What happened to the 12exp 35mm film

[Simon R Galley]

It really could not be simpler :

12 Exposure films would for a very few people be a 'nice' to have, not a 'need' to have, to make a 12 exposure film you need a cassette, a tub, a box, all the things, including all the labour that you have for a 24 or 36 exposure roll, you would then need a different printed cassette, a different printed box... more inventory, in other words apart from some cost saving on film it would not cost half what a 24 exposure costs, same as 24 exp v 36 exp is not 2/3rds the price and sales of a 12 exp would be miniscule, but you would not be able to buy it anyway as no reseller would buy 12 exp's as an additional mono film line to stock...

So : If a 24 exp costs $ 4.00 would you buy a 12 exp for $ 3.50 : No.

BUT : Its one of the reasons we make bulk, and will always make bulk, for customers who really do need it, they can easily make 12 exp, or less if they need it.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

 

[SLVR]

It really could not be simpler :

12 Exposure films would for a very few people be a 'nice' to have, not a 'need' to have, to make a 12 exposure film you need a cassette, a tub, a box, all the things, including all the labour that you have for a 24 or 36 exposure roll, you would then need a different printed cassette, a different printed box... more inventory, in other words apart from some cost saving on film it would not cost half what a 24 exposure costs, same as 24 exp v 36 exp is not 2/3rds the price and sales of a 12 exp would be miniscule, but you would not be able to buy it anyway as no reseller would buy 12 exp's as an additional mono film line to stock...

So : If a 24 exp costs $ 4.00 would you buy a 12 exp for $ 3.50 : No.

BUT : Its one of the reasons we make bulk, and will always make bulk, for customers who really do need it, they can easily make 12 exp, or less if they need it.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Well said simon. Being that 12 exp stuff has come and gone I'm not one looking to bring it back. But even still I completely overlooked the points you mentioned. People do have to make this stuff and supplies and resources for packaging the stuff is the same regardless of how many exposures are in a canister.

good post.

 

[amellice]

So : If a 24 exp costs $ 4.00 would you buy a 12 exp for $ 3.50 : No.

you are right, i think the solution to me would be bulk, just got my alden couple of days ago and will stop by B&H this weekend to get some HP5 and Pan F

 

[Cropline]

T max comes in 100 and 400 ISO.

 

[cmacd123]

I recall Kodak even made a colour negative in a 5 exposure roll at one time, which I believe was aimed at the Real estate agent market. Think it was called Kodak commercial Colour or some such.

110 and 126 came in 12 or 20 exposures, and 135 came in 12, 20, or 36 expsures when I first got a 35mm camera in the 1960s although I understand that before I was born Kodachrome came only in 18 exposure rolls. The 20 expsure rolls grew to 24, and many of the one time cameras come with a 27 exposure roll. (even the Illford one time use.)

 

[alanrockwood]

One more vote here for the real estate explanation.

 

[Roger Cole]

Yes, at one time 35mm film came (only, as far as I was aware then anyway) in 20 and 36x. Later the 20s became 24s and this seems to memory to be about the same time the 12x rolls came along.

Now Freestyle lists Foma, their house brand of Foma (Arista EDU) Ilford Delta 100 and 400, FP4+ and HP5+, Kentmere 100 and 400, and Kodak TMX, TMY-2 and TXT all in 24 exposure loads.

I understand Simon's points of course and no, I wouldn't pay nearly as much for 12. OTOH, I do find 12 exposures in my Yashicmat 124 to be ideal for many situations, or maybe the 15 in my M645. Those are great for just walking around to see what I see worth photographing. The longer rolls in 35mm come in handy when shooting ongoing events - most recently Mardi Gras parades in New Orleans. For that I'd have liked to have had 72 at times! But for the most part I do find 36x too much.

 

[Simon R Galley]

We did try 72 exposures of HP5 : On a polyester base... complete with a special processing tank, in fact I think we may still have some... not our finest hour !

Simon. ILFORD photo / HARMAN technology Limited

 

[TheToadMen]

We did try 72 exposures of HP5 : On a polyester base... complete with a special processing tank, in fact I think we may still have some... not our finest hour !

Simon. ILFORD photo / HARMAN technology Limited

Put this in a half frame camera and you can shoot like forever! I would like to make a short series like this when my daughter turns 18 next month: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9Et7UQh1tg#t=16
(I'm refurbishing a Nikon F3 as a gift)

@Simon: You could send me some rolls, please, for my Pen FT to experiment with



Bert from Holland
http:/thetoadmen.blogspot.nl

 

[trythis]

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=381204353212

Still available: 1000 rolls for sale. Other volumes available.



Typos made on a tiny phone...

 

[TheToadMen]

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=381204353212

Still available: 1000 rolls for sale. Other volumes available.



Typos made on a tiny phone...

Including taxes and shipping costs about $1 a film. Not bad for 24.000 shots with my Olympus Pen-FT.
It could become an 8 hour movie when shooting 45 frames per minute non-stop

But ... wait ... I forgot the extra costs for another freezer ....
And a (there was a url link here which no longer exists) to develop it as a B&W film ...

 

[OptiKen]

This thread prompted me to pickup a cheap bulk loader from ebay and a roll of Ultrafine B&W 400ASA with a dozen empty spools from Photo Warehouse.
I'm thinking of starting off with some 20 exposure rolls and maybe some 12 exposure rolls. I may have to start buying my chemicals in bulk soon too. (haha. I'm kidding...I don't shoot more than 6-12 rolls a month....probably closer to 6 than 12 and those are mixed between 35mm and 120, color and B&W)

 

[perkeleellinen]

I would like to make a short series like this when my daughter turns 18 next month: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9Et7UQh1tg#t=16

That's great. 9600 prints!

 

[Roger Cole]

We did try 72 exposures of HP5 : On a polyester base... complete with a special processing tank, in fact I think we may still have some... not our finest hour !

Simon. ILFORD photo / HARMAN technology Limited

I remember; I was shooting a fair amount of film then. I never tried it but my friend did. I remember him commenting he needed a step ladder to hang it up to dry. Canceled due to damage to motorized cameras with the tough polyester base, wasn't it?

I confess I had the same thought then - load it in a half frame camera and shoot all year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk and 100% recycled electrons - because I care.

 

[Xmas]

Oh dear a nostalgia attack.

as well as cassettes and frame numbered bulk they used to do

Daylight loads
Darkroom loads
Pre cut bulk

the leader end came punched with e.g. 'HP3' pattern of holes

Never could afford Kodak.

Seems like yesterday.

But if you need short today use an Exakta two cassettes and cut a 36 after 12 when the residual is about 20.

 

[cmacd123]

We did try 72 exposures of HP5 : On a polyester base... complete with a special processing tank, in fact I think we may still have some... not our finest hour

the only time I could actually buy some was on the clearance from freestyle. Bought ten rolls, the special Stainless steel tank and a couple of the plastic reels to fit a regular stainless tank. Think I still have a couple of now faded rolls in my freezer. (hp5 gradually fogs even frozen after that length of time) worse when I moved in 1994 I managed to lose the stopper for the big stainless tank, the last time I used it I had to close the funnel opening with with Gaffer tape. annoying as the big tank will take a long roll of regular film while the plastic reels are stuffed with the special thin film, and will not take regular stock.

I did use one roll in my Ricoh Auto Half, and sent it out as my darkroom was not working at the time, commercial lab sent me the thickest envelope of prints the camera store had seen.

The cassettes for the "Motor drive" film were the regular Agfa/Ilford style of re-loadable cassettes (same as the regular film at the time), but they had some adhesive on the end caps so they would not have the lid popping off it they got dropped.

 

[unwantedfocus]

Found this

 

[GregY]

I don't ever remember seeing 12 exp (B/W) rolls in Canada, although i saw them when i lived in Japan for a time.

 

[faberryman]

I began photography in 1973 and do not remember ever seeing a 12 exposure rolls of 35mm film. But I have learned from this thread that they did exist at least for some time in some places. I think 126 cartridges were 12 exposure. Maybe 110 too. Flash cubes came in 12 exposures, 3 cubes of 4 flashes each. If you are shooting half-frame, 12 exposure rolls yielding 24 exposures might be just right.

 

[Agulliver]

I did occasionally use 12 exposure Fuji Superia 100....for...umm..."glamour" photography.

I am sure the market was limited to people like estate agents who would need to shoot and process a small number of exposures quickly. Those markets have all-but disappeared, and as SImon Galley explained in 2015 the actual cost of manufacturing a 12 exposure roll isn't much less than that of a 24 or 36 exposure roll.

This is part of the reason why I bulk roll B&W film. Not only is it cheaper, but I can roll 16 or 18 exposures for a night at the jazz club, or 36 for the summer holiday....or 6 to test a new camera.

 

[Kodachromeguy]

We did try 72 exposures of HP5 : On a polyester base... complete with a special processing tank, in fact I think we may still have some... not our finest hour !

Simon. ILFORD photo / HARMAN technology Limited

We had a discussion about this a few months ago. I remember Leica offering a special back for their R4 camera to fit this 72-exposure film around 1982 or 1983. But AgX and I could not find any literature or advertisements listing a part number for this 72 back.

I remember 12-exposure film and even some 15-exp film ("3 extra shots free").

 

[Paul Howell]

When Photowarehouse had Ultrafine Ex 100 and 400 in stock 12 exposure rolls were available, when I worked at Motophoto part time in the 90s they sold a lot of Lucky and house brand Motophoto color to real estate agents. I load 12, 8 exposures from bulk loads. The 8 exposure rolls are expensive considering the lead and tail it takes to bulk load a roll, I use them to shoot zone in 35mm.

 

[MattKing]

I remember (IIRC) seeing 5 packs of 8 exposure 35mm film - packaged for the real estate market, and not available at your local camera store except by special order.

 

[eurekaiv]

I have a wide variety of 12exp rolls I picked up for next to nothing in the late 00s, that I keep on hand specifically to run through half frame cameras.

 

[foc]

Back in the 1990s, I processed a lot of 35mm film for estate agents (realtors). They didn't want to pay the slightly lower price for 12 exp so I sold them 36 exp. Then I offered to cut the film in camera (in a dark box) cut a new tongue and reload the camera for them.
I offered a small discount on the price of development ( priced at 12 exp).
They were happy, I was happy and I had repeat customers ( none of the other minilabs would do this ).