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Velvia 50 4x5 and 8x10 and Fujicolor 160NS Professional 120 discontinued

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B.S.Kumar

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Fujifilm today announced that Velvia 50 4x5 and 8x10 and Fujicolor 160NS Professional 120 has been discontinued.
Sales are expected to end on these dates:
Fujicolor 160NS Professional March 2022
Fujichrome VELVIA50 4 x 5 March 2023
Fujichrome VELVIA50 8 × 10 December 2021

The official announcement is here: https://www.fujifilm.com/ffis/ja/news/92

Kumar
 

jrhilton

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Thanks for sharing the info and I see it is a press release just out today.

If google translate is correct they say "However, because it became difficult to procure some of the raw materials used for production, we have no choice but to discontinue production and sales.".

Suggestion to use Velvia 100 as a replacement for V50 - suggesting that supply of V100 will continue.
 

Henning Serger

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So right now Fuji does not have any color negative film in 120 or in sheets, just two color slide films (Provia and Velvia 100) and one B/W film (Acros). All ISO 100... Wonderful! :sad:

No, they have three colour reversal / transparency films in 120:
- Provia 100F
- Velvia 50
- Velvia 100.
All of them are also available in 35mm.
And Provia 100F is also available in 4x5" and 8x10". Velvia 100 is available in 4x5" as well.

Best regards,
Henning
 

mooseontheloose

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I just saw this. Disappointing but not surprising. Although I like shooting Fuji colour film I rarely shoot it (in any flavour) anymore, and certainly not in sheet film sizes.
 

Helge

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How can I never have heard of Fuji Pro 160 NS?
Seems like a wonderful film? Reviews are scarce.
How does/did it stack up to Ektar/Portra 160?
 

Alan Edward Klein

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Velvia 50 in 4x5 was only available for purchase in Japan until now, not the USA. Does that condition remain effective until Mar 2023? Will you Kumar still be providing it until then on special order from Japan? Do you see prices going up or steady?
 

brbo

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The often mentioned plan on imminent introduction of new Fuji emulsions is proceeding... wonderfully.

I guess.
 

Helge

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But Velvia 100 has chemicals that have been outlawed by US regulators.
The purest rarified BS.
Love Fuji and their film. Everybody should buy some right now. Provia is probably the greatest colour film ever.
But the excuse with regulations is horse shit.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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The purest ratified BS.
Love Fuji and their film. Everybody should buy some right now. Provia is probably the greatest colour film ever.
But the excuse with regulations is horse shit.
Although regulations might be silly regarding Velvia 100, it's going to get hard to buy and process in a lab unless Fuji changes the chemical makeup.

In any case, I'm more upset about Velvia 50 in 4x5 which I like better than Velvia 100.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanklein2000/50570908936/in/album-72157715763486212/
 

destroya

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looks like they are down to their last master roll. hopefully I'll get a chance to order a few more 4x5 V50 boxes before the prices go over $250 a box. gonna have to start deep freezing provia now. Just hope fuji hunt keeps producing e-6 chems

john
 

fdonadio

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Just hope fuji hunt keeps producing e-6 chems

Yep, and also that Fuji Hunt USA imports. Here in Brazil, our local Fuji Hunt subsidiary decided to stop importing the chemistry all together, while Fuji Film still imports film. Go figure!
 

richyd

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How can I never have heard of Fuji Pro 160 NS?
Seems like a wonderful film? Reviews are scarce.
How does/did it stack up to Ektar/Portra 160?

I don't shoot so much C41 but preferred the Fuji offerings. I would have used more if they continued to produce it. 160NS was the latest formulation but they stopped in sheets a while ago and 120 in international markets for sometime so I didn't bother as that has been their playbook; stop selling internationally, retreat to domestic until the last master runs out then announce discontinuation. Doesn't look good for any reformulation of 400H.
 

Moose22

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How can I never have heard of Fuji Pro 160 NS?
Seems like a wonderful film? Reviews are scarce.
How does/did it stack up to Ektar/Portra 160?

I've used it. You mostly have to get it from Asia, though a local character has been buying cases and reselling on ebay so I got to give it a try.

I like it. It's more portra than ektar, meaning a less saturated film that looks better on skin tones. Grain is good, honest and not distracting, not quite as low grain as Portra 160 but still low grain. The colors are almost classic Fuji, really nice in pastels, not quite as warm a tonality as Portra. It reminds me a bit of the fuji films I shot in the 90s, though it's sharper. Speed is honest, I shoot at box speed -- I shoot Portra 160 at 100, pretty much all color Kodak I expose +2/3 stop -- and get good scans.

I can't say I like it more than Portra, and haven't bought a bunch of it. But I'd happily shoot it if it were easily available. I am disappointed it is going away, really, just because it's a working alternative to Kodak, and now we're out of color negative film alternatives. I still had hope supply chain resolutions would allow a reintroduction (like Acros) but... well, I'm not so sanguine now. Supply chains are pretty porked, and will be for a while. I'd hate for Fuji to just give up on film all together, but here we are.
 

Henning Serger

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How can I never have heard of Fuji Pro 160 NS?

Don't ask us :wink:. Because we have been talking about this film for years here on photrio.

Seems like a wonderful film? Reviews are scarce.
How does/did it stack up to Ektar/Portra 160?

Yes, it is an excellent film. As to expect from Fujifilm.
I have used it both in my daily photography, but of course also included it in my scientific film test programme. In the tests the sharpness was on a similar level as Portra 160 (and much better than Ektar), but resolution and fineness of grain was a little bit worse compared to Portra 160 (resolution again better than Ektar, grain a bit worse). But I had to use the 100x enlargement to evaluate the difference between Portra 160 and PRO 160NS. In 120 format you won't see that small difference at the normal enlargement factors for prints.
Color balance is neutral to slightly warm. A little bit more neutral than Portra 160. But the differences in scanning (due to hardware, software and scan operater preferences) or filtration with optical prints are making probably a more significant difference. Especially in scanning where you have a significant flexibility concerning colour rendition and certain manipulations.
I have also always got excellent results at box speed with PRO 160NS.

But I neither use it or Portra 160 in 120 anymore, because with Provia 100F I get much better results at much lower costs:
Provia 100F provides:
- much better sharpness than PRO 160NS and Portra 160
- much higher resolution
- finer grain
- all the above also when exposed at EI 200/24° with push 1 processing (Provia is brillant at that speed, too, and also pulled at EI 50/18° or 64/19°)
- much better colour brillance
- the unique "3-D" and "real-life" effect only transparency film can offer in projection and on the lighttable under an excellent loupe
- much much better reciprocity characteristics; it is really a league of its own for color film in that regard, no other film comes close
- the much better flexibility in usage / end results / imaging chains reversal film generally offers (negative film can only be printed or scanned, with transparencies you have more options)
- much lower overall costs, as the film itself is significantly cheaper, and no expensive or time consuming scans are needed with Provia compared to 160NS, Portra etc.

Best regards,
Henning
 

Henning Serger

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But Velvia 100 has chemicals that have been outlawed by US regulators.

Keep calm, carry on. And if you like Velvia 100, just continue to use it. Buy it from Europe, Asian countries or Japan.
As Fujifilm has clearly said, the amount of the critical (due to EPA) substance in the product is only less than 0.0003%. So it is negligible, and does not harm the environment.
Develop it either by yourself, or contact an excellent lab. Some labs have already said that they will continue processing. I would ask AgX Imaging in Sault St. Marie, they have an excellent reputation and very reasonable prices.

Best regards,
Henning
 

Henning Serger

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May the ghost of Kodachrome haunt you forever!

As a former Kodachrome user I don't miss it at all. Because Provia 100F, the Velvias, Astia 100F, Sensia, E100G, E100 etc. all have surpassed Kodachrome 64 in all aspects.
Before Kodachrome 64 was discontinued I did a last test run of it in my test lab, with my standardized film test.
As an example the direct comparison to Provia 100F:
Provia 100F has
- much better sharpness
- much higher resolution
- much finer grain
- better latitude and dynamic range
- more natural, neutral, accurate color rendition
- much better pull- and push capabilities
- much much better reciprocity characteristics
- much better color stability when exposed to light (my Kodachromes I have viewed regularly in projection and on the lighttable have all very visible colour fading, whereas my E6 transparencies of same age are all fine)
- much lower costs
- can by easily processed at home.

The E6 technology with its modern films is simply much superior to the Kodachrome technology. Period.

Anyway, I have not been able to find fresh stock of 35mm E6 anywhere for under $20 US.

Provia 100F is 16.99$ at B&H, Velvia 50 is 18.99$ at B&H. Most probably in stock again when ships are unloaded.

Best regards,
Henning
 

Moose22

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But I neither use it or Portra 160 in 120 anymore, because with Provia 100F I get much better results at much lower costs:
Provia 100F provides:
...
- much lower overall costs, as the film itself is significantly cheaper, and no expensive or time consuming scans are needed with Provia compared to 160NS, Portra etc.

While I don't disagree that Provia is a fantastic film... I mean, I LOVE Provia SO much. You're missing a couple of things and reaching for a couple more.

As for costs, the slide film costs more -- especially in 135, where it's $5 a roll more expensive, but even in 120 where my last box cost me $50ish and Portra 160 cost me $44. The developing costs more, and I still have to scan because I have no way of projecting 6x8 slides, nor will anyone ever see them. Kind of a shame as they are pretty incredible in a way that the computer doesn't quite replicate. I like just looking at the slide itself, which is weird, but it's not like I can get others to do so. Thankfully it scans very easily, and I have gotten some great lab prints from Velvia and Provia shots. But that's just the way it is. For me, the price is 5%-15% more for slides, even including time.

Likewise, when shooting, the negative films have significantly more dynamic range. Especially Portra, which is insanely kind to highlights. 160NS was no slouch there, either, and I think did nicer in shadows than Ektar when slightly underexposed, so again it was a really good negative film for some things I shoot. I'm often shooting in changing light, or doing street shots, or using some stupid camera without a meter and playing with shadows... my exposures might be all over the place and I cannot do that comfortably with Provia. With Portra I can always err a stop high and get away with it. This usually determines when I shoot negatives vs slides, more than cost.

I think I have a dozen rolls of 160ns left, just because I bought it a couple of 5 packs at a time. That'll last me plenty, I'm sure, as I don't shoot that much color 120 and have a 5 pack of each Kodak film in the fridge too. But this is still disappointing news.

I now worry about Fuji one day killing the slide films. Outisde of dynamic range considerations, Provia is very much a perfect color film.
 

Moose22

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Oh, another thing:

Don't ask us :wink:. Because we have been talking about this film for years here on photrio.

- all the above also when exposed at EI 200/24° with push 1 processing (Provia is brillant at that speed, too, and also pulled at EI 50/18° or 64/19°)

I'm going to have to try this! Next time i shoot slides I'll shoot at 200 and push. Sometimes that extra stop is helpful.
 

George Mann

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As a former Kodachrome user I don't miss it at all. Because Provia 100F, the Velvias, Astia 100F, Sensia, E100G, E100 etc. all have surpassed Kodachrome 64 in all aspects.

I respect you for the work you have done, but technical aspects are not what made K14-64 special. It was the way it rendered the atmosphere of nearly anything it captured!

Ektachrome and Provia are splendid films. I shoot both.
 
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Henning Serger

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While I don't disagree that Provia is a fantastic film... I mean, I LOVE Provia SO much. You're missing a couple of things and reaching for a couple more.

As for costs, the slide film costs more -- especially in 135, where it's $5 a roll more expensive,

I have to disagree. I am using about 150 to 250 rolls of film p.a. And lots of it being colour film. As I am not a rich person, I must have an eye on costs. And that is why I am using much more colour reversal film than colour negative film. The overall costs per shot (for the final, finished picture) are lower for me with reversal film, both in 135 and 120 format (in 120 the difference is bigger).
That is based on prices here in Germany / Europe (but prices e.g. at B&H for Fujichromes are even less than here).

but even in 120 where my last box cost me $50ish and Portra 160 cost me $44.

Here in Germany it is just the other way round: Provia 100F 120 is significantly cheaper than Portra 160, Ektar, Portra 400 and 800.

The developing costs more,

Not necessarily. And even if, the difference is often negligible. Not only with home processing (which is very easy and cheap), but also with some professional labs. Here in Germany the leading prof. lab is charging less for E6 compared to C41. For example in the US AgX-Imaging is charging only 8$ for E6 processing. A very competive price to C41 of other prof. labs. In lots of countries there are prof. labs who offer E6 at very reasonable prices. Mostly the long established, very experienced labs.

and I still have to scan because I have no way of projecting 6x8 slides, nor will anyone ever see them. Kind of a shame as they are pretty incredible in a way that the computer doesn't quite replicate. I like just looking at the slide itself, which is weird, but it's not like I can get others to do so. Thankfully it scans very easily, and I have gotten some great lab prints from Velvia and Provia shots. But that's just the way it is. For me, the price is 5%-15% more for slides, even including time.

For projection of 6x8 transparencies, just do yourself a favour and buy a Jensen medium format projector: It can be used for slides up to 6x9cm, and the quality is absolutely outstanding!! Pictures just like from another world!!
Pictures on computer monitors are looking like total crap in comparison to slide projection with excellent slide projectors. Extremely low resolution, no real half tones, totally flat (no "3-D" pop like in slide projection), inferior colour brillance.
Fo showing others your 6x8 slides besides projection: I am regularly organising film photographer meetings. And I always have a Kaiser slimlite lighttable with me ( https://kaiser-fototechnik.de/de/produkte/index.php?s=381 ). They are very light and compact, and have in-built rechargeable battery. Light quality is excellent. And I have one of my outstanding Schneider-Kreuznach slide loupes with me.The other photographers are always very excited and amazed by the quality, and the easy use for viewing.

Likewise, when shooting, the negative films have significantly more dynamic range.

Dynamic range is not a problem at all if you are using the right technique, and having good equipment. I am often using reversal film in high-contrast situations.
For example in landscape photography using a polarizing filter, neutral gradual filters and / or pulling Provia gives me more than enough additional DR to get excellent results.
And for asthethic reasons we should be aware of the fact that too much DR is often reducing the quality of a picture, as it becomes too flat and lifeless. Deep(er) shadows and brillant highlights quite often add "power" and impact to a picture.
I do also quite a lot of portrait and fashion photography outdoors. And have to deal with harsh light. No problem at all with reversal film using diffusors and reflectors, and my modern film cameras (like the F6) with fill-in flash. Which gives outstanding natural results in high-contrast situations when you reduce the fill-in power additionally by about 1.7 to 2 stops (for Provia, a bit less for Velvia).

The problem is today that most photographers - including those using film for decades - simply don't know the incredible possibilities modern film camera and flash technology offers. You can expand your creative possibilities so much. And it is so easy. But 99% of film photographers simply don't know it. I permanently see that in the workshops I offer.

Best regards,
Henning
 

braxus

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(Moderator's note: post moved from duplicate thread)
I know these films havent been available in North America for quite a while now, but it seems Fuji is discontinuing it all together for all markets. This was posted on a Fuji Forum on Facebook, with a link to a letter from Fuji themselves. So if you have been getting sheets of Velvia 50 from Japan, now would be the time to stock up on the last of it. Same with Pro 160. Looks like Kodak might be the last one standing when it comes to color films in 4x5.

Reason sighted was lack of perticular components to make it.
 
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