Tri-X v HP5+ and Tri-X v Delta 400 - The Naked Photographer Comparison Tests

[john_s]

Having quickly read through the Crawley article, his main experience seems to be that ILFORD DELTA 400 and HP5+ are closer in performance than he expected, although I'm not sure the criteria are fully explained.

What I got from the articles was that measurements are vital to evaluate certain parameters but at the end of the day, it is doing the best prints possible that is the deciding factor.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Don't insult anyone. State your disagreement with their point, give your ideas, and move on. Getting into a pissing contest just ruins the discussion for everyone else.

 

[Tom Kershaw]

it is doing the best prints possible that is the deciding factor.

I suspect prints are more reliable than film scans for comparison. Black & white film doesn't always scan that well.

 

[Zathras]

I can intermittently post technical details and raise question marks about methodology rather quickly while just taking breather breaks from other tasks. Call it multi-tasking if you wish. Fiddling around to post web images would be disruptive to my schedule. I am highly involved in images. It's called printmaking, and might not be synonymous with what some people here regard as a common denominator of visual information. So be it. People who are seriously interested in samples of my work can arrange an appointment somewhere. I'll even frame it prior to shipping. Tire kickers not welcome.

If others like to share pictures on the web, that's fine. But where is there any rule stating it's mandatory to participation on this particular forum?

Drew, of course it ain't mandatory to post yer pitchurz on the forum. However, all of your pontification, outright dismissal of
others and their methods and the very condescending tone of many of your posts, coupled with your refusal to share examples
of your work, does nothing for your credibility here. If I were as adept in photography as you claim to be, I would happy to share
that knowledge and examples of my work with others. I know that I'm not "God's Gift To Photography", never will be and that's
just fine with me. Consider me "unworthy", if you wish, your approval or disapproval means nothing to me. That is all I have to
say on this matter.

 

[removed account4]

Drew, of course it ain't mandatory to post yer pitchurz on the forum. However, all of your pontification, outright dismissal of
others and their methods and the very condescending tone of many of your posts, coupled with your refusal to share examples
of your work, does nothing for your credibility here. If I were as adept in photography as you claim to be, I would happy to share
that knowledge and examples of my work with others. I know that I'm not "God's Gift To Photography", never will be and that's
just fine with me. Consider me "unworthy", if you wish, your approval or disapproval means nothing to me. That is all I have to
say on this matter.

Zathras
I think you share the sentiment of a lot of people who have over the years asked DREW to post something, *anything* that would show that he really exists and isn't a 13 year old girl poaching her neighbor's internet, but it doesn't interest him, so we just have to either put him on ignore and not read his insults and condescending posts and hard words to say about people who are fauxtographers and whatnot, or just realize that he is a known quantity that just does what he does, you know with a website on the wayback machine (that is easy to find ) but doesn't show the nuance of his work, but it really doesn't say more than Michael Scarpetti's website, or Flickr stream said about him, so like many I have DREW on ignore most of the time because I'm tired of his insulting and harsh commentary, and typically know he's going to say he's too busy or too involved with photography or making cibachromes or ilfochromes or making some 40x60 masterpiece that can only be seen by appointment, to post an image or two to show he exists more than just the harsh posts he makes....
its a sad day when the harsh people win and good people leave this site...

 

[Zathras]

Zathras
I think you share the sentiment of a lot of people who have over the years asked DREW to post something, anything that would show that he really exists and isn't a 13 year old girl poaching her neighbor's internet, but it doesn't interest him, so we just have to either put him on ignore and not read his insults and condescending posts and hard words to say about people who are fauxtographers and whatnot, or just realize that he is a known quantity that just does what he does, you know with a website on the wayback machine (that is easy to find ) but doesn't show the nuance of his work, but it really doesn't say more than Michael Scarpetti's website, or Flickr stream said about him, and like many I have DREW on ignore most of the time because I'm tire of his insulting and harsh commentary, and typically know he's going to say he's too busy or too involved with photography or making cibachromes or ilfochromes or making some 40x60 masterpiece that can only be seen by appointment, to post an image or two to show he exists more than just the harsh posts he makes....
its a sad day when the harsh people win and good people leave this site...

I couldn't agree with you more. I've been here for quite a while and found that the good generally outweighs
the bad, but every so often I get annoyed and have to vent. Unfortunately, I remember Scarpitti and his drivel,
and that of a few other characters over the years. I joined APUG years ago because it had a far less toxic
atmosphere than the rec.photo newsgroups I was following at the time. That's mostly the same today except
that we'll never be completely free of the self appointed "experts" and other spewers of toxic bile. I haven't put
DREW on my ignore list yet, but I'm sure it'll happen soon. I do not feel that he has ever truly contributed
anything positive to this forum. I don't know if I really have either, but I at least subscribe to give a modest
amount of financial support since I think that a place like this is desperately needed in the photo world.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

...we just have to either put him on ignore...

There's likely a continuous stream of new visitors here and at the Large Format Forum for whom I have too much concern to do that. Instead, I read his posts and decide whether they're innocuous babble or potentially false/misleading. In the first case, I just move on. In the other situations, I aggressively, persistently reply until his nonsense is effectively refuted. See post #185 above for a link to one thread in which I did just that.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Don't waste your time, whoever you are. I am quite happy to have put certain individuals on permanent ignore. I don't need your endorsements. In fact, that would be a liability, a minus. Serious discussions are welcome, even when we disagree. Mindless name-calling is not. You've never even met me. And I'd like to keep it that way.

 

[Zathras]

Don't waste your time, whoever you are. I am quite happy to have put certain individuals on permanent ignore. I don't need your endorsements. In fact, that would be a liability, a minus. Serious discussion are welcome. Mindless name-calling is not. You've never even met me. And I'd like to keep it that way.

Oh GROW UP Drew! How predictable and pathetic...

 

[BradS]

...DREW to post something, *anything* that would show that he really exists and isn't a 13 year old girl poaching her neighbor's internet...

I don't see why it matters.
What difference would it make if the member posting as DREW WILEY is a 13 year old girl hiding in her basement, poaching the neighbors internet? The posts from that individual are consistent, often entertaining sometimes very informative - doesn't matter what their identity is. Same goes for posting or not posting one's photos. Posting photos or not...doesn't matter. There is no correlation between posting examples of one's work and the usefulness or relevance of their commentary.

as an example, there is a member her who posts beautiful photographs in the gallery but whose posts are consistently completely insipid. No correlation between value of words posts and photos posted.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Zathras
I think you share the sentiment of a lot of people who have over the years asked DREW to post something, *anything* that would show that he really exists and isn't a 13 year old girl poaching her neighbor's internet, but it doesn't interest him, so we just have to either put him on ignore and not read his insults and condescending posts and hard words to say about people who are fauxtographers and whatnot, or just realize that he is a known quantity that just does what he does, you know with a website on the wayback machine (that is easy to find ) but doesn't show the nuance of his work, but it really doesn't say more than Michael Scarpetti's website, or Flickr stream said about him, so like many I have DREW on ignore most of the time because I'm tired of his insulting and harsh commentary, and typically know he's going to say he's too busy or too involved with photography or making cibachromes or ilfochromes or making some 40x60 masterpiece that can only be seen by appointment, to post an image or two to show he exists more than just the harsh posts he makes....
its a sad day when the harsh people win and good people leave this site...

I bought a 90mm Nikkor SW f/4.5 large format lens from Drew for my new 4x5 camera. I also bought his Schneider IV Center Filter that mates with the lens, So he's a real photographer who uses sophisticated equipment. Also, if you check his comments, you realize immediately that he has to have deep knowledge of the subject to answer so technically, not something a 13 year-old girl would know nor most photographers here on the forum. Of course, it's your right to disagree with him. But his answers do reflect a lot of experience. My suggestion is to set aside his strong personality reflected in his posts and pick out the pearls of his wisdom and experience and leave the rest.

While I'd like to see his work too, he chooses not to be bothered . That's his choice.

 

[Zathras]

I bought a 90mm Nikkor SW f/4.5 large format lens from Drew for my new 4x5 camera. I also bought his Schneider IV Center Filter that mates with the lens, So he's a real photographer who uses sophisticated equipment. Also, if you check his comments, you realize immediately that he has to have deep knowledge of the subject to answer so technically, not something a 13 year-old girl would know nor most photographers here on the forum. Of course, it's your right to disagree with him. But his answers do reflect a lot of experience. My suggestion is to set aside his strong personality reflected in his posts and pick out the pearls of his wisdom and experience and leave the rest.

While I'd like to see his work too, he chooses not to be bothered . That's his choice.

Then why does he bother to participate in these groups? It seems to me that he needs to feel good about himself
by publicly putting other people down.

I don't doubt that he knows a lot, but does he really need to be so unpleasant, dismissive and condescending to
people who are merely trying to learn something new or help someone out? I think that there are many other
people out there with equal wisdom and experience who are much more gracious and sharing than DREW. I'll
avail myself to their wisdom and experience, leaving the more masochistic among us to "pick out the pearls of his wisdom
and leave the rest." It sounds too much like a suggestion to pick the corn out of his turds, to me!

 

[removed account4]

Posting photos or not...doesn't matter. There is no correlation between posting examples of one's work and the usefulness or relevance of their commentary.

to me, and I am sure to a lot of people here in matters to see someone's work to know where they are coming from. its one thing to talk the talk and its another thing to walk the walk. others like you Brad, maybe it doesn't matter? his posts are just entertaining about how he does all sorts of color processes, has a hoard of cibachrome materials, does things photographically us rubes can't even begin to understand, rubs elbows with every billionaire in California installing his 30x40 high end artworks in custom frames that cost as much as a imported car &c but to me ( and others ) it matters a lot.

My suggestion is to set aside his strong personality reflected in his posts and pick out the pearls of his wisdom and experience and leave the rest

I don't have the time to read his harsh and insulting posts to get a pearl of wisdom.

im glad you are well disciplined.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Take what you need and ignore the rest.

 

[Zathras]

Take what you need and ignore the rest.

There are still a lot of other equally good sources of information out there, Alan. For me, this makes DREW unnecessary
and redundant. I guess I've pretty much said all I have to say about him. Time to move on to something more positive.

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

How about adding a new feature to the website where a user can put a set of other users in two way ignore list? Whoever in that list doesn't get to see my posts and threads. I think somebody suggested this feature some time ago.

 

[MattKing]

This thread has more than run its course.
If anyone has direct contact with Greg Davis, I know I'd like to hear from him.