Things you had to learn the hard way

[Chris Lange]

A smartly placed word, a glass of whatever you're drinking and a glass of whatever he or she's drinking at a good bar will probably get you better pictures than spending more money on cameras will.

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

Quit worrying about cameras. Use the camera you have, get to know it so its use is instinctive, and it will get out of the way and making images will no longer be about using a camera but instead recording a vision.

 

[removed account4]

the whole one camera one lens, one
and one developer, on film really isnt a load of BS ...
if you get a deeper understanding of your camera,lens, ( seeing )
and what a developer is capable of you will probably be miles ahead of the
folks who change cameras lenses, formats, films, developers like other folks
change their pants ...

 

[DREW WILEY]

Should have started with 8x10 to begin with, instead of gradually working my way up to it. Now I'm planning the downhill... so will probably
gradually devolve back to 4x5, back to MF, back to.... You come into the world wearing diapers and go out that way; begin photography with
35mm and probably end that way too... Oh well, not yet. The 8x10 is still in my backpack for tomorrow...

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

Should have started with 8x10 to begin with, instead of gradually working my way up to it. Now I'm planning the downhill... so will probably
gradually devolve back to 4x5, back to MF, back to.... You come into the world wearing diapers and go out that way; begin photography with
35mm and probably end that way too... Oh well, not yet. The 8x10 is still in my backpack for tomorrow...

Drew- I do think it is the extremely rare individual who starts with 8x10 - unless you have a very gifted mentor to help you get started with borderline ULF, most people don't have the skills to start there - they need to learn basics like exposure control, focusing and composition.

So another lesson learned - don't be ashamed or afraid of where you are on the learning curve just because you are or are not using a particular piece of equipment - it's called a learning curve for a reason.

 

[Bill Burk]

I get what Drew's saying. I wish I'd picked up 4x5 sooner because I would have enjoyed having a variety of HABS/HAER quality images from the hauntings of my youth. As it was, I have clear photographs because I put in a solid effort... But most of it's 35mm.

 

[removed account4]

Drew- I do think it is the extremely rare individual who starts with 8x10 - unless you have a very gifted mentor to help you get started with borderline ULF, most people don't have the skills to start there - they need to learn basics like exposure control, focusing and composition.

So another lesson learned - don't be ashamed or afraid of where you are on the learning curve just because you are or are not using a particular piece of equipment - it's called a learning curve for a reason.

actually ... it wouldn't be as hard as you might think if the person started with paper instead of film
it would be cheap as dirt and a lot of fun, and using paper instead of film would force the learner to
pay attention to lighting conditions 100x more than using a small camera to start with.... because
different times of the day. seasons of the year the amount of blue light changes ... it would be like
starting with wet plate or dry plate off the bat, which would be a bad idea ether ( sorry for the pun )
if the end user is more interested in those things than they are in silver gelatin film ... i wish i started
with a large negative camera and paper before anything else, but i started with 127 + 126 film ...
cause a 5 year old kid with a 4x5 or 8x10 would have been a carnival act ...

 

[pdeeh]

Do we think Fox Talbot et al should have started with smaller formats?
Why is it so often said that beginners must start with small things? Adults are not children

 

[markbarendt]

If she dumped you for an unguarded word, the she wasn't the right one. We go through life saying the wrong things at the wrong time. If your partner can't take that, she's not your partner.

I agree.

 

[John Koehrer]

Don't sneeze on your negatives.

 

[miha]

there are no shortcuts.
learn the basics and after
you have a good foundation
dont be afraid to experiment
and break rules ...
also a hard lesson to learn is
a lot of people on the internet seem like experts
but often times they arent as expert as they seem
so take internet-advice with a large grain of salt.

How true. I have learned 95% of technical aspects from books written in the 50s, 60s and 80s. Than came the internet forums and for a short while half of what I've learned seemed wrong.:eek:

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

Do we think Fox Talbot et al should have started with smaller formats?
Why is it so often said that beginners must start with small things? Adults are not children

Y'all missed my point - starting off with 8x10 is not a BAD thing, IF you have someone to teach and mentor you along the way. BUT, if you start the way 99% of photographers start, teaching yourself with a camera and a book, or just a camera and dropping off your C-41 at a minilab, then starting with an 8x10 would be a massive hurdle and deter probably 99% of the folks who start casually. Yes, Daguerre and Fox-Talbot and Niepce and all those early pioneers started with large format cameras, but they were far from typical folks - they were profoundly driven tinkerers, scholars, scientists and engineers (and then there was Daguerre, who was a set designer for theaters who just got really really lucky) who not only paid attention to things like composition and lighting, but were capable of figuring out de-novo what an f-stop was and how to use it. And just for the record, Fox-Talbot's "mousetraps" were not much different in size from modern 6x9cm roll-film cameras. He wasn't hauling around an 11x14 to make his experiments. And Daguerre's original camera was roughly 6x8 inches - not a pocket camera to be sure, but also not a mammoth camera either.

I'm not suggesting people shouldn't investigate and explore all that the photographic world has to offer - by all means please do! That's what helps keep things like large format and alternative process photography alive. But I'm just saying don't regret starting with small format cameras if that's where you started. Most people would be so intimidated by an 8x10 if that was the first ever camera they were handed that they'd not even try.

 

[removed account4]

How true. I have learned 95% of technical aspects from books written in the 50s, 60s and 80s. Than came the internet forums and for a short while half of what I've learned seemed wrong.:eek:

nothing like the interweb, eh ?
filled with "experts with no credentials"

 

[BradS]

check that the zippers are all zipped up on your camera backpack **before** picking it up.

Dad was right.

if the chemistry isn't there, it never will be and if it is, it will not go away...even after she's gone.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Things learned the hard way... Just about everything.

Some things that come to mind are things I keep re-learning!

1) Without a glass carrier, negatives move at unexpected times
2) Spent Batteries leak when left in equipment
3) Rechargeable batteries become unusable if they are unused
4) ISO 400 film fogs even in the freezer and is not worth 'stockpiling'
5) Freeze/thaw of opened containers of film causes unexpected marks at unexpected times
6) 90% isopropyl alcohol removes lettering on some lenses
7) Cyanoacrylate glue fogs clear plastic
8) Poorly fixed negatives can deteriorate in a decade
9) The gray border on prints made on old paper look bad when compared to prints made on fresh paper.
10) Underexposed negatives can be difficult or impossible to print well
11) The smaller and lighter the camera, the higher the minimum hand-held shutterspeed
12) Uneven exposure (as in sluggish second shutter curtain and uneven enlarger light source) are very difficult to dodge or burn back to normal.

+1 on 8)

 

[drkhalsa]

Just read this on the cap of a bottle of tea: "There is only one thing more painful than learning from experience and that is not learning from experience." Archibald MacLeish

 

[cliveh]

Do we think Fox Talbot et al should have started with smaller formats?
Why is it so often said that beginners must start with small things? Adults are not children

I take it this is a joke?

 

[pdeeh]

Hardly.
However TheFlyingCamera's response was well made and well taken

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

The first large format camera that I owned was an 8x10". I'd tried 4x5" once and had used smaller formats for many years, but the 8x10" felt more intuitive than 4x5" to me at first. The size of the image on the glass was the same as the negative and the same as the print, and it was about the size of a letter-sized sheet of paper. I could see clearly what the movements were doing without relying on calculations or a loupe, though I would check focus with a loupe after setting the camera by eye. After I knew what I was doing with 8x10", the smaller formats made more sense.

 

[removed account4]

The first large format camera that I owned was an 8x10". I'd tried 4x5" once and had used smaller formats for many years, but the 8x10" felt more intuitive than 4x5" to me at first. The size of the image on the glass was the same as the negative and the same as the print, and it was about the size of a letter-sized sheet of paper. I could see clearly what the movements were doing without relying on calculations or a loupe, though I would check focus with a loupe after setting the camera by eye. After I knew what I was doing with 8x10", the smaller formats made more sense.

using 8x10 and larger is a dream because of exactly what you said ... you can SEE what is going on ...
its too bad there isn't an 8x10 viewer for 4x5 cameras like a giant fresnel or magnification screen that enlargers
the ground glass to make it so 4x5 users don't need to use a loupe to see what is going on .. kind of like an extension back
just for viewing ... ( with no hot spots )

 

[Maris]

using 8x10 and larger is a dream because of exactly what you said ... you can SEE what is going on ...
its too bad there isn't an 8x10 viewer for 4x5 cameras like a giant fresnel or magnification screen that enlargers
the ground glass to make it so 4x5 users don't need to use a loupe to see what is going on .. kind of like an extension back
just for viewing ... ( with no hot spots )

There is something like it! My +6D magnifying spectacles make a 4x5 screen look as big as a 10x12.5 inch screen. And the 8x10 screen looks as big as 20x25. Wow!

 

[Tinykin]

Learning the hard way has taught me
Always have a ceremony of checks just before leaving the house. Mine is GPW&K. Glasses/Phone/Wallet&keys or 1234.
Also, I have checklists on a notice board for, Gym/sportshall, Photo venture, Business trip.
I keep the lists on the board as otherwise I wouldn't know where to find them when needed.

About always looking back before leaving a scene; I once asked a hotel receptionist about the nearest shop that I could buy a charger for for my phone as mine was faulty. She turned around and picked up a carton box full of chargers left by guests over a short few months. She said, "take your pick"

 

[Nathan King]

check that the zippers are all zipped up on your camera backpack **before** picking it up.

I forgot to check once and it ended with a Leica tumbling across rough concrete!

 

[BradS]

I forgot to check once and it ended with a Leica tumbling across rough concrete!

Ouch! that's gotta hurt. Mine was only a Nikon. Of course, it landed front of lens first destoying a 28mm f/2.8 AIS Nikkor...my son was there, heard the resultant stream of foul language and has never let me forget it.

 

[DannL.]

Don't set up your 8x10 camera and tripod between a herd of longhorns and their watering hole.