF's bar none. The P67 really is a tank and overbuilt in most respects.
It's funny but on these forums when the subject of Hasselblad comes up there is usually lots of talk about how easily they are repaired and how many spare parts there are. I often wonder, if they are so well built, why are their owners always talking about getting them repaired?
Another thing to be aware of, Hasselblad's sold in quite small numbers compared to the P67 and RB67 so logic tells us that there are many more of those cameras out there waiting to be used as a source for spare parts.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Anything to back up your assertion that Hasselblad's will outlast all other MF cameras? I would confidently opine that the MLU P67 (not the II) and the RB67 are the most solidly built MF's bar none. The P67 really is a tank and overbuilt in most respects.
It's funny but on these forums when the subject of Hasselblad comes up there is usually lots of talk about how easily they are repaired and how many spare parts there are. I often wonder, if they are so well built, why are their owners always talking about getting them repaired?
Another thing to be aware of, Hasselblad's sold in quite small numbers compared to the P67 and RB67 so logic tells us that there are many more of those cameras out there waiting to be used as a source for spare parts.

Available cameras, available lenses, available parts, available service.
NASA would not have invested money in the SWC and 100mm lens if NASA had found Hasselblad unreliable.

Oh yes, does your RB come with a truss?

 

[weasel]

First, I understnd that other systems other than slr's are likely to be more easily repaired, simply becaue they tend to be less mechanically complex, but im specifically asking about mf slr's.
I think that the long term repairability question hinges on several things, most of which has already been mentioned. One point I dont see mentioned, is that a lot of these camers were proffesional workhorses, and got the crap beat out of them, and that could very easily limit the pool of spare parts for scavenging. My experience over the years however, is that rarley hav cameras I have had repaired required parts. What they do require, is having someone who knows how to repair them, and that commodity is becoming rapidly scarce.

 

[Wallendo]

It is a good thing that you never took logic in school because you would have failed miserably. Repairs are based on the work done and the parts, if any needed. I have had a number of inexpensive repairs done on expensive equipment and expensive repairs done on inexpensive cameras.

You apparently didn't do much better. The price that you paid today and your personal willingness to pay for expensive repairs on inexpensive equipment has little to do with the availability of professional repair services in the future.
Long term, the few remaining repair persons will gravitate toward cameras for which people will pay a reasonable amount. The owners of premium equipment are more likely to pay more for repair than others. There will long be repairmen for mechanical Leicas and Hasseys. How many people are actually willing to pay for expensive repairs on inexpensive equipment? As the current generation of camera repairers ages and retires, is there a new generation of apprentices or padawan learners ready to take their places? There are a number of threads here on APUG/Photrio about respected repair people who have fallen behind due to health issues.
Even today, it can be difficult to find affordable repairs for some equipment. I have a Canon 7 that no-one seems to want to work on. I had no such trouble finding someone to repair my much older Leica IIIc. In the future it may be hard to find experienced people to repair brands without a premium reputation.

 

[mshchem]

I put my money on Hasselblad. I got rid of a bunch of beautiful Bronica stuff, it's really hard to find even a decent focusing screen for a Bronica. I have a beautiful RZ67 II system 2 bodies a bunch of lenses and backs. I have 2 nice late Hasselblad V system bodies, lenses and backs. For rectangles I have 3 fuji rangefinder 6x9 cameras. The Hasselblads are really easy to love.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Since there have been just so many pro MF SLR systems, it might be wise to narrow this down to more discrete format categories, like 645 vs 66 square, vs 67 options. For example, I'd find a Hassie just too small for my personal print enlargement expectations. Then there are budget considerations; you can get a damn good P67 lens for a fraction of a Hassie equivalent. Hassiephiles with their nose turned up at Pentax lenses might be shocked at some real-world comparisons. Rangefinders should be segregated into a different topic.

 

[wyofilm]

Yes..that's an easy bet...however the COST of Hass repairs will be the nail in their coffin..pros mostly abandoned MF film a decade ago recofnizing that full frame digital and current digital already outperformed film in all objective ways...

Since pros abandoned them, then I would guess that parts for repairs would be more plentiful and thus cheaper.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Oh, another digi myth intruding into an analog thread? I didn't factor that. Maybe we should revert to something SMALLER than 645 film to keep the playing field level. But I can't complain, the more pros that convert to digi, the more abundant and cheap MF film camera gear becomes for those who appreciate the advantages of actual film. Speaking of becoming rapidly obsolete and prematurely unrepairable - isn't that the very definition of digital cameras?

 

[johnha]

Something with a leaf shutter in the lens moves the most critical & precise failure point to an easily replaced lens. However, some of the early Mamiya 645s seem to go on forever. I have a very old Bronica S2a that seems to keep going. I have two P6x7s and hope they keep going (one has clearly so far survived what a dealer would describe as 'heavy professional use').

 

[GLS]

Then there are budget considerations; you can get a damn good P67 lens for a fraction of a Hassie equivalent. Hassiephiles with their nose turned up at Pentax lenses might be shocked at some real-world comparisons

I own and use both systems, and am happy to admit that the better P67 lenses compete very favourably with many of the Zeiss lenses. The latest model 55mm f4 especially is every bit as good as the 50mm Distagon, maybe even slightly better. However I tend to prefer the Zeiss style of rendering, and the build quality of those lenses, as well as their feel in use, is second to none.

 

[Alex Varas]

KW Pilot Super is not a whole MF system but it's easy to repair and a it's super fun!

 

[Bikerider]

Simply because of high quality manufacture as well as excellent desired user qualities, Hasselblad mechanical film cameras will outlast all other MF SLR cameras.
My Pentagon died almost immediately, and that was a gift from the factory.

There has been a post on another UK forum regarding problems with Hasselblad. It seems that 12on film backs are becoming hard to find and when you do find one they are advertised at quite extortionate prices up to £300 to £350. Considering most were probably used in a professional world and whilst the bodies were probably serviced who do you know services a back.

 

[guangong]

As with Leicas, not all Hasselblads were beat to crap by professionals. My friend worked in retail and whenever a physician or physician’s wife wanted a camera they wanted “the best”, which they interpreted as the most expensive. Quite often these Hasselblads, Leicas and Nikons sat unused in a closet for decades, thereby providing us with a not infrequent supply of used mint equipment.
As for frequency of repair, in a period of over 60 years I have yet had to have any Leica, Nikon or Hasselblad repaired, as opposed to CLA. Maintenance of ones tools is important.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Yeah, whenever I buy used equip, I look for stuff that was pampered in a studio, or really never used much at all, even though I intend to use it outdoors myself. Lots of Hassies got used by wedding photographers day in, day out, so you see quite a few beat up ones. There were other people who had a lot of money to throw around and just wanted ownership bragging rights, and never seem to have used them. That's the case with all kinds of nice equipment - some people actually need it, and others just collect it because they want what's allegedly the best, and there it sits.

 

[MattKing]

In my experience, the Hasselblads owned by dentists are even better than the ones owned by doctors .

 

[DREW WILEY]

Depends on what kind of amalgam they cemented the lenses with, after they drilled, scraped, and polished them.

 

[Sirius Glass]

You apparently didn't do much better. The price that you paid today and your personal willingness to pay for expensive repairs on inexpensive equipment has little to do with the availability of professional repair services in the future.
Long term, the few remaining repair persons will gravitate toward cameras for which people will pay a reasonable amount. The owners of premium equipment are more likely to pay more for repair than others. There will long be repairmen for mechanical Leicas and Hasseys. How many people are actually willing to pay for expensive repairs on inexpensive equipment? As the current generation of camera repairers ages and retires, is there a new generation of apprentices or padawan learners ready to take their places? There are a number of threads here on APUG/Photrio about respected repair people who have fallen behind due to health issues.
Even today, it can be difficult to find affordable repairs for some equipment. I have a Canon 7 that no-one seems to want to work on. I had no such trouble finding someone to repair my much older Leica IIIc. In the future it may be hard to find experienced people to repair brands without a premium reputation.

You are a real rarity of this website. I have never seen someone so consistently wrong and having no basis of facts ever. I have never paid large amount of money of any camera equipment including Hasselblads. Nor have I ever paid large amounts of money for camera or lens repairs. I have never dealt with a repairman that charged large or unreasonable prices. All of my equipment from single frame to large format combined with the darkroom enlarger, lenses, drum print dryer and large print washer begins to add up to the top of the line Nikon or Canon digital camera. But I have to admit that reading your pontifications provide great amusement. You might want to consider a career in comedy, your really can make a great belly laugh.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I could have had totally unused Hassie system and Leica SLR (not RF) gear at about 15% the new rate. There were amazing deals on top end machinery and even a yacht, all at a State-run estate liquidation auction that only a few people knew about. But I have limited funds and don't buy things just because they're a deal. I have to specifically need them. I passed up deals all the time. The State was in a fire sale mood lest the IRS get to all this stuff first, and did their own liquidation to collect delinquent taxes. The individual involved made a lot of money but didn't take care of his health, loved the very best new toys, some of which he used, and many of which he never did. He lived on the yacht, had suffered two heart attacks, and figured out how to stall the IRS and State long enough to die first, without giving up any of his toys or cash during his lifetime. Events like this don't tend to get notification far and wide. You have to have a bit of insider mentality to seek them out.

 

[John Galt]

Hasselblad V system. Specifically the C/M, NO electronics and 100% manual. Hands down. Took this advice from David Odess 3 or 4 yrs ago when I posed this EXACT question to him and never looked back.

My favorite lens is a Distagon 60mm that was made in 1959 and is ~just-beat-to-hell~. Still smooth and sharp.

 

[markbau]

Available cameras, available lenses, available parts, available service.
NASA would not have invested money in the SWC and 100mm lens if NASA had found Hasselblad unreliable.

Very poor example. I'm sure the cameras they took to the moon were very well packed for take off. How many rolls did they put through each camera? A few dozen maybe? Whilst on the moon, low gravity would mean if they were dropped they wouldn't hit the powdery surface very hard. I recall stories about how the dust got into everything but really, a camera that only had a few rolls put through wouldn't have time to get clogged with dust. Nope, if I was going on a 6 month Himalaya hike the MF camera I would take would be a P67, no question.

 

[AgX]

Even the Pentacon Six was used in space.

But to what extent was that sample identical to the samples on the market?

 

[EdSawyer]

Rolleiflex SL66 system should be pretty future-proof, at least as much as Hassy if not more. Generally better built and with less to go wrong in some cases.

 

[k.hendrik]

https://www.flickr.com/photos/77846450@N00/23957867440/in/dateposted-public/