The elitist print exchange?

[df cardwell]

Spotting hint: use a 1000w lamp in the room. Improves MTF of the eye.

Spotting hint: really fine brushes don't make fine points.

 

[Ole]

Spotting hint: Use a bigger film. A dust spot the size of a grain of dust is acceptable, enlared to the size of a pea it's not...

Spotting question: Does anyone know of a spotting ink/paint/pigment that matches the reflectivity of a FB print? Well-spotted prints are ugly in the wrong lighting...

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Spotting hint--Well selected, well trained Richeson Miniature Series brushes make fine points.

 

[Nige]

Spotting Hint 1 - Turn the print upside down, stops you looking at the picture and concentrate on the tones.

Spotting Hint 2 - Don't over-do it. Creep up to invisability. Knocking the 'white' off a spot is usually enough to hide it from a resonable viewing distance (i.e. hand held). Over spotted 'donuts' stand out like the proverbial dogs bollocks!

 

[donbga]

Spotting hint: Use a bigger film. A dust spot the size of a grain of dust is acceptable, enlared to the size of a pea it's not...

Spotting question: Does anyone know of a spotting ink/paint/pigment that matches the reflectivity of a FB print? Well-spotted prints are ugly in the wrong lighting...

Spot Tone. Works for me and many others for decades.

Don Bryant

 

[df cardwell]

Spotting hint: Use a bigger film. A dust spot the size of a grain of dust is acceptable, enlared to the size of a pea it's not...

Spotting question: Does anyone know of a spotting ink/paint/pigment that matches the reflectivity of a FB print? Well-spotted prints are ugly in the wrong lighting...

Spot Tone is fine. I prefer working from dried solution in a dish. Distilled water. Use test prints to match the tone. The reflectivity is fine. Add gum arabic if you need more gloss. Old timers ( like the previous owners of Ole's cameras ) started with india ink and gum.

The 'dot' ought to disappear.

 

[donbga]

So far that's what they're doing. They are the ones not participating and when I asked them why? This 'quality' thing was the answer I got. There are many, many more than what the poll is indicating so far. It's the reason for me starting this thread.

Regards, Art.

So how about a large print exchange? Minimum size would be 11x14 up to a maximum of 20x24.

Maybe that would incentivize people to create a high quality print since it would cost more to make.

Don Bryant

 

[donbga]

So how about a large print exchange? Minimum size would be 11x14 up to a maximum of 20x24.

Maybe that would incentivize people to create a high quality print since it would cost more to make.

Don Bryant

Replying to my own post ...

What about a mini-portfolio exchange. 5 or more prints required.

Just a thought.

Don Bryant

 

[Ole]

Minimum size would be 11x14 up to a maximum of 20x24.

Or a big film exchange. Minimum negative size 8x10"?

Or - a "Historical camera" exchange? Camera and lens to be made before 1906, technique to be familiar to photographers of that time?

 

[Bob F.]

My understanding is that the exchanges are a community event, to be entered in to in a spirit of mutual respect and good fellowship (sorry if I'm beginning to sound like a Victorian clergyman)...

I was not aware that the idea was to amass a quantity of "good" prints. If someone feels their work is too good for the general membership then by all means that can start their own "by invitation" group, but I can't help but feel they would be missing the whole point of the exercise.

Cheers, Bob.


P.S. What Dave said too....

 

[papagene]

I voted no! because I participate for the fun of giving and receiving. As far as print quality is concerned, I send only prints I am satisfied with, that I would choose to hang on a wall. No seconds or unfinished prints.
Concerning matting/mounting the prints... I can't afford that. I have two or three prints waiting to be matted for a soon to be group show and I am going to have to scramble to afford the materials. So when I participate in an exchange I state up front that I would prefer UN-mounted/matted prints in return. And some day I will be able to afford to matt the growing pile of exchange prints.
The idea of an Elitist Print Exchange just seems to rub me the wrong way.

gene

 

[donbga]

Or a big film exchange. Minimum negative size 8x10"?

Or - a "Historical camera" exchange? Camera and lens to be made before 1906, technique to be familiar to photographers of that time?

Ole,

The intent of my post was not meant to suggest just another exchange but rather create a venue or context to motivate people to produce their very best work.

Personally I think that producing a coherent small portfoilio would be very challenging and may spur people to invest more time than merely the time required to work in their darkroom.

Just my thoughts,

Don Bryant

 

[ggriffi]

This should be treated like any 'gift' giving -- have a desire to give and be grateful about what you receive.

I agree with that. I will be in the "other" print exchange and it will be my first. I know that some of skillls lack but from what I have seen and read that's what it is all about.

g

 

[Gay Larson]

Well I hardly know what to say. I've particiapated in two exchanges with APUG groups and each time it was a great experience. I tried my very best to send the best fiber based prints I could make. I received a lot of very nice prints that I am proud to hang in my home and a few that I thought could have used more work but it was fun waiting for the mail to see what I would get. And it was fun waiting to hear what people thought of the prints I sent out. I would hate to think we would discourage new members from participating and having the opportunity to enjoy such a fun experience. I did like it better when it was broken into a small manageable group of 4 or 5 people exchanging. I urge you not to make it difficult for new members or make it intimidating. Just don't particiapate if you think your work is so far above the rest of us. What a shame though.

 

[gr82bart]

I am still learning the art/craft of enlarging. I only just consider myself able enough to make postcards.

This is typical of the other side of the coin. People are way too hard on themselves.

So in the past round of exchanges, many APUGers will remember my PM encouraging them to particpate in the any of the print exchanges. I did this by going to the galleries and asking people whose galleries I thought had some merit (Who the heck am I to judge, right? Another thread.) I did so in an effort to increase the particpation rate and I also checked out their posting frequency and particpation in general. If they looked to be active, I sent them a PM. I had plans to do this again this round, but really have no time (although one would point out this lengthy post as a rebuttal).

So discarding all the "I have no time" responses, which is understandable, the rest of the responses fell into two camps - those that weren't good enough and those that were too good.

Well, the last part is my interpretation of their response. They've particpated before and consider some of the prints they've recieved of an unacceptable standard. Remember the whole "to mount/mat or not" debate? Or the RC versus FB paper debate? I mean that alone was 50/50 - many people have certain expectations. And that's just about materials.

I have feedback on a whole raft of 'quality' issues. The printing is poor, spilled coffee, discarded prints, no real effort put into the print, etc....

I think this discourages newbies like AndyK to particpate. So how do we get newbies to particpate?

Just don't particiapate if you think your work is so far above the rest of us.

As I mentioned earlier, that's what they are doing right now. Some have participated in earlier exchanges at my encouragement, but have dropped out since due to the 'quality' issue.

I guess I wanted to get a discussion going on a couple things, besides getting more newbies and more particpation in general:

• How to get these 'master printers' to particpate - maybe in their own club? Some have said they would, although the poll reveals their shyness, if they knew the others particpating were 'in their league'. Do we even care they are particpating in a print exchange or not?
• How to get newbies access to mentors and peers in the darkroom area. I know, as a newbie, I have greatly appreciated the comments and feedback I have personally recieved in the Alternative Print Exchange. In fact the feedback has inspired me. How do get more of this access? Is this even a 'need' and is this too taxing on those whose printing skills we consider 'great'? Remember the debate around Per's free workshops? Would this just be another way to displace a professional's income?
• Do I think too much in the morning and come up with these cockamany(sp?) ideas and should just go about my day without posting on APUG until I shake my head a few times?

Discuss away....

Regards, Art.

 

[Nige]

How to get these 'master printers' to particpate - maybe in their own club? Some have said they would, although the poll reveals their shyness, if they knew the others particpating were 'in their league'. Do we even care they are particpating in a print exchange or not?

no, cause they don't care about us. why would they want to partake in a print exchange when they are no doubt selling their work?

 

[Mick Fagan]

I'm a new person to APUG, so far I've been in one blind print exchange, and have just sent out some postcards for the current round of postcard exchange.

In the blind print exchange, I sent a colour 12x16" print to the UK inside a tube, I received a B&W print from Canada.

I was pleasantly surprised with the Canadian print, it was small, unmounted, but packed inbetween light card. it is stuck up on my darkroom wall along with my better pictures, not hidden. The small letter that arrived with it, is stuck to the back of the print.

I haven't as yet received any postcard pictures, but I have no doubt in the ensuing weeks, they will start coming in.

I don't expect a miracle print to walk through the door, I make my expectations realistic.

Most members are either well established people with busy lives, youngish with frenetic lives, middle of the road with children and mortgages, or, retired with time but not too much moolah to spread around. In short the whole spectrum of normal people with photography as a hobby.

Hobbies wax and wane and should never be something that has to be done. Hobbies should be done at a pace and style that suits each individual, if that allows one to participate in the odd print exchange, or two, fine. If not that's fine too!

Looking through the galleries gives one a hint of what is being done, but isn't a real indication. Many people, myself included, don't own a film scanner, quite a lot of people seem to have access to a print scanner.These scanners and their software are like the members, diverse. I do not really have the equipment, or time, to get decent scans of any of my prints.

My hobby is photography, I use film, I make prints, I give away prints, I sometimes get prints given to me.

I made up my mind to participate in the odd print exchange or two, when the time and my desire permits.

Mick.

 

[simulatordan]

I've tried to get into the current Print exchange - the closing dat is 15th March as I understand it.

I am however waiting for a reply. I am about to embark on the latest postcard round organised by 'Nige' whose patience in sorting out email problems at my end were very helpful. I do n.ot expect to produce fantastic prints, partly because I am still finding my way and also because I hope to learn from those of you who are further along the road.

I hope that these events do not become restricted to a mutual back slaping contest between those who feel they have nothing to learn.

Best regards Daniel

 

[FrankB]

I voted, 'No.'

I haven't participated in the exchanges to date, but am hoping to participate in the next one.

With my tongue firmly out of my cheek (for once), I think Dave, BobF and MrCallow have said everything that I would have.

 

[Max Power]

As one of the individuals who wouldn't even be invited to participate, I feel that I ought to chime in.

The last print exchange I participated in was a lot of work for me; and I enjoyed it thoroughly. I agonised for weeks over what print I would send out, and then I played with the print numerous times in the darkroom before I had something I would be pleased to put my name to. Not because I make stellar prints or anything, but because I put in my best effort. For the first time, I wasn't just making a print for myself, but was actually 'forced' into a situation where others would judge my work.

Then there were the constructive comments. Papagene even took the time to drop me a note to tell me how much he enjoyed the print and that I ought not be afraid to take the plunge and try FB paper next time. Well, thanks to him, I have tried FB paper and will use it in the next print exchange. I also received some gorgeous prints, which allowed me to see what photographers with a great deal of talent are doing.

All in all, being able to participate in a print exchange with photographers who are far and away superior to me allowed me to learn something; for that I'm very grateful for the print exchange as it is.

Cheers,
Kent