what mf slr system is likely to conitnue being repairable into the future?

weasel · Oct 7, 2019

MF slr sytems are getting old. Which ones do you suppose will stand the test of time and still be repairable going into the future?

AgX · Oct 7, 2019

The Praktika Six is reported to have its faults developing within short time from the start. But it is rapairable...

What answer do you expect?
Most likely any device with non-generic electronics will be unrepairable once spares or donor parts have gone.
Mechanical parts may need quite an effort to replicate once spares have gone.

Maybe future will bring new means.
For mechanical parts modern prototyping already yields an alternative to classic ways of parts manufacture.

AgX · Oct 7, 2019

By the way, your question applies on most types of cameras. And better be placed at "camera repair"

What about even a 19th century plate camera with smashed front element and no spare lens?
The same problem as with modern cameras. A part must be made from scrap.

Bikerider · Oct 7, 2019

I would say that most manual focus and not electronic shutter cameras will continue to be usable for a lot longer than electronic ones. I would also suggest that even the very latest alternative imaging devices will expire after a relatively short time when compared to the likes of the Nikon F, F2, Nikkormat FT/FTn, Minolta SRT range, Pentax M42 or the mechanical K mount bodies will be around for quite a long time yet to come.

railwayman3 · Oct 7, 2019

I recall, when buying an SLR almost 30 years ago, the (old-time) dealer recommending a more mechanical model that one incorporating electronics, which were starting to be used in cameras at that time. He suggested that it would probably always be possible to make a replacement mechanical part, while it would never be possible to replicate a discontinued "integrated circuit" component. I think he has been proved right, (and not just in cameras).

I don't believe that it is possible to predict which of the "big makes" of any camera will last the best.....so much depends on care and use, and a bit of luck. (And sometimes the camera which has a hard life, maybe used daily by a professional photographer. will prove more reliable than the same one kept in a cupboard and taken out for one holiday a year...)

guangong · Oct 7, 2019

Simply because of high quality manufacture as well as excellent desired user qualities, Hasselblad mechanical film cameras will outlast all other MF SLR cameras.
My Pentagon died almost immediately, and that was a gift from the factory.

ParkerSmithPhoto · Oct 7, 2019

I pray that it's Hasselblad.

GLS · Oct 7, 2019

Hasselblad V series. No electronics to fail, extremely well made in the first place, and there are a ton of spare parts out there.

Paul Howell · Oct 7, 2019

A mechanical system, as long as you are willing to have parts machined. As 3D printing evolves might get a little cheaper. If you are looking for a system think about buying a couple of beater bodies for parts. In terms of simplicity, Mamiya TLR or Press, no mirror to contend with, very simple a folder. If you can afford the lens Hasselblad.

AgX · Oct 7, 2019

My Rule-of-Three for user film cameras of all kinds:

Use one sample, have a 2nd sample at reach as immediate substitute and a 3rd sample on reserve for spares.

runswithsizzers · Oct 7, 2019

Which models will still be functional after many others can no longer be repaired depends on a number of factors.

Cameras which are made in the greatest quantities should provide the greatest number of donor bodies for parts - UNLESS - there is some particular part which fails on all of them, especially if the failures are due to age rather than wear (plastic, rubber, etc.)

If the demand for a particular model is high enough, and people are willing to pay the price - it MAY be that commonly needed parts will be produced by small manufacturers, depending on the complexity of the part.

As an example, yesterday I replaced a broken plastic gear in my Kodak Carousel 750H slide projector, which I bought used in 1974. The first time I replaced this same plastic gear was in 2010 - and at that time, there were still a few "new old stock" Kodak gears available. Since then, the Kodak parts are mostly gone, and someone has decided there is enough demand to justify having some of these gears custom made by a third party (in the USA) using modern polymers. So my Kodak Carousel slide projector lives on, but a less desirable model made in smaller numbers might suffer a different fate.

RalphLambrecht · Oct 7, 2019

weasel said:
MF slr sytems are getting old. Which ones do you suppose will stand the test of time and still be repairable going into the future?

Hasselblad I'd assume

BradS · Oct 7, 2019

They'll all be repairable...the question is really, which will be repairable at a cost that makes economic sense? People tend to think of the electronics as not repairable. This is, of course, simply not true. Electronics are arguably easily repaired, it is often simply not cost effective to do so. Perhaps, one day, it will be for some types - especially as the size of the population of good, used equipment declines.

The other, much bigger issue is whether or not there will be qualified technicians who are able to do the repairs. Amateur repairs done by amateurs will, over time, result in decreasing supply of candidates.

Finally, the availability of repair parts, the manufacturer's commitments to continue supplying them and whether or not they'll be supplied to independent repairers will determine which makes and models survive.

AgX · Oct 7, 2019

BradS said:
They'll all be repairable...the question is really, which will be repairable at a cost that makes economic sense? People tend to think of the electronics as not repairable. This is, of course, simply not true.

I and others had it about proprietary ICs. Even in case there would be a means in future to make ICs by prototyping production technique one still would need the full algorithms to feed into. In case one had these but not the production means, one could replicate it today already on circuit boards, but adding that shebang would not go through as repair by me.

BradS · Oct 7, 2019

AgX said:
I and others had it about proprietary ICs. Even in case there would be a means in future to make ICs by prototyping production technique one still would need the full algorithms to feed into. In case one had these but not the production means, one could replicate it today already on circuit boards, but adding that shebang would not go through as repair by me.

As I said, it is possible but in many cases, simply not feasible.

For simple cases, it may very well be feasible some day. I'm thinking of relatively simple circuits (even though they maybe implemented in a custom IC today) used in relatively high end, well made cameras....the light meter PCA in the Leica M6 comes to mind (if Leica stop supplying replacements) for example.

AgX · Oct 7, 2019

The first digital IC in a camera was installed already in the AE-1 and controls practically everything.

BradS · Oct 7, 2019

AgX said:
The first digital IC in a camera was installed already in the AE-1 and controls practically everything.

Yes. Obviously, an example of that which is probably not feasible...(given the economics of today)

On the other hand, in an AE-1 "everything" amounts to what? aperture priority auto exposure? ...so, a light meter circuit, a look up table and electronic shutter speed control...is that it? Certainly it is possible...probably not feasible. Besides, many AE-1 have been discarded as garbage by now.

jtk · Oct 7, 2019

RalphLambrecht said:
Hasselblad I'd assume

Yes..that's an easy bet...however the COST of Hass repairs will be the nail in their coffin..pros mostly abandoned MF film a decade ago recofnizing that full frame digital and current digital already outperformed film in all objective ways...

jim10219 · Oct 7, 2019

A Graflex RB might be the most reliable MF SLR out there. But it's probably not what you're looking for. Though there's not much on that thing that you couldn't repair yourself.

I had a Hasselblad 500c and had to get rid of it when it broke on me. I had a lens go bad and the body. It was an early model body and the price of repair would have been more than the price of replacement. Same with the lens. And since bodies and lenses aren't cheap, I decided to switch over to the Mamiya RB67, which has proven bulletproof. And if I do have problem, parts are much more reasonable. Hell, the broken Hassey was worth more than the working Mamiya!

etn · Oct 7, 2019

GLS said:
Hasselblad V series. No electronics to fail, extremely well made in the first place, and there are a ton of spare parts out there.

+1 on this. Maybe not so much with the older C lenses, but CF / CFi look good. The weak link, as I was told by a Hasselblad specialist, are the backs. Therefore grab some for the future while supply last (and before the price goes through the roof!)

Sirius Glass · Oct 7, 2019

GLS said:
Hasselblad V series. No electronics to fail, extremely well made in the first place, and there are a ton of spare parts out there.

For the last decade Hasselblad has had the bodies, lenses, parts and service available. There are some C lens springs that are getting hard to get, but there seem to be alternative sources. One type of thing can not be gotten from Hasselblad, the 30mm Fisheye lens filter. Those filters came with the lenses and cannot be replaces especially since they are part of the optics and required. Therefore do not buy that lens without the filters.

Other MF companies have closed and have various parts and supply problems. Other than Rollei, I do not believe that there are other MF camera manufacturers still operating.

Wallendo · Oct 7, 2019

There are two ways to look at this problem.
1) Buy a respected expensive system. A higher-priced system will have higher repair costs which makes repairing these cameras financially viable for camera repairers.
or
2) Buy an inexpensive system where you can have a back-up and a parts camera

I tend to fall in the second camp. Multiple inexpensive bodies. I just have to make sure I don't grab the parts camera when I go out.

Sirius Glass · Oct 7, 2019

Wallendo said:
There are two ways to look at this problem.
1) Buy a respected expensive system. A higher-priced system will have higher repair costs which makes repairing these cameras financially viable for camera repairers.
or
2) Buy an inexpensive system where you can have a back-up and a parts camera

I tend to fall in the second camp. Multiple inexpensive bodies. I just have to make sure I don't grab the parts camera when I go out.

It is a good thing that you never took logic in school because you would have failed miserably. Repairs are based on the work done and the parts, if any needed. I have had a number of inexpensive repairs done on expensive equipment and expensive repairs done on inexpensive cameras.

Arklatexian · Oct 7, 2019

AgX said:
My Rule-of-Three for user film cameras of all kinds:

Use one sample, have a 2nd sample at reach as immediate substitute and a 3rd sample on reserve for spares.

With "all mechanical" versions from two manufacturers, Leica and Hasselblad, and possibly some Rolleis, I think having a spare "user" might be a good thing to have. I am sure (hopefully) there are others, especially in LF........Regards!

Arklatexian · Oct 7, 2019

Sirius Glass said:
It is a good thing that you never took logic in school because you would have failed miserably. Repairs are based on the work done and the parts, if any needed. I have had a number of inexpensive repairs done on expensive equipment and expensive repairs done on inexpensive cameras.

Methinks that there should be a third reason that doesn't need looking to the future, as it is already happening, especially where you, Sirius, live. That is, live in a high-population area that can support multiple camera-repair businesses rather than none, like most of us. With the constant increases in UPS and Fed-Ex, freight charges will soon amount to more than the most expensive repair charges. This, alone, can put all the "smaller" repair businesses which must depend upon "mail-order" customers, out of business. I never thought I would say this but "thank goodness for the United States Postal Service"......Regards!

what mf slr system is likely to conitnue being repairable into the future?

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