Update on Efke/Adox Film and Paper

[Donald Miller]

This is intended as a followup to an earlier thread about the availability and distribution of Efke film and paper here in the US.

I have researched this and the same films and papers that were formally available under the Efke brand and also the Nuance paper that is distributed by JandC will continue to be distributed by that company. There will be some differences. The primary difference is that Efke film will carry the Adox brand. This is not a problem since these were the same film from the outset.

The second change is that the film will be subjected to an intensive inspection in Europe prior to acceptance from the manufacturer. This will materially reduce the quality control issues that a few of us experienced in the past.

The Nuance brand paper will continue as before. No changes here since Nuance is a brand name that JandC chose.

I have no alliance with JandC. I have purchased materials from Freestyle in the past. My only interest in reporting this is that I have a strong loyalty to the folks at JandC born from the excellent customer service that I have received from them over the years that I have used their products.

I just wanted to inform those who may wonder about the availibility of their favorite films and paper.

 

[dphill]

Thanks for taking the time and reporting the news Don.
It clears up some confusion. Not that the announcement would keep me from buying from either store.
My dealings with both J&C and Freestyle have been very pleasant. I am very glad to be able to buy product from both stores.

Dan

 

[Amund]

Aha, that`s great news!

 

[Alicouscous]

The second change is that the film will be subjected to an intensive inspection in Europe prior to acceptance from the manufacturer.

Absolutely no infos about this on the forum from Fotoimpex, owner from Adox Brand .

 

[noseoil]

Donald, thanks for the clarification in your post. To read Freestyle's recent post, it would seem they managed to corner the market here in the states. I have also had good dealings with both John & F/S, but my loyalties remain with John. He did stick his neck out when he might not have chosen to, with the market shrinking as it did a few years back. Bottom line for me is that we all have more choices in film & paper availability now, which was not the case 5 years ago. Nice to see the "big guys" having to chase the little guys for a change. Best, tim

 

[Jim Chinn]

Thanks Don for getting a clarification. I was hoping J&C would still be selling Efke under the Adox banner. Good to see the paper will remain as part of the inventory as well. My concern with Freestyle being sole distributor wolud be their willingness to stock all the sizes that J&C keeps in inventory.

 

[lowellh]

Mr. Chinn, your concern about Freestyle's willingness or ability to support and maintain inventories of film and paper is UNFOUNDED. Because of their foresight and interest in maintaining inventory of these products is why manufacturers like Forte, Foma, Kentmere, Fotospeed, and even Ilford are elated to supply Freestyle with everything they can to meet the ordering levels Freestyle does. I know that at this point several of them have even added second shifts and are looking into expanding production lines to meet this demand. Without Freestyle's interest, several of these manufacturers would, along with Kodak, be out of the B & W business.
The only reason that Freestyle, in the short term, would not be able to supply a product or specific size, is because the manufacturer cannot make it and ship it fast enough to meet the demand. The reason that they will not be able to maintain this level of support would be that "you" stop ordering these products.

 

[sunnyroller]

Mr. Chinn, your concern about Freestyle's willingness or ability to support and maintain inventories of film and paper is UNFOUNDED. Because of their foresight and interest in maintaining inventory of these products is why manufacturers like Forte, Foma, Kentmere, Fotospeed, and even Ilford are elated to supply Freestyle with everything they can to meet the ordering levels Freestyle does. I know that at this point several of them have even added second shifts and are looking into expanding production lines to meet this demand. Without Freestyle's interest, several of these manufacturers would, along with Kodak, be out of the B & W business.
The only reason that Freestyle, in the short term, would not be able to supply a product or specific size, is because the manufacturer cannot make it and ship it fast enough to meet the demand. The reason that they will not be able to maintain this level of support would be that "you" stop ordering these products.

I think Mr. Chinn was referring to the unique sizes that J&C carries in some products--I believe they are "special order" arrangements that J&C has with Adox.

 

[Aggie]

I know that at this point several of them have even added second shifts and are looking into expanding production lines to meet this demand. Without Freestyle's interest, several of these manufacturers would, along with Kodak, be out of the B & W business.
The only reason that Freestyle, in the short term, would not be able to supply a product or specific size, is because the manufacturer cannot make it and ship it fast enough to meet the demand.

Where are you getting your data to support these claims? All I've heard is that they are reducing production at some facilities. That and a snag in obtaining materials to manufacturer the film with in the first place. It would be interesting to get your sources and hard facts to back this up.

 

[lowellh]

Hello Aggie:
These are not claims but fact. As a supplier and manufacture of chemistry to our industry in the U.S., world wide and specifically, Freestyle, I have both first and second hand contact with these manufacturers listed and others. Because of the Freestyle "demand", several of these manufacturers have been able to get their governments to support them and aid their emergence for bankruptcy.

 

[jd callow]

Based upon this thread and the one recently posted by Freestyle the bottom line is:

1) J and C as well as Freestyle will continue to carry these products, albeit under different labels.

2) The manufacturers may be experiencing an upswing in business

3) Both J and C and FS support APUG and it appears that the B & W community (including APUG) supports them.


4) There appears to be some friction hiding under the surface

 

[Jim Chinn]

Mr. Chinn, your concern about Freestyle's willingness or ability to support and maintain inventories of film and paper is UNFOUNDED. Because of their foresight and interest in maintaining inventory of these products is why manufacturers like Forte, Foma, Kentmere, Fotospeed, and even Ilford are elated to supply Freestyle with everything they can to meet the ordering levels Freestyle does. I know that at this point several of them have even added second shifts and are looking into expanding production lines to meet this demand. Without Freestyle's interest, several of these manufacturers would, along with Kodak, be out of the B & W business.
The only reason that Freestyle, in the short term, would not be able to supply a product or specific size, is because the manufacturer cannot make it and ship it fast enough to meet the demand. The reason that they will not be able to maintain this level of support would be that "you" stop ordering these products.

I just vistied the Freestyle website and found Efke only in sizes up to 8x10 and no mention of anything larger in the coming soon comments. I will email Freestyle to see if they do intend to stock ULF sizes or other non 120 roll fim sizes. It seems to me that Freestyle wants the cream of the volume sales from 4x5 and 8x10 without the hassle of stocking larger sizes. If this is indeed the case I would strongly urge APUGers to purchase Efke (Adox) film in any size from J&C.

J&C has done a lot of work in importing these films, stocking all formats and in the process encouraged a lot of new growth in ULF giving confidence to photographers that films will be available. In a small way I think they probably had an impact the recent Ilford and Kodak ULF film offerings by demonstrating new and growing demand for LF sizes. If J&C did not exist I doubt you would ever see Efke in anything larger than 8x10 in the US from any distributor.

I have no problems with Freestyle and have bought materials from them in the past. They are only doing what any good company would do and that is try to get market share of the most profitable and liquid formats.

 

[Aggie]

Hello Aggie:
These are not claims but fact. As a supplier and manufacture of chemistry to our industry in the U.S., world wide and specifically, Freestyle, I have both first and second hand contact with these manufacturers listed and others. Because of the Freestyle "demand", several of these manufacturers have been able to get their governments to support them and aid their emergence for bankruptcy.

We most likely talk to the same people. This is not what I've been hearing. That is why I would like real facts not just your say so of what and who you might be. Everyone here knows me.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

For those who may not be aware, lowellh is Lowell Huff, proprietor of Clayton Chemicals.

 

[Aggie]

For those who may not be aware, lowellh is Lowell Huff, proprietor of Clayton Chemicals.

That explains a lot from what I've read when he posts at photo.net. As they say, "Very interesting" now if I could only add that old chinese sounding accent from the old Chan mystery movies.

 

[Mark Layne]

Based upon this thread and the one recently posted by Freestyle the bottom line is:

1) J and C as well as Freestyle will continue to carry these products, albeit under different labels.

2) The manufacturers may be experiencing an upswing in business

3) Both J and C and FS support APUG and it appears that the B & W community (including APUG) supports them.


4) There appears to be some friction hiding under the surface

The point to remember is that Freestyle once offered these products, dropped them, and it was J and C who made them available again

 

[Papa Tango]

Moving soon?

David, would not this thread be more cogent in the Product Availability forum?

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

David, would not this thread be more cogent in the Product Availability forum?

It certainly would.

 

[wy2l]

I have purchased film from J&C in the past, and will buy more in the future, but here's what I found when visiting their web site:

35mm Efke/Adox 25: In stock
35mm Efke/Adox 50: Not in stock
35mm Efke/Adox 100: Not in stock
35mm Kodak 400TX: Not in stock
35mm Fuji (any kind): Not in stock

120 Efke/Adox 25: Not in stock
120 Efke/Adox 50: Not in stock
120 Efke/Adox 100: Not in stock
Kodak 400TX: Not in stock
Kodak 400 TMAX: Not in stock
120 Fuji (any kind): Not in stock

It is difficult to patronize a firm that has no stock.

Kris

 

[roteague]

Well, J&C is going through some changes now. They seem to be pretty stable in their stock generally.

 

[Donald Miller]

Well, J&C is going through some changes now. They seem to be pretty stable in their stock generally.

I think that Robert makes a valid point. As I look back over a several year relationship with JandC, I have experienced out of stock conditions a couple of times. These were relatively short periods as I recall.

In the same period, I have purchased other products from Freestyle and while the purhases have not been as frequent or as intensive, I have experienced problems with out of stock and shipments sent to the wrong address.

I am not tooting anyones horn on this. I am just stating that as much as we would like perfection in our supplilers that doesn't always happen. The question that remains for me is how is the problem resolved when it arises? In all of these instances they have been resolved much to my satisfaction.

 

[SteveH]

Bleh. This whole discussion is pointless now; it turned into something that it shouldn't have.
Buying film from X or Y is like photography...Like my friend Bill would say:

"...There's no right or wrong, only what you prefer, and what really works for you..."

 

[DeBone 75]

Adox Film

For what it worth, this is a interesting read: go to site
http://www.adox.net/about_adox.htm

 

[jandc]

I have purchased film from J&C in the past, and will buy more in the future, but here's what I found when visiting their web site:

35mm Efke/Adox 25: In stock
35mm Efke/Adox 50: Not in stock
35mm Efke/Adox 100: Not in stock
35mm Kodak 400TX: Not in stock
35mm Fuji (any kind): Not in stock

120 Efke/Adox 25: Not in stock
120 Efke/Adox 50: Not in stock
120 Efke/Adox 100: Not in stock
Kodak 400TX: Not in stock
Kodak 400 TMAX: Not in stock
120 Fuji (any kind): Not in stock

It is difficult to patronize a firm that has no stock.

Kris

I have lots of Kodak 400 Tmax in stock, 5x7, 11x14, 7x17, 8x20 and 12x20. Nobody else does.

I have:

3 different flavors of 2x3 in stock
2 different flavors of 3x4 in stock
2 different flavors of 4x10 in stock
4 different flavors of 5x12 in stock
4 different flavors of 7x17 in stock
etc etc etc, who else has that?

I could go on, but while the glass might only be half full, it certainly isn't half empty.

 

[foto-r3]

Having several sources to go to is a good thing, certainly.

To be fair, it should be noted that several of the ADOX products mentioned in a previos post as being "not in stock" were not available from the manufacturer for some time.

As noted elsewhere, trans-Atlantic logistics and 1- to 2-month leadtimes on production cycles in the case of some mfgs. may lead to temporary shortages from time to time.