What effing universe is this?

mcrokkorx said:

.... but I'm not sure why Nikon FM3a price trends are surprising to anyone. It was never a bargain camera, not even during the great digital selloff market a decade ago. It was always a limited production, high-value, collectible trinket for Nikon enthusiasts....

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Jeez...exagerate much? I remember back in the early 2000's when the Nikon FM3A was available 'new' from the usual suspects. It retailed for something like $579 and was seen by most as the next logical progression in Nikon's long line of enthusiast SLR's. Yeah, sure the shutter was a novel but very mild innovation - nothing magical just the natural combination of the FE and FM into one product. The price was very reasonable and completely within the reach of the target market. In short, the reality is/was quite different from your narrative.

I'll just make do with my FE2.

mcrokkorx said:

..

Of course that begs another question: why exactly the once-popular FE/FE2 are now frowned upon for having electronic shutters, while the equally electronic F3 (with its absurdly awful meter display) is still a highly prized cult item....

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Having owned all those cameras, it's because the Nikon F3 is far more reliable than the FE series, far better built, has a brighter 100% viewfinder, fits better in the hand, looks better and is just nicer to use.
The FE has a better exposure readout but you get used to the one in the F3 very quickly.
My FE2 failed - it started to give erratic shutter timings and I've seen others do that. Unless the F3 is really abused they tend to keep working.
Also the motor winder on the FE series does not compare to the motordrive on the F3, if that's your thing.

But really, think about what you are asking. When Nikon released the F3 it was the best film camera they ever made. The FE was offered at the same time....

Huss said:

Having owned all those cameras, it's because the Nikon F3 is far more reliable than the FE series, far better built, has a brighter 100% viewfinder, fits better in the hand, looks better and is just nicer to use.
The FE has a better exposure readout but you get used to the one in the F3 very quickly.
My FE2 failed - it started to give erratic shutter timings and I've seen others do that. Unless the F3 is really abused they tend to keep working.
Also the motor winder on the FE series does not compare to the motordrive on the F3, if that's your thing.

But really, think about what you are asking. When Nikon released the F3 it was the best film camera they ever made. The FE was offered at the same time....

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And the F3 has a red stripe on the grip. We can't forget about the red stripe on the grip. Nothing says professional like a red stripe on the grip. None of the FM or FE models had a red stripe on the grip. Come to think of it, I'm not sure they even had grips.

How absurd this ad is
,...even compared to Leica asking prices

BradS said:

Jeez...exagerate much?

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Jeez, jump on people much for expressing an opinion different from yours? I've been around as long as you, and also remember the debut of the FM3a: it was absolutely promoted by Nikon and received by the photographic press as a publicity stunt (a very nice and usable stunt, but a stunt). Nikon seemed far more interested in selling the profitable new 45mm pancake lens along with it as a kit than selling the FM3a by itself. It was their reluctant mea culpa response to the unexpected firestorm of negative blowback they received after discontinuing the beloved mechanical FM2n due to slowing sales. Despite no longer being profitable, Nikon had miscalculated the goodwill value of being the last supplier of an affordable, all-mechanical manual focus SLR (and what the reaction would be to killing it). They couldn't bring it back at its popular below-$400 price, so they had to come up with something to justify a higher price: that something was combining the advantages of FE2 and FM2 in a single body.

You're recalling the original $579 FM3a pricetag with rose colored glasses: that price went over like a lead balloon with potential buyers who needed a replacement for their FM2n (the roughly $400 price of FM2n had spoiled them by remaining unchanged for years). Quite a few of those potential buyers had zero interest in paying 40% more for an AE feature and analog needle readout they didn't want: they preferred the manual LED display of the FM/FM2. Very low FM3a production volume led to spot shortages, dealer gouging, and premature collector hoarding early on. That got sorted out after a while, but the FM3a remained a niche prestige product that didn't see its value plummet during 2007-2014 like every other more-common Nikon. Its a great camera but was not made in enough numbers or sold to enough different types of user to create a large pool of used examples in various conditions and price points similar to the FE2 or FM2. Scarcity makes it collectible, esp in Asia where the unique hybrid shutter is a must-have for any Nikon shelf. If that feature is important to a photographers work, unfortunately they'll need to pay a significant premium over the FE2/FM2 to get it.

Huss said:

But really, think about what you are asking. When Nikon released the F3 it was the best film camera they ever made. The FE was offered at the same time....

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Yes, of course the F3 was the pro camera, tougher build, 100% view etc. I'm not speaking of the 80s when the cameras were current and sold primarily to their intended market segments, I'm thinking of today where mechanical is all the rage and hipsters look down their noses with disdain at anything with an electronic shutter. So its interesting they make an exception for the F3, and will pay quite a lot for one, mostly because the F3 is iconic enough to compensate for the offense of being electronic. While the FE2 (that was still wildly popular just a few years ago) is now a pariah. Doubly interesting, because once they get past the obligatory discussion of its hybrid shutter, the most praised FM3a feature among vloggers is its analog needle meter display- taken directly from the FE2, which is weirdly persona non grata despite being identical in handling/use to the FM3a.

The reliability gap between F3 and FE/FE2 has been narrowing as supplies of "dentist-owned" F3 bodies have dwindled. We're seeing a lot more F3s on the market with defects now (one good whack to the rewind knob area can create a world of repair woes). OTOH, some common FE/FE2 issues have been deconstructed, and relatively simple DIY fixes posted. Personally I prefer my F2AS and FM manual exposure and LED display, but if a photographer prefers having the AE option and needle/scale readout the FE/FE2 shouldn't be dismissed out of hand just because its electronic. At the moment, they're probably the best deal going in classic Nikon manual focus bodies.

My experience with unreliable FE2s makes them undesirable to me.. pretty much the only way to make an F3 unreliable is to smack it hard on the rewind knob. And that was solved w the P and Ti models, even though it was still rare for that to happen.
On the other hand my FEs just failed w no need for any outside physical trauma. At this point in time that makes them an avoid camera. Same thing w the Minolta CLE, Contax G, Konica RF…

Well, this is my first (and only) FE2, so the jury is still out re: reliability, but the same could be said for all my old electronically-controlled shutter SLRs. I like it because it's compact and light, though I cannot see 100% of the viewfinder with eyeglasses. I haven't decided whether I will keep it long term.

GarageBoy said:

Which 16/s16 cameras were actually the high end cameras? Arri 416?

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Yeah, ARRI, Aaton, Panavision (rental only), and a few older makes such as Mitchell. The Mitchell 16 still is the queen of the sixteens, running at up to 128 frames per second with register pin, 235 degrees shutter open angle, the rackover precision focusing system, a four-lens turret, and 1200-ft. magazines, if wanted.

Yes it seems the FE2 has a weak point, the spring which is connected to the aperture ring on the lens mount gets very weak. The path of the spring is the problem and I believe this will happen to any new spring, but the good news is that it will take years.

Simple fix but top plate needs to be removed. Looks like an engineering Problem, poorly designed. Quite stupid because a better design of the spring path, like any other Nikon, would have cost 0$.

Otherwise, the FE2 is a great camera. Zippy, solid.