TMX & Rodinal examples

[Chuck_P]

Can anybody name any fine art photographers websites that use this film developer combo? Maybe some of your own sites have some fine prints that I can look at.

Thanks

 

[df cardwell]

Rodinal makes a very long straight line negative from TMX, holding 14 to 16 stops,
it can also make an S shaped curve, raising the shadows and lowering the highlights, if you use minimal agitation techniques.

I am certain you won't see any any signature of this combination online. 72 dpi is far to coarse to show anything.

Rodinal has been a favorite developer for TMX since the film replaced Panatomic X.

 

[Lee L]

I was not very impressed with TMX when it first came out and the lab I worked in used TMAX developers according to the initial published instructions for processing it. I took in my own bottle of Rodinal and gave the lab tech who did our B&W processing by hand in small tanks specific instructions on dilution, agitation, and times. After a few runs we had it where I was happy with the results. It didn't quite have the acutance of Panatomic-X + Rodinal, but it was nice in its own right.

I haven't used it much since, but it's in my repertoire, and I think a very nice combination. Rodinal with fine grain films is not what you might expect from reading the grain phobic posts on the internet.

I'll second Don's take. I have an old print from the first version of TMX that I might be able to scan if time allows, but it won't show you grain or sharpness on the web, only tonality if I do the scan carefully.

Lee

 

[Ian Grant]

Rodinal & Tmax100 (or APX100) was always a common combination with fine art photographers in the UK back in the late 80's and 90's. I used Tmax100 in 35mm, 120 & 5x4 and always found the results were superb.

The highest quality images I've every seen from 35mm were shot with Tmax 100 or APX100 and Rodinal, the combination of fine grain, tonality and sharpness is very impressive.

Ian

 

[Shawn Dougherty]

check out Mark Citret's work. He talks about it in his writing/essay section... or maybe in an interview. It's there somewhere.
www.mcitret.com

I've done some work with that combo with good results but quit using it due to the UV inhibitor. Never no when I'll want to make some alt process prints.....

 

[jim appleyard]

I'm not a TMax fan at all, but the best images I got from this film were done with Rodinal.

 

[Jerevan]

check out Mark Citret's work. He talks about it in his writing/essay section... or maybe in an interview. It's there somewhere.
www.mcitret.com

Citret is one of my favourite photographers. Here's the quote from his homepage:

"He generally uses T-MAX 100 film in 4x5 Readyloads and develops the film using a 1:49 dilution of Agfa Rodinal with nine minutes duration for normal development, and a 1:149 dilution at 12 minutes for his “-3 development.”"

And here's the actual page: http://www.mcitret.com/reviews/index.html

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

TMX and Rodinal is a great combination. Like Ian, I used it and APX100 (when it was available) for almost all my 35mm work. Now I'd use Pyrocat, which is also extremely nice and stains beautifully. But then again, I don't use TMX anymore, so kind of a moot point.
I remember TMX and Rodinal as extremely sharp, beautiful tonal scale, and above all easy to print.

- Thomas

 

[Lee L]

Another important excerpt from the Coggins article on Citret concerning his "-3 development" method quoted by Jerevan above, and the required exposure adjustment:

Citret employs the technique whenever he finds a situation where the range is more than five to six Zones. In addition to a development modification, the technique also requires a change in exposure. To capture adequate detail in the shadows, Citret places them in Zone V or VI—which is, of course, a much higher placement on the scale than they would normally receive. Citret has dubbed the technique “-3 development,” which initially was a reference to its use in handling situations with three Zones beyond the printable scale. He now uses the technique regardless of the number of Zones he is compensating for, anywhere from one to four or even more.

Lee

 

[pgomena]

TMX in 120 and Rodinal 1:50 was the first combination I tried when TMX was first introduced. I liked that Rodinal gave the images a little more bite than T-Max developer. It was a good combination. I don't use TMX any more, so it's not something I've tested recently.

Peter Gomena

 

[Shawn Dougherty]

Another important excerpt from the Coggins article on Citret concerning his "-3 development" method quoted by Jerevan above, and the required exposure adjustment:



Lee

I e-mailed Mark at one point and he sent me a nice write up about his n-3 procedure. A very nice fellow and fine photographer. I ended up abandoning this approach in favor of semi-stand but it does work as he says....

 

[df cardwell]

Citret's work is beautiful. His technique is halfway to minimal agitation. He is already achieving the shoulder induction from reduced development (by lowering the concentration of Rodinal). He is probably also reducing the amount of agitation relative to the total development time, which for decades led us to believe that the effect was caused by dilution.

Reducing the agitation further and increasing the development time would allow us to give normal exposure, while maintaining the highlight compression. Rodinal is a good developer for this because it normally builds an equally strong midtone and highlight contrast. TMX is also a good film for this.

This graph shows the effect of reducing the agitation of Rodinal with TMX,
compared to the normal curve. We are actually pushing the shadows and pulling the highlights, and allowing the curve to pivot in the midtones.

Lorenz and White talked about this in The New Zone System Manual in the '70s, about the same time Adams was discussing dilute HC-110 to reduce highlight density without sacrificing shadow density. Nothing is new except our understanding of old technique.

.

 

[Chuck_P]

Shawn,

Thanks for the link to Citret's site---I actually have not heard of him before so I look forward to exploring his site over the weekend.

 

[Chuck_P]

Citret's work is beautiful. His technique is halfway to minimal agitation. He is already achieving the shoulder induction from reduced development (by lowering the concentration of Rodinal). He is probably also reducing the amount of agitation relative to the total development time, which for decades led us to believe that the effect was caused by dilution.

Reducing the agitation further and increasing the development time would allow us to give normal exposure, while maintaining the highlight compression. Rodinal is a good developer for this because it normally builds an equally strong midtone and highlight contrast. TMX is also a good film for this.

This graph shows the effect of reducing the agitation of Rodinal with TMX,
compared to the normal curve. We are actually pushing the shadows and pulling the highlights, and allowing the curve to pivot in the midtones.

Lorenz and White talked about this in The New Zone System Manual in the '70s, about the same time Adams was discussing dilute HC-110 to reduce highlight density without sacrificing shadow density. Nothing is new except our understanding of old technique.

.

It looks like the mid-tones are robust with these curves; I would be curious to see where they lie on the n-3 curve. I'm going to have to get me some Rodinal and check it out. I am inquiring about it for sharper, more defined grain than what I'm getting with d-76 1:1 and what I recently found with hc-110 (h), although I believe hc-110 is better than d-76 1:1.

Thanks for all the responses.

 

[df cardwell]

Definitely more acute than HC-110 and D-76 1+1.

TMX is very flexible. It earned a bad rap for being hard to control,
mainly from folks who expected Tri X. Great stuff.

 

[chriscrawfordphoto]

There you go. All TMX in Rodinal. All shot with 120 film. The Square ones were done with a Mamiya C330F and 80mm f2.8. The others were done with a Mamiya 645 Super with 80mm f1.9 lens.

 

[df cardwell]

cool

 

[Chuck_P]

I really like the one of the old church (I guess it's an old church) the best.

Thanks

 

[chriscrawfordphoto]

I really like the one of the old church (I guess it's an old church) the best.

Thanks

Thanks,

It is a church, and unfortunately it is gone. Torn down to build a shopping center.

 

[pgomena]

Hard to argue with great results. Great images, Chris!

Peter Gomena

 

[Chuck_P]

I guess I have to drive all the way to New York to get some Rodinal :rolleyes:------their website says they can't ship it, it has to be purchased in the store.

Where are people getting their Rodinal?

 

[Lee L]

Try APUG sponsor Freestyle

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/sc_search.php?rfnp=30&q=rodinal&rfnc=301&

Ground shipping only.

Lee

 

[mhanc]

TMX-2 400 and Rodinal ??

________________________________________________________________

I really like this look. I have been using TMX-2 400 and am now wondering how it would do in Rodinal. I do a lot of available light, handheld shooting. Anyone have experience with this combination?

 

[Shawn Dougherty]

TMX is very flexible. It earned a bad rap for being hard to control, mainly from folks who expected Tri X. Great stuff.

I couldn't agree more. I'd still be using it if it weren't for the uv blocker.


I'll post a couple examples when I get home from work tonight. Shawn

 

[Russ Young]

Chris-

Wonderful seeing! I grew up across The River in Kentucky and many might say the same about it. There is great material in the Midwest for those not in a hurry and with heightened powers of seeing.

Fine work, technically & aesthetically. Keep it up.

Russ