What is a good budget wide angle lens?

Dan Fromm said:

Interesting discussion and ideas. FWIW, I'm more of a cheapskate than most -- Mr. Qualls might beat me, but not by much -- and I wouldn't use a 105/4.5 Tominon for anything or any 100 mm +/- triplet or tessar type on 6x12, let alone 4x5.

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Heh. That's reasonable. I'll be honest, I picked that particular lens because A) it was cheap and B) it had a copal press. The original idea was even if the glass was terrible, I'd have a shutter. Then I discovered the aperture diaphragm isn't on the shutter. Whoops!

Even so, the lens will let me build the camera, decide if it's useful enough to get a better lens, and print a different cone. A cone is about $3 of plastic (maybe) and 5 hours of print time.

grat said:

Even so, the lens will let me build the camera, decide if it's useful enough to get a better lens, and print a different cone. A cone is about $3 of plastic (maybe) and 5 hours of print time.

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There's no disputing tastes. No sarcasm intended, good luck, have fun.

grat said:

Heh. That's reasonable. I'll be honest, I picked that particular lens because A) it was cheap and B) it had a copal press. The original idea was even if the glass was terrible, I'd have a shutter. Then I discovered the aperture diaphragm isn't on the shutter. Whoops!

Even so, the lens will let me build the camera, decide if it's useful enough to get a better lens, and print a different cone. A cone is about $3 of plastic (maybe) and 5 hours of print time.

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And wait till you try to find a cable release for that shutter.

why not ask here before you buy something that you are unfamiliar with?

Bob S said:

And wait till you try to find a cable release for that shutter.

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Which shutter are you thinking of, Bob? That lens was used on a variety of Polaroid devices, when made to be front mounted it usually went on a Copal Press #1. To my uneducated ear, grat's lens sounds like it was made for the MP-4 system and should be on a #1 marked Polaroid MP-4. I have one such in front of me, complete with cable release socket and press focus lever, that I used for front-mounting lenses until I found an affordable cock-and-shoot Copal #1.

Bob S said:

And wait till you try to find a cable release for that shutter.

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Came with one, actually, which is just the right length to reach the handgrip. Since I'll be using it as a rangefinder, I don't really need the preview cable. Even so, the shutter works with either of my regular cables.

why not ask here before you buy something that you are unfamiliar with?

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Because I try not to ask a question that's already been answered, and I'm pretty good at searching. Even better, I'm good at ferreting out the good information on the internet. I found several people saying the 75 and 90(?) were terrible, and based on that, the 105mm must be. I found three people (which I believe included you and Dan, but I won't swear to it-- I think it was a thread from around 2014) who said it must be a terrible lens, though they hadn't used it, and one person who actually had it mounted on a 4x5, and said it took reasonable pictures, but with practically no room for movements.

Since the camera in question is a fixed lens on a helicoid, with zero movements, by my math, I need > 132mm of coverage (diagonal of 6x12), and since the best guess I could find was that this lens covers about 150mm, it seemed like a reasonable option. I give a higher weight to anecdotal evidence as a rule.

I admit, I'm a novice at this-- but please don't mistake ignorance for stupidity. One of those can be cured, and before I buy any film camera, I've already researched it to the point where I know a great deal about it.

I admit, this lens was a bit of an impulse buy-- which I don't really regret, in spite of several people who've never put one of these on a 3D printed lens board (something else I've been given grief for) and mounted it on a 4x5 camera and tested (and measured) the focus and coverage, telling me what an idiot I am.

I've also noticed film photographers tend to be a highly opinionated bunch, and if you ask 5 of them for their opinion, you'll get at least 6 responses, with a high probability of the conversation being totally derailed onto a different topic by, oh, about page 3 of the discussion.

Dan Fromm said:

Which shutter are you thinking of, Bob? That lens was used on a variety of Polaroid devices, when made to be front mounted it usually went on a Copal Press #1. To my uneducated ear, grat's lens sounds like it was made for the MP-4 system and should be on a #1 marked Polaroid MP-4. I have one such in front of me, complete with cable release socket and press focus lever, that I used for front-mounting lenses until I found an affordable cock-and-shoot Copal #1.

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Yep. It's from an MP-4. I assume he's thinking of the dual-cable to work both the shutter and the preview, but as I'm planning on using this as a rangefinder-style camera, I don't really need the focus preview.

Dan Fromm said:

Which shutter are you thinking of, Bob? That lens was used on a variety of Polaroid devices, when made to be front mounted it usually went on a Copal Press #1. To my uneducated ear, grat's lens sounds like it was made for the MP-4 system and should be on a #1 marked Polaroid MP-4. I have one such in front of me, complete with cable release socket and press focus lever, that I used for front-mounting lenses until I found an affordable cock-and-shoot Copal #1.

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Copal,Press.

Ariston said:

I need coverage for 4x5, but don't necessarily need it to allow for a lot of movements. I would like something in the 90mm range, give or take, and at least f/5.6 if possible.

Any recommendations for a poor man's lens?

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When I got my first 4x5 camera setup, the seller tossed in a 90mm f6.8 Schneider Angulon for free. Although I have several other 'better' lenses now, I think that I have more better quality images from that 90mm (non super) angulon than any other. It is my go-to WA lens.
Good images, compact size, the only lens that I have which I can fold up my field camera with the lens on.

Mark

Ariston said:

fdonadio - from your post, I see a Bausch & Lomb 88mm lens on ebay I am thinking about grabbing, but I didn't want to buy it out from under you. Have you decided?

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Not really,.. still thinking. Go ahead and get it!

Bob S said:

Copal,Press.

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Bob, I have a small heap of Copal Press shutters, most non-Polaroid, sizes #0 and #1. All have cable release sockets. What were you thinking?

dirkfletcher said:

I would and I have! With affordable helical and a 3D printer why wouldn't you try? Worst case is its a complete train wreck and you are out some time and 25 bucks for a helical or best case is you end up with a cool little camera that works just fine. There has never been a better time to be a camera builder, I say build away and share your process as well as finished pics, we'd love to see what you come up with!

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I have yet to document my projects. They’re in initial stages, so I still can do it easily.

halfaman said:

I have a multicoated 90 mm f/8 Super-Angulon, normally used at f16-f22. Framing is a bit difficult with low light but image quality is outstanding. I don't think it can get any better.

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+1

grat said:

I picked up a 105mm f/4.5 Tominon lens from a Polaroid MP4-- even though it's designed as a copy stand, the lens seems to work fine for 4x5. Haven't taken any pictures with it, since I'm still building the camera (Stop me if this sounds familiar-- a 6x12 3D printed body, with a cone on the front, and this lens mounted on the cone.....).

It's also in a copal press shutter, so self-cocking, and came with a short shutter release cable, all for < $100.

I may decide it's a terrible lens, but it's good enough to get the camera working.

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The 105mm Tominon does illuminate a 5x4 screen at Infinity, as Bob S says they were designed for copy work at close distances. However Illumination is not the same as coverage which the region where the lenses achieves a reasonable level of acceptable and usable sharpness.

Bob S said:

And wait till you try to find a cable release for that shutter.

why not ask here before you buy something that you are unfamiliar with?

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Is the Copal Press any worse than the Prontor or Ibsor ? I use both without issues with cable releases.

Ian